 Poster: A snowHead
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In my hunt for somewhere to stay over new year ( 28th dec - 4th jan ) i've found an available apartment that looks very nice and in a half decent location, my question is what are peoples opinions on chamonix ? never been myself and have read a few things about hour long lift queues and out dated lifts, also being early in the season what are snow conditions likely to be like ?. Any opinions people can give will be a great help before i commit myself and suffer the wrath of my good lady if it turns out to be cr-p !!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Jase380 we've been to Chamonix for the past 4 years, with 2 boys now aged 13 and 10. we did go for a weekend before xmas 2 years ago and the snow was great with all of the slopes open.
We enjoy the varied skiiing around Le Tour, Brevent, Les Grands Montents etc but only being intermediates can't advise on the more technical slopes or off piste. The town itself has a great selection of bars, cafes etc but they aren't cheap in terms of beers and food but all thoroughly enjoyable.
This year we went at half term and the slopes weren't too busy, lift queues no more than a few minutes at worst. Great place to visit Courmayer just through the Mont Blanc tunnel for a day if you fancy something different.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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jase380, what you read is true. There was one day I didn't ski until 11, what with trekking to bus stn, wait for bus, 20 mins to grands montets, 20 min wait for first slow cable car, then 40 min wait for next slow cable car to top, quick whiz, then down 200-and-something steps (I kid you not). There is none of this walking across the road and clicking your skis on at 845. The day I skied Vallee Blanche, it was my last day, was down by 130, but after waiting forever for a bus that never came before walking 15 minutes in my skiboots back to town I just gave up as I would have had to skip lunch to get just one more hour of skiing (I would have needed another bus to bring me to Brevent)
Having said that its a fantastic place so I actually do recommend you go. Just go with appropriate expectations.
PS if you really want to do Vallee Blanche, it probably won't be open for you at Christmas as there's usually not enough snow cover that early
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patricksh, what Chamonix were you staying in?
My typical day is a 2 minute walk to the new fast Brevent bubble, and a beer at the little bar at the bottom on the way home.
Grands Montets? Why wait for the cable car (admittedly, can be quite a long line), take the chair. Simples. Top cable car requires reservation anyway. Which is only fair enough.
200 steps down? Where on earth were you?
Chamonix has recently added a whole load more buses in recent seasons plus minibuses around town, so if you are unlucky enough to book somewhere that isn't an easy walk from skiing, it's relatively easy to navigate.
From the Vallee Blanche, your easiest descent is typically by train, which is timetabled. I am wondering where you got to?.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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jase380, I've been to Cham over Christmas/New Year's for the past five years. Have never experienced hour-long queues for the lifts. The longest I've queued was about 40 minutes (if memory serves) on a Saturday for one particular cable car when the FWT was on (mid-Jan) and everyone was trying to get to the event at the same time.
patricksh has provided an example of a poorly-planned day, in my opinion. With a small amount of planning, it can be smooth and easy with very little waiting.
The buses are very frequent and timetabled. And they are more reliable and on time than any kind of train or bus transport I've experienced in 15 years of living in London. I do recommend avoiding the first few and last few buses of the day, though, as they are usually rammed during peak weeks. Unless you don't mind travelling like a jostled sardine, that is. Download the bus routes and timetables before your trip, you can't go wrong if you use that info and read the destination that is clearly marked on the front of each bus.
The bottom cable car at Grands Montets is easily circumvented by taking the chair, which is quicker and gives a few short warm up runs while skiing to the top cable car. Queues at the top cable car can be entirely avoided by making a reservation (same with the Aiguille du Midi cable car).
During peak times in peak weeks, the long queues for the Flegere cable car are easily avoided by uploading at Brevent and skiing across to Flegere.
There are a few rickety old chair lifts scattered about the various mountains but they are very well maintained and when last did you read/hear of a Chamonix chairlift failing?
Snow cover during the period you mentioned is usually good on piste as well as off piste but it may be a little too early in the season for the off piste to be entirely stable – you'd need to know your stuff to be safe.
The biggest question is, where is your apartment located?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Thanks for all your replies so far, seems as though with a bit of planning things can go smoothly enough. Zero-G from what i can make out the apartment is in Chamonix sud next to " place edmond dessailloud " at the opposite side of the Avenue de courmayeur to the Chamonix main bus stop. We will de driving down from Zeebrugge so will have the car to use if needed, although I would rather leave it parked to make the most of the apres ski bars !!
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jase380, I had the same dilemma as you a few season ago... I had been to Chamonix several times in the summer, climbing, but never taken friends snowboarding there, as I was always concerned about the setup in Chamonix (with it not being a typical ski resort)... I needn't have worried though... But like you said, a little more planning than normal is in order...
We had a pick up to drive around in, which made it so much easier, so I cant comment on the bus system... I don't know, but I don't think I could be be bothered with relying on the bus system...
Anyway, based just over the crossing from the train station, we had a 5 min walk to the centre of Chamonix and there is always loads to do, drink and eat (avoid the restaurants in the central square) as they are a rip off). We decided that we were happy to drive around to make the most of our trip... We did 1 day each at Les Houches/Brevent-flegere/Le Tour-Grands Montets/Courmayer/St Gervais/Les Contamines... All of which are within 35 mins drive of Cham centre... (some obviously on your doorstep)...
Had a great time esp. as we went in half term and Chamonix tends not to attract as many young families as other resorts do... The terrain is more difficult than some resorts and is IMO limited, if you're going to stick to piste riding... Chamonix is of course renown for it's off piste... Which is probably the only way I would go back... to ride more off piste and get a guide...
If you've never been then go... You will have a great time... and make your own mind up...
PS. We never had massive queues when we were there...
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under a new name, was staying next to Aiguille Midi and had to walk to Chamonix Sud every day. It is full 20 mins to GMs and 30 to le Tour or les Houches as you know. There is not enough in Brevent to keep you going for the week.
Yes I did twig the trick of walking up the hill to the chairlift at Grand Montets and saving 20 mins.
Yes I did count the steps getting off top cable car. It is over 200, I think around 220. A long way carrying your skis. You can only reserve a time on that cable car once.
Actually we skied all the way down from VB into Chamonix but gave up waiting for bus across the road from the car park after a half hour.
Don't get me wrong, I would go back in morning, but you definitely spend a lot less time on skis than ski-in/out well connected resorts.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Zero-G, if I was going back next week and wanted to be better organized to get more skiing in, I would rent a car for the week.
Personally I prefer never having to take a bus. In practice you will be taking them at rush hour 90% of the time (did mention I don't think I ever got a seat on the bus)
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| jase380 wrote: |
| Thanks for all your replies so far, seems as though with a bit of planning things can go smoothly enough. Zero-G from what i can make out the apartment is in Chamonix sud next to " place edmond dessailloud " at the opposite side of the Avenue de courmayeur to the Chamonix main bus stop. We will de driving down from Zeebrugge so will have the car to use if needed, although I would rather leave it parked to make the most of the apres ski bars !! |
Ah, you will be fine! That's well located and around the corner from me.
My apartment is opposite the Aiguille du Midi lift station. It takes me about a minute (perhaps two at the most!) to walk to the Cham Sud bus stop. And 10 seconds to walk to the Midi lift station. It's about 5 minutes to walk into the main section of town where the majority of bars and restaurants are, although there are a few of those in Cham Sud itself.
You can download a PDF of all the Cham bus routes and times for this winter season from http://www.chamonix-bus.com. I have this on my phone and can time my descents down the mountain so that I clip out of my skis and walk on the bus – feeling terribly smug with myself, of course 
| patricksh wrote: |
Zero-G, if I was going back next week and wanted to be better organized to get more skiing in, I would rent a car for the week.
Personally I prefer never having to take a bus. In practice you will be taking them at rush hour 90% of the time (did mention I don't think I ever got a seat on the bus) |
Funny how different our experiences are. I always get a seat (and I do take the first and last buses on many days).
I seriously considered bringing a car with me this season (so that I wouldn't have to worry about baggage allowance and also to make day trips to Verbier and Courmayeur more flexible) but I don't like the thought of adding to the pollution here when the buses are so good. There are definitely times when I get fed up with the crowds but then I just look out the window at the mountains and remind myself that I'm not sitting at my desk and everything feels ok again.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Zero-G, I do agree that Cham is a great place, but I think you are just a die-hard enthusiast who can only see all things Chamonix "en rose". I think 98% of people who love Chamonix will admit the geography, buses, antiquated cable-cars etc are a drawback
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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patricksh, far from it. I have many pet hates about Chamonix (don't get me started on the dog poo-poo everywhere, the absolutely shocking mountain toilets and the overpriced low quality mountain restaurants) but my point is that perceptions differ between people. Perhaps because I'm accustomed to the daily use of public transport in London, I don't find using Cham's public transport particularly trying.
As for antiquated cable cars, I have to disagree. They have some antiquated chairlifts, yes, but there is nothing wrong with the cable cars, all of which are feats of engineering considering just how big the mountains are compared to a anywhere else that uses cable cars.
The piste are limited but then Chamonix isn't about the pistes, is it.
But you are right about one thing, people either love Cham or never return. I don't have a stake in this town, so don't care either way but a balanced view is always good to have.
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Ok Zero-G, I am understanding you now.
And for record, I too love Chamonix. It is kind of place I would go every 2nd year. The Mountain-guiding in particular is in class of its own.
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You know it makes sense.
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All your comments have been a great help, it's good to hear the different opinions people have and has made our choice a lot easier. I don't think cham will be the place for my wife as she much prefers ski in / out piste skiing, the plus side is it's made my mind up that cham will be the place to go for me and a few mates in late Jan as we all like to get off the beaten track and as patricksh says the Mountain guides do seem to have a very good reputation. Thanks again for the invaluable advice.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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jase380, so a good result all round then!
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Poster: A snowHead
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jase380, I think most or all of mountain guides in France will have done at least part of their training in Chamonix (I am open to correction). Thus it is not only home of mountain guiding, but most mountain guides who are not even based in Chamonix know the terrain well. Hard to go wrong! (I think something like 400 of 1500 total mountain guides in France are based in Chamonix!)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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jase380, so a good result all round then!
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Zero-G , i was thinking that but didn't want to say it out loud !! roll on January.
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