 Poster: A snowHead
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Just showed the prices of a 2 hour private lesson to my husband and he thinks I haven't done my research properly! Can't believe it's 174 euros for a 2-hour session (quite a bit of which is likely to be spent on a chairlift!) Is this par for the course, or is there a cheaper option that's available? Are group lessons worth it - they're 70 euros per person but that's still a bit of a waste if all you're doing is snaking down a mountain with an instructor and 20 other people. Advice welcome please!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Please can somebody answer this as I have had that exact same conversation with my hubby. I was hoping to have a 1 or 2 hr private lesson at the beginning of my week in St Anton.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Me too - I can't share with my hubby as a) he snowboards and I ski and b) he's a lot better than me! I'm not quite up to leaping blithely off the piste into waist-deep powder just yet...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Thanks - might just have to go without then!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Can't believe it's 174 euros for a 2-hour session
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 People keep telling us austria is so much cheaper than France. €45 an hour for 1 - 5 people with the local ski school in Val D'Isere (to compare like with like - less in small resorts, €62 - 88 for two hours in my neck of the woods).
However, I'm sure there wouldn't be 20 people in a group lesson, and for €70 that sounds good value.
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When I last had group lessons in Austria, intermediate level, they were excellent.
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I put a post up a while back asking how good they were in group lessons in St Anton as my last group lesson 3 half days the last half day we 6 out of the group of 7 got absolutely no instruction due to a lady that had been moved up into our group bt could barely ski so where we started with a group where I would say we were all around the same level this poor woman was moved into our group on the second day, and clearly was struggling with the technique work. Then day 3 he took us up the run we had done as a warm up before the lesson and she was petrified and he spent the whole 2hr lesson trying to coax her down. I don't really care to repeat that, by all accounts she was only moved up as they had too many beginners so picked on somebody with better technique to move them up.
However the advice I was given was to go for a private lesson.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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NickyJ, that's so awful. Ski schools really shouldn't do that - you should have complained and got your money back. I've only had two experiences of group lessons in austria (neither in St Anton which has never appealed to me) and both were very good, but maybe I was lucky. I've had more varied experience in France - excellent group lessons in La Plagne with ESF and rather indifferent ones here, again due to people not able to ski a red run being allowed to join the top group. They slowed the group down and stopped us doing some great unpisted red runs which I really wanted to do with an instructor, but not as bad as you describe. It was a sociable week and good for my French, but it did very little for my skiing. I've had private lessons since, but at €62 for two hours, pretty affordable, and I can pick my instructor.
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That was the first ski school I had done as an adult (did quite a lot as a child), it was in Selva and part of the point of my post was to try and find out if my experience was typical or not. At the time I didn't get a flood of replies saying my experience was unusual. I did get a lot out of the technique work - my previous lessons were from 1987 - 1995 so quite a lot had changed so I don't regret taking them but I would like to gain the confidence now to tackle blacks and less than ideal conditions (especially icy conditions). I am sure half of it is phsycological which is why I think a private lesson Would do wonders.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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NickyJ, My own experience is that the best bet for making solid progress is a whole week of ski clinics, or at least several days, not just the odd lesson. There are a range of outfits who do that (and this week I would have been on Charlotte Swift's introduction to off piste week if I'd not been injured).
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| pam w wrote: |
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Can't believe it's 174 euros for a 2-hour session
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People keep telling us austria is so much cheaper than France. €45 an hour for 1 - 5 people with the local ski school in Val D'Isere (to compare like with like - less in small resorts, €62 - 88 for two hours in my neck of the woods).
However, I'm sure there wouldn't be 20 people in a group lesson, and for €70 that sounds good value. |
St Anton's different to the rest of Austria (Ischgl too, both considerably more expensive), ski hire/lessons are expensive (lessons will likely change, it's only been the last few seasons that other ski schools have been 'permitted' to operate, don't know how well they've done though). Food and drink still reasonably priced (ish) - you won't pay more than €5 for a beer (happy hour much less), can get a very good meal for €10 in most mountain restaurants... Still at the expensive end for Austria though.
I've only skied once in France, in the PdS, food and drink seemed maybe a touch more expensive than Anton (definitely more than Saalbach/etc), though in the same sort of range.
Is that €45 per person, or €45 total for a group of 5? That would be very very good!
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You know it makes sense.
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€45 an hour for 1 - 5 people. That's ESF. People keep saying French instructors are the highest paid in the world but never provide much in the way of evidence. The Brit instructors in France seem to get paid a lot more (or at any rate, their schools charge a lot more). the prices I quoted in my resort (€62 for two hours in low season) is only up to 3 people, extras are extra €10 an hour.
Val D'Isere is a more reasonable comparison with St Anton.
But €70 for a week of group lessons is good - it's just those private lessons in St Anton which are a horrendous price.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Those are pretty damn good prices though! Is the ESF a co-op sort of thing? A lot of the money in Austria goes to the school rather than the instructor (at least at the lowly level of teaching I've done), though I guess accomm/lift pass/insurance/etc eats up quite a lot of it. When I taught in St Anton, salary was €1300 a month, assuming you worked 4-5 hours a day 6 days a week all month (wasn't common, at least that season), but (relatively nice) accommodation was provided for €90 a month.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Is the ESF a co-op sort of thing?
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yes, I think it is, though I have no real idea and it would be interesting to learn more. Our local ESI (which is the one I use) is run on co-operative lines and apparently more democratic - one of the instructors there told me that in ESF the youngsters always get the most boring work. Lessons are v expensive in North america but apparently the instructors there only see a small proportion of what the customers pay.
I think we had this discussion before? The instructors I've talked to here seem to be family people with other jobs in the summer (e.g. one is a motorcycle instructor, one is a builder, one is a farmer's wife). Those three have all been working for the same ski school for the last ten years to my certain knowledge; possibly much longer. I think they have some young "stagiaires" but I've never used, or met, any of them. I don't get the impression they get provided with sort of "seasonnaire" accommodation and I don't get the impression that they are particularly well off, either.
There are just the two schools in our village and they have to stay competitive - if either of them put their prices up much, people would go to the other. You could call it a cartel, but cartels are about keeping prices up, and they are very reasonable. Outside peak weeks groups are often smaller than the maximum size (which is 10 in the ESI) and it's hard to see how they could make any money if they charged less. they have modest offices, and receptionists, but overheads are presumably quite low.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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somebody in another recent thread about ski instructor income said they could live all year on what they made teaching in the winter (?Japan). I don't think the French instructors round here could do that. They all seem to work all year round.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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It's 70 euros per two hour group lesson in St Anton - a week of group lessons is 250 euros. I'd be tempted by that but, like Nicky, my husband would have nobody to board with then as we're not going in a group.
Most of the ski instructors (French and English) I've been taught by in the past have summer jobs, either mountain guiding or diving somewhere hot. I learnt with ESF (in Morzine) as an adult in group lessons and my instructor was FANTASTIC. One of the best teachers ever. He was so good though that by the end of the week the group had doubled in size as everyone wanted to transfer into his group!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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1 on 1 Private lessons are expensive anywhere.
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no they're not, as we've established.
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It's 70 euros per two hour group lesson in St Anton
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Oh, I'd not read that carefully enough - I thought that was for a week, which is why I thought it was such good value. A week's group lessons here is €80, around €100 in peak weeks.
Obviously St Anton has masses of fantastic terrain for advanced skiers, and very lively apres ski. People clearly have great holidays there - but they don't go for good value ski instruction. 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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174 euros is on the pricier side, that's for sure, though not untypical. I worked in Meribel last year and that's pretty much around the standard price (we used three different instruction companies and there wasn't a huge variance). ESF can work out a fair bit cheaper (for example in Les Arcs its 40 euros per hour, so less than half that price).
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Well if anyone is in St Anton for week of 17th March and would like to share a few lessons with an intermediate skier (fine on reds, can do easier looking blacks) then give me a shout!
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Same from me for the 15th or 16th April if anybody there would like to create a small group for a private lesson, can you send me a PM.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Are you an instructor in St Anton by any chance Stanton? Those are banker prices!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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