 Poster: A snowHead
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I need your help.
At the end of today i have to tell 2 people they have jobs as trainee bootfitters, however i have 3 shortlisted.
How can you help, well here are their profiles.
1, Frenchie(22). He has worked for me fo 2 seasons as bootdoctor. This means he does all the modifications and fine tuning. I trust him, he works hard and is very precise, he is friendly and he knows our business. He is looking for a job for life. However, he is not a passionate skier and i don't know whether he can control the conversation and make the sale in good time. He speaks very little english.
2, Dutchbloke(30). He is a very good skier and has lived in Chamonix for 5 years. He knows alot of people and has managed a business here for the most part. He speaks; dutch, english and french. However, he is very chilled out, not very dynamic and has just last year, started skiing in boots that fit. He is my friend, and will need alot of training. He will leave Chamonix at the end of the winter.
3, Englishkid(18. He has skied a bit (6weeks) and loves it. When i speak with him, he controls the conversation. He is dynamic, highly motivated and keen to learn. He wants the job so bad. He rings me weekly to querey specifications of certain boots. I can get him trained before he starts here in December. However, he is young, will need intregrating and a lot of nurturing to keep him confident. I'm a tyrant to work for and don't suffer fools gladly.
Help, who would you by boots from?
I once read that Schummacher's chief mechanic, has no driving licence. 
I should, too, mention i have 4 other experienced guys working already.
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Tue 18-10-05 12:49; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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... well, if he's the chief mechanic of a shoe-maker, why would he need a driving licence?
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| I'm a tyrant to work for and don't suffer fools gladly. |
You've come to the right place, then! I would definitely employ the Dutchman. The Dutch have a long history of fine workmanship with wooden shoes.
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Tue 18-10-05 10:52; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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That's easy!
Not the Dutch bloke. Why? Because:
1. He is your friend and therefore you will find it difficult to shout at him.
2. He is neither passionate nor a skier nor does he value well-fitting boots.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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1 & 3. In the Uk you would have to record why you didnt give 2 the job, just in case he sues you for discrimination.
i would reject 2 because:
a)
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| I'm a tyrant to work for |
b)
c)
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| He will leave Chamonix at the end of the winter |
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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P.S. On second thoughts, employ anyone but the Dutchman. He's your friend, and you should never mix friendship with tyranny.
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, sounds like you definately need Frenchie, so it's a toss up between the kid and the bloke, having trained people before I'd rather have the keen to learn chap over the laid back chap, but I always worry about the reliability of youngsters, tough call, maybe it would be easiest to just toss a coin to decide
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I would buy my boots from number 2. His new found sensations from boots that fit will surely enable him to impress on clients how important this piece of equipment will be to them. Also, IMO, I prefer retailers to be a bit less up front, and in your face - this is how I have interpreted 'dynamic' - apologies if incorrect.
Does number 3 speak any French ? If so, he would be my second choice. There are few substitutes for sheer enthusiasm, and it sounds as if you you may be able to channel this to help him with his weaknesses.
Also, 2 and 3 sound like a good combination together.
The reason for not choosing number 1 is his lack of passion for skiing. Clearly he sounds like an expert when it comes to fitting a boot - but I believe that people who do a job just because it is a job, don't always perform to the best of their abilities. If you enjoy it as well, it makes a big difference.
Interesting quandary, let us know how you get on.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Am wary about giving advice on this, but, I would on that evidence opt for 1 &3. Language in the shop would not be a problem and 1 could teach 3 more in a season and take some element of pressure of training off your back.
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This is soooooo, helpfull. Keep it up. It's looking like i'm going to be living with a couple of kids(sleepless nights) and pissing off a good friend.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Open a Chamonix Clog Shop and make him the CEO.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Personally if #1 can do a good job I would keep him - is he at least a passionate boot fitter? As a customer I would prefer to be served by a passionate and precise boot fitter than a passionate skier.
Not #2 cause you don't mix mates and business!
BTW, how many hours a week does #3 think he is going to get off to ski? When I normally want a job it is for what I can get out of it - package, training, job satisfaction etc. Clearly #3 has no experience of doing this job yet, so it cannot be job satisfaction and must be to be in Chamonix skiing  . Will he be in in time, slipping out to ski, reliable etc?
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1 & 3 for me as well.
1 - he is French and Chamonix is in France (something most of you English care to forget). He'll pick up whatever English he needs - and how sad that poor english has to be seen as a shortcoming in France!
3 - a passion for the job coupled with eagerness and total love of the sport - what more do you want!? surely you already know he's not a fool?
Your mate the Dutchie I wouldn't bother with as you'll both end up out on the wee wee together and neither of you will make it in to open up next day. He'll be too interested in hanging out and not getting stuck into the work. Personally I don't like going into these equipment shops where all the staff are mates hanging out looking cool and making the rest of us feel intimidated and less than worthy!
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You know it makes sense.
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| SMALLZOOKEEPER wrote: |
| looks like I'm going to be ... pissing off a good friend. |
Buy him a beer and explain - he'll be fine! it's a business not a social club.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, By the way, you wouldn't happen to have any bootfitting jobs going would you? I'm on the lookout for a career change ..... 
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Poster: A snowHead
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COME ON! You could change someones life here! Go on, make a difference. 151 of you have viewed this post with only 14 posting replies.
I Need some help. They might be selling you boots this winter!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I will do it for half the wage that they arrange with yourself!!!!!! I know my left from my right and that it is advisable that you put your foot in from the top of a shoe. What do you think to my CV?!?!?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, Is there absolutley no chance of 3 employees...if the business could stand it? 1 is a given...you know and trust him - essential for any employee. 3 sounds good...but he's only young, he may not stay the course. 2 is a mate but also knows lots of people in the town, word of mouth is one of the best ways of getting business but, as he's leaving at the end of the season, you need to train up no 3 so that he's ready and raring to go next year! Employ them all if at all possible!! If not I'd go with 1 & 2 - you never know when you'll need a really good friend, hold on to any that you've got!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| homphomp wrote: |
| SMALLZOOKEEPER, Is there absolutley no chance of 3 employees...if the business could stand it? 1 is a given...you know and trust him - essential for any employee. 3 sounds good...but he's only young, he may not stay the course. 2 is a mate but also knows lots of people in the town, word of mouth is one of the best ways of getting business but, as he's leaving at the end of the season, you need to train up no 3 so that he's ready and raring to go next year! Employ them all if at all possible!! If not I'd go with 1 & 2 - you never know when you'll need a really good friend, hold on to any that you've got! |
It's a VERY SMALL ZOO, but we feed alot of animals!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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My first reaction was 1 & 3 and reading the other posts here they really echo my thoughts.
Its very difficult to employ a friend due to possible conflicts if there are problems with his performance and if he is leaving end of the winter you should consider the others if your thinking of the future.
A bit of encouragement with number one might persuade him to improve his English if thats important for you business.
Hopefully the young lad could be someone for the future if you can get him to stay (money/conditions). You don't mention if he speaks another language which again might be important.
Not an easy decission but I still think 1 & 3.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Again I think 1 & 3 will help each other. One is stronger technically with regards to the product. They will both be able to help each other get stronger with any language barriers. If not this season then next season they could be a very stong partnership for you in the shop with both excelling in their so far weakness areas.
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Bah! The free weekends in Amsterdam fading fast!
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SMALLZOOKEEPER,
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The free weekends in Amsterdam fading fast!
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Consider them gone.....1 and 3! But get 1 an english phrase book and 3 a french one.... and make them go drinking together!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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1&3.
No particular reason, just following the herd 
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At first sight I would say 1) and 3) as well, for similar reasons as everyone else. I was going to ask whether you had any other staff, but I see you've now added that to your initial post. Only caveats would be:
a) Frenchie wants a job for life. Do you want to make a long term hire (even if not life), or are you only looking for a season. If the latter, his desire for long term work won't be a benefit to you.
b) How do they get on with each other and the rest of the staff. As you're a self-confessed tyrant ( ) there will be days when they hate your guts - so will need to look to each other for support/reassurance. With a fair number of staff around him my reservations about Englishkid's inexperience/youth under your regime fade away.
c) I was a little worried about the ski-experience level provided by the 1+3 combo, in their ability to relate to any good skiers (5+ on your scale) you get as customers. I assume you and/or some of your other staff are able to make that relationship. If so, the fact that Dutchman is a good skier himself isn't a particular advantage.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Mr Manda runs a VERY SMALL BUSINESS and he's a tyrant to work for and don't suffer fools gladly. We know very well your concerns about hiring/firing.
Rule 1. Never employ friends unless a) they're otherwise well suited for the job (i.e. can do it probably better than you can without training), and b) you know your friendship can withstand you firing him.
Rule 2. In a toss up between maturity and a vague interest in the product c.f. youth and a enthusiasm for the product, chose the youth. Maturity can be easily learned (or. at least it can be easily knocked into the youngster) but it's damn hard to force someone feel passionate about something they're not already that interested in.
IMHO, ditch the Frenchie. Keep the Dutchie. Keep the English kid.
Firstly, the Dutchie can be encouraged to learn to love boot fitting. Secondly (and probably more importantly) he's got the where-withall to improve your business. But don't take him on unless you both know you'll be able to talk again in the unlikely but possible event that you have to fire him.
The Frenchie, however, is not showing particular interest in boot fitting, or improving your business, despite knowing the trade and having worked for you already for 2 seasons.....
The kid is English, a kid, keen on boots, and keen to work - which makes him a 1 in a million find!!!! Snap him up before he gets sick of waiting for you!!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I'm harsh but fair, tyrant may have been a little strong. The Zoo has a real good vibe, the problems arise from it's size, business and the popularity of bootfitting as a spectator sport. Some times it can take a good half an hour to walk from one side of the room to the other. This, boils my kettle.
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You must have a very slow zimmer frame. Maybe time for an upgrade.
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You know it makes sense.
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Ik denk werkelijk u Engelse lad en de kikker moet aanwenden, is het tewerkstellen van een vriend een recept voor ramp en het klinkt dat hij werkelijk niet de Baan wil. Ander geluid twee alsof zij elkaar zouden complimenteren aangezien zij schijnen om verschillende attributen te hebben.
Nog wat weet ik?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Slowplough wrote: |
Ik denk werkelijk u Engelse lad en de kikker moet aanwenden, is het tewerkstellen van een vriend een recept voor ramp en het klinkt dat hij werkelijk niet de Baan wil. Ander geluid twee alsof zij elkaar zouden complimenteren aangezien zij schijnen om verschillende attributen te hebben.
Nog wat weet ik? |
Take your point, our Dutch client base is up 60%.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Kijkt als zelfs Nederlandse sprekers akkoord gaan met de meerderheid
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Que?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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David Goldsmith or, as the locals hereabouts say: wotzheonabout?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
Ik denk werkelijk u Engelse lad en de kikker moet aanwenden, is het tewerkstellen van een vriend een recept voor ramp en het klinkt dat hij werkelijk niet de Baan wil. Ander geluid twee alsof zij elkaar zouden complimenteren aangezien zij schijnen om verschillende attributen te hebben.
Nog wat weet ik?
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Freetranslation says Slowplough wrote "I think real you English load and the frog must apply, is the employing of a friend a recipe for disaster and it sounds that he really not the Job want. Other sound two as if they each other would compliment see they appear to have different attributes. Yet what do I know?" and "As even Dutch speakers agreement looks go with the majority".
Gotta love literal translations!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Which/Where's your shop? I may have been there last year...and had experience of 1)
3) would be important if you have lots of English customers
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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The problem of being served by 18 year old Brits, is that we now have a national stereotype that when we come across them in a shop, they normally haven't a clue about the product that they're selling.
Typically on a Saturday in Dixons as a case in point, you may as well have not bothered to ask them, but if you really wanted to find out more, you would always hunt out the most mature salesman - i.e. the 20 year old!!
Going against the flow here, but from my own perspective, I am not sure that if I came into your shop that I would feel that I had been properly dealt with if I was served by an 18 year old English guy. Maybe I am being ageist and anglophobic, but I would prefer either of the older two candidates and ideally a national of the country that I am in.
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Ray Zorro, different story though when you catch the youngster on their own patch and they're interested in the job. Spotty yoofs in Dixons I wouldn't go to for advice but spotty yoofs in a skateboard shop I would.
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Easy if you can afford it!!
1,2 & 3 so you can delegate your empire with a little overseeing and spend more time on the slopes. The English lad will probably be gone next season anyway. If he is as enthusiastic as you say give him the apprentice role for the season and get up the mountain, it may not cost you a fortune on a juniors wage. You are a long time dead so take advantage of this opportunity.
I wish I had the chance but I have to manage my empire so, do as I say and not as I do.
Have fun
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I'd be worried if I knew someone who was passionate about fitting boots but not about skiing in them 
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Help, who would you by boots from?
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Al Bundy? 
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FAQ
