 Poster: A snowHead
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Anyone have experience of these ? Looks a good lightweight and well priced system..BUT a guide last year said he had heard reports of the inflated airbag putting to much strain on the back of the wearers head in an avalanche resulting in neck/spinal injury..
I would think if there was any truth in this the product wouldve been recalled ,( and he had a more expensive ABS sysyem) but no point in surviving an avalanche and being killed by the airbag !
Also wondering how many outlets in Europe stock/refill the canisters..
Only downside (apart from it killing me  ) is that there is no provision for a camelback type water system ! sure i could fit something in.
Any recomendations for this or other makes ?
Dave.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I've got a float30 and it does take a camelback.
I'm not sure what the issue is with back strain. There's nothing specific about the BCA that could cause that as far as I can see, the srtructure that hods the airbag is quite rigid so it's not going to put any stress on your back from the gas pressure or inflation. Was his comment regarding airbags in general or specifically the BCA?
There's still limited suppliers in europe who can to canister filling. I know snowshepherd can, and I've been in touch with Dane at BCA who has been very helpful in identifying where can refill them at the moment. I'll not be taking mine to Tignes in december, but I probably will take it with me to Cham in March, where I know I can get it filled.
One thing yo bear in mind is that the current IATA regulations for airline luggage means that the BCA canister can't be taken on a flight full, it has to be empty, due to it's size. Some of the other makes are small enough that they can be carried full.
There's been rumours and rumblings about and amendment to the IATA regs early next year which would mean the BCA can be carried full as well, but so far it's just rumour.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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feef, +1 from me
scarbski, There is a bit of a war of words going on between the airbag manufactures and I think the person who said that to you more than likely was quoting things they had read or heard. But I have not seen any proper evidence or reports on any of the airbags on the market in relation to injury cased by the airbag.
The BCA is a super little bag, but as feef says the downsides are cylinder size and also as you say there is presently no water system capability, on the smaller pack size.
Also this years BCA bags are being advertised price wise without the cylinder, we do not do this as its misleading to try and make them appear cheaper than others on the market.
In terms of other airbags then at a price point the Ride 22 RAS (Removable Airbag System) is a good option if you want to save a few pennies
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Thanks for response folks,
The info regarding the Bca airbag injuries came from a long serving English off piste guide/instructer in Tignes, one of our group had the Bca system and this came out while dicussing the merits of each bag. (He had an Abs)
The injuries apparently caused when a slide puts heavy pressure on the inflated bag effectively putting leverage onto the back of the wearers head.As the Abs bag inflates to the sides this is not a problem, true or not i have no idea but looking at the Bca bag inflated it seems feasable,probably, maybe ??  .
The Bca canister is quoted as 175cc which i thought was ok for travel etc but no point in taking them empty if cant refill, i assume its just compressed air !
Prices i have seen include cylinder and free refill but i will check out Snowshepherd, I would rather pay a bit more if i get a better system thanks. D.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| scarbski wrote: |
Thanks for response folks,
The info regarding the Bca airbag injuries came from a long serving English off piste guide/instructer in Tignes, one of our group had the Bca system and this came out while dicussing the merits of each bag. (He had an Abs)
The injuries apparently caused when a slide puts heavy pressure on the inflated bag effectively putting leverage onto the back of the wearers head.As the Abs bag inflates to the sides this is not a problem, true or not i have no idea but looking at the Bca bag inflated it seems feasable,probably, maybe ?? .
The Bca canister is quoted as 175cc which i thought was ok for travel etc but no point in taking them empty if cant refill, i assume its just compressed air !
Prices i have seen include cylinder and free refill but i will check out Snowshepherd, I would rather pay a bit more if i get a better system thanks. D. |
The thing about pressure on the head is pure supposition IMHO.
I chose the BCA having looked at all the offerings on the market at the time. More than just the BCA have a bag which goes up around the back of the head.
Thinking about the issue you describe, I'm doing so from the viewpoint of an, admittedly amateur but experienced engineer (I dropped out of Mech engineering at uni to work in IT, but engineering is still very much a passion and hobby), and as someone who has also studied basic biomechanics in further education.
I think it's a non-issue. The airbag is full, but not at a high enough pressure that you couldn't compress or deform it slightly around the head. Also, the head and neck will bend forward more easily than backwards, and the risk of damage to the neck is more from sudden movements than absolute range of movement, e.g. whiplash. I'd go so far as to suggest the opposite of what he is claiming could also be true. That in the event of falling forwards, and risking having your head pushed backwards, the airbag could help prevent that and so save from injury in the opposite direction.
As with any piece of equipment, there are bound to be edge cases where it COULD cause an injury. I've seen displaced nerves in knees from people falling on their skis and cutting themselves on the edge, but noone's suggesting that we don't sharpen the edges.
With regards to the cylinder, unless they have changed it recently, the BCA cylinder is 290ml. The IATA regulations limit to 250ml for a full canister.
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scarbski, my bca 15 bag was provided with an adapter so the cylinder can be filled by paint ball places, which is where i get mine filled up. Also you can fit a small insulatd bottle in the bag for hydration with a hose etc, just the hose can't go inside a shoulder strap so is external.
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| carroz wrote: |
| scarbski, my bca 15 bag was provided with an adapter so the cylinder can be filled by paint ball places, which is where i get mine filled up. Also you can fit a small insulatd bottle in the bag for hydration with a hose etc, just the hose can't go inside a shoulder strap so is external. |
Do you get your cylinder filled in in the grand massif area or in the valley? If so would you mind sharing either here or by PM? Thanks !
Re head forces etc, it looks as if Mammut have licenced the Snowpulse system but adapted the airbag form the round the head style to behind a la BCA - with Scott also producing a licenced bag as well. I d be surprised that they would have adopted this if there was a real documented risk of greater head/ neck trauma. I think it's more likely to be perceived issue than a tested one. For me price and weight are more important - if can't afford it, or it's too heavy I m not likely to be wearing it!
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mishmash, I have a spare cylinder so have them all filled locally before going to our place in les carroz, (we drive) but i have found a paint ball place in passy that could fill, but have not approached them about it.
http://fizpaintball.com/cadre109.htm
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Looks more like a SnowPulse than a BCA imho A Guide 30 at a guess.
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