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How to be the best competition skier I can be

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
But, feck, if you really go for it and achieve? Oh my word...

(ps, I am using the instructor anaolgy as a diluted techinical analogy to competition, not mistaking the two!)
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
CH2O wrote:
If it is then i've met some very talented wasters in my time, I don't think it actually hits many of the "average joes" expectations of what Olympic Standard is.

For a recreational skier who has no racing experience whatsoever I think it's a yardstick that they can begin to get their head around. The better I get as a skier the more I realise how big the gulf is between me and someone who competes at, say, FIS level. Less experienced skiers might not have that insight yet.


Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Wed 1-08-12 20:55; edited 1 time in total
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Quote:

strength and fitness decline with age.


to a certain point! the best Iron man athletes are all late 30 to 40's Shocked
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livetoski wrote:
Quote:

strength and fitness decline with age.


to a certain point! the best Iron man athletes are all late 30 to 40's Shocked

Sure, and downhill skiers seem to do well in to their 30s. But that's a bit of a red herring IMO, as technical challenges are likely to be more significant than fitness challenges for someone who begins a racing career at an age when most are retiring from top level competition.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I admire your ambition, but I just find it a bit odd.
You may get your ego a bit deflated if your cant have a sense of humour about it.

But who is the most famous British skiier? Or perhaps the most world famous?
Not Killey but Eddie "the eagle" Edwards

If I had the same ambitions as you I'd join clubs. Go to the fridge in Hemmel every summer day or Chile do Ski bum fromHintertux to St Anton.
Tag on the back of training race teams, but above all keep smiling.

Youve got plenty of years to go to work on your ambitions.
I'm probably in the twilight years of my skiing. ...... But I love it more & more every time I get off the lift.

Hasta la pista!
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Onto more important issues, women's beach volleyball on the red button now! Toofy Grin
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Quote:

Sure, and downhill skiers seem to do well in to their 30s. But that's a bit of a red herring IMO, as technical challenges are likely to be more significant than fitness challenges for someone who begins a racing career at an age when most are retiring from top level competition.


agreed here if someone skied to a high level in their teens, and then got back to a serious level of fitness in their 30's then I think they could hack if they have the pair to handle it Shocked

but it takes some doing IMO
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
c'mon, all of us over 30 know that our asses are getting handed to us more and more often everyday. in skiing however, experience can count, and no more so than in the FWT, where the youngest astonish is will balls out daring that somehow doesn't get them killed and the experienced, Michaud et al, effortlessly "sense" the mother mountain and arrive home seemlessy (with the occasional scrape and billy goat "baaaaaaaaaaa")
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CH2O wrote:
c'mon, all of us over 30 know that our asses are getting handed to us more and more often everyday. in skiing however, experience can count,
Agree entirely. Simply pointing out that the OP doesn't have any.
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Quote:

competed in whatever discipline

or at any sport, at a decent level, for that matter. Competitive, ambitious, talented, people don't need a lot of money to compete at high level in a wide range of sports. If the OP hasn't done so, up to now, one wonders where he (she?) has been hiding that basic competitive drive and athletic talent, all this time.

Starting with a local UK ski-racing club would seem an excellent start, though it might be wise to keep a little quiet about aspiring to perform at Olympic level, at least for the first three or four Thursday evening sessions.
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Quote:

Starting with a local UK ski-racing club would seem an excellent start


enough to beat the "enthusiasm" out of anyone that, better of joining the church
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
CH2O wrote:
Quote:

Starting with a local UK ski-racing club would seem an excellent start


enough to beat the "enthusiasm" out of anyone that, better of joining the church

So what would you suggest?
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
as per my first post??? rolling eyes
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
CH2O wrote:
as per my first post??? rolling eyes


Oops Embarassed I thought that was a joke. My bad.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I've been doing other stuff with my time. Trust me I have massive amounts of competitive drive.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
rob@rar wrote:
The better I get as a skier the more I realise how big the gulf is between me and someone who competes at, say, FIS level.

Both stewart woodward and me entered several FIS races last winter, so long as you are not too embarassed about coming last there is no minimum standard required to take part.

I'm in my late 40s and don't feel that I have lost enough fitness yet to make much difference in my skiing, I also do Masters (over 30s) races and the other guys seem to only start getting a bit slower after 70. What holds me back most is lack of bottle, I'm not as willing to bash through big holes in courses as the kids.

Some clubs just concentrate on kids. I would agree with the suggestion to Montles to try a bit of race training in the autumn.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Montles, Sorry mate. But starting to race train in your late 30's you will never represent GB in Downhill at the Winter Olympics. Olympic standard even for team GB is pretty high. TJ is ranked No144 in the world and is not guarenteed his selection to the Sochi olympics in 2014 even though he is GB No1.
Give it a go though, there is a great masters racing circuit out there in Europe and North america.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
rjs wrote:
Both stewart woodward and me entered several FIS races last winter, so long as you are not too embarassed about coming last there is no minimum standard required to take part.
And all respect to you and Stewart. But the OP stated his ambition was national level representation in Olympics and/or X-Games. Id the OP wants to become a good a skier as he can be, including taking part in club, local or even FIS races as part of improving his skiing and having lots of fun I'd say good luck to him. But there is a world of difference between that ambition and what he said in his original post, especially when you consider his starting point.
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Helen glover, just won Olympic gold in rowing, took it up four years ago.

Not that I'm trying to persuade anyone. I do think racing for GB is feasible, but I'm happy to be proven wrong if I try my best and fail. However, I am very seriously going to try.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Skier cross not downhill would be my focus btw
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Montles,
Quote:

Helen glover, just won Olympic gold in rowing, took it up four years ago.
..when she was 23 and already a very good athlete. But good luck to you, why not try if that's what you want to do. (Sorry, I don't know how one becomes a skier cross champion.)
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Montles wrote:
Skier cross not downhill would be my focus btw

Talk to JJC Training, I don't know of anybody else that does skier cross training.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
op, if youre so serious about ski racing, why are you not already training with clubs in the uk? you'll soon see when 10 year old kids are smashing your times to bits and youre wedging your way through a flat un technical slow course that you need to change direction, then remeber these kids get smashed to bits from skiers that live in the alpine,
Freeride all the way,
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Montles, Good luck. I respect people with dreams and ambition.
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23 vs mid thirties, very little difference is athletic potential.

This article shoots through a lot of myths:

http://www.svl.ch/SportsAge.html

Also, how good an athlete one is already isn't massively relevant - one does not need to have trained hard in the past to train hard now.

I don't fear the 10 year olds. I am sure they will roast my times initially. But not ultimately, which is what matters.

I'm not Eddie the eagle. I don't plan on making a fool of myself, although I have respect for Eddie as ultimately he did what he wanted. However, my goal is to be world class.

Why am I not already racing with a club? Haven't had time.
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Quote:

The better I get as a skier the more I realise how big the gulf is between me and someone who competes at, say, FIS level. Less experienced skiers might not have that insight yet.

I discovered that, not from my own level of skiing Laughing but when a senior Austrian ski instructor told us that the gap between his ski level and that of a downhill racer was a lot bigger than the gap between his level (which looked completely unattainable to us) and ours.

Doesn't mean I don't want to go on improving, though.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Touch of hubris in my last post maybe. I didn't come here to argue with you guys. You don't get points for winning fights on the internet. I understand your scepticism.
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Ambition is to be admired, even when it looks to be for an unobtainable goal. I think the age situation will probably come into play in a significant way, not necessarily because you can't be super fit in your 40s, but because when you get injured (which you will) receovery will be slower and less likely to return you to 100% than when you were 18. I think the latest research suggests that the body's ability to fix ligaments and to produce colagen reduces very significantly from about age 23 and, let's face it, you're not going to avoid injury if you're training and racing full time.

I think the FWT qualifiers would be something which could help you to achieve part of your goal (become a world class athlete) and is a form of competition that might favour the mental maturity and possibly increased decision-making capabilities which you might have at your age, and the barriers to entry are less of a challenge that either downhill of skier cross.

All of that said, as you're a writer, a book following your brave, perhaps foolhardy, but potentially inspiring life choice would make a pretty good read.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Montles, Get a blog going, i'll be interested in following and perhaps helping.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Montles, If you are looking to get into skicross the best place to start racing is the co-op tour in Switzerland, http://coopskicross.ch/ They have open races in which you don't need a FIS license (international license) and the courses are very tame (you can watch some videos on the link) Its good entry level racing, fun and because some good swiss guys compete to inspire the younger athletes you can get some sort of idea where you are at.

To make you aware trying to be a 'pro' racer wont make you a long term living (especially in Britain), it will cost you a lot of money (20k+ per season with a coach) but it is really fun trying and its something to tell the grandkids Smile

If you would like to discuss any training opportunities drop me an email at jjctraining@hotmail.com and we can let you know availability, programs and costs.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Quote:

a book following your brave, perhaps foolhardy, but potentially inspiring life choice would make a pretty good read.

I agree - usually the people doing this sort of thing can't write, but a well written book (or blog for that matter) would be great.

The point about injury is well made. My son is a good skier and boarder and used to do daft stuff. But he stopped doing daft stuff when, to use his own words, he discovered that "I don't mend at 28 like I did at 18".
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:

I don't fear the 10 year olds. I am sure they will roast my times initially


Well good luck with that...

The huge advantage the average 10 year old racer has over you is they will have learnt to ski at a young age "without fear" most of them only have to battle with the course "not themselves + the course"

Assuming you didn't learn when you were very young - eg your current level at your age, then you will be lugging around some degree of undermining fear learnt through life experiences whether you are aware of them or not - like it or not, (this will be your biggest hurdle!)
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
On injury, a friend's son was doing rather well in local youth racing and was disappointed to break a leg mid season (he was 9 or so). Both he and his parents took it pragmatically as you don't get to senior levels without injuries...
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Montles wrote:


I have decided to devote the next three to five years of my life to becoming absolutely the best competition skier I can be.

Monts


Good luck.

This ^ is surely the driving part of the OP's ambition, and is to be applauded. I can't take issue with the height of his aims regarding top level competition, no matter how unlikely. If he's going to be the best he can be, then he has to aim at the top. The fact that he prob won't get there obviously isn't enough to put him off, which points to him having alot of drive, and also suggests that he's doing this for himself and not to try to prove something to those around him.

I found this quote somewhere, but can't remember where:

'There is no place to hide in a sporting performance and being willing to
risk your ego is a calculation that separates athletes who rise to the
challenge and those that fear failure'

I'd say that by posting here, the OP has shown that he's not scared to risk his ego, nor of failure.

If I won the lottery, I'd prob do the same, but without the competition part:

'I have decided to devote the next three to five years of my life to becoming absolutely the best skier I can be.'
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Montles - good luck mate, its fantastic to have ambition so aim for the stars and even if you only get halfway... then you will be.... er .... halfway to the stars, but you know what I mean.

What I mean is, that if you feel you have the talent, but just lack the fitness and technique and you really don't care about what it costs, then just go for it, but be prepared to face facts if it turns out that boosting your fitness and experience doesn't make up for talent / build / age.

Defo do a blog though and if you are really media friendly then approach a sports production company and tell them what you are doing and ask if they would like to make a film of your journey - they could interview you at the start then at key points in your training and your key races and you could fill in with a video diary. You could be a media star as well as a sports legend.

Good luck and break a leg (theatrical expression!) Very Happy
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Montles, thanks for the link on age related decay but the running studies tend to focus on VO2 max and as you point out age doesnt decay that rapidly in cardio based events. However ski racing is more to do with power not cardio fitness and this definitely declines with age...

from http://www.sportsci.org/encyc/agingex/agingex.html/

Strength peaks around 25 years of age, plateaus through 35 or 40 years of age, and then shows an accelerating decline, with 25% loss of peak force by the age of 65 years.
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skimottaret wrote:
Montles, thanks for the link on age related decay but the running studies tend to focus on VO2 max and as you point out age doesnt decay that rapidly in cardio based events. However ski racing is more to do with power not cardio fitness and this definitely declines with age...

from http://www.sportsci.org/encyc/agingex/agingex.html/

Strength peaks around 25 years of age, plateaus through 35 or 40 years of age, and then shows an accelerating decline, with 25% loss of peak force by the age of 65 years.
#

b******s ive had it then!! Laughing
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
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Montles wrote:

I continue to acknowledge that I am not being realistic. I am deliberately choosing to pursue fantasy. But I'm going to pursue it very seriously indeed.


Cool attitude. You won't make it, but it'll be a Be Nice please! awesome journey anyway, which is the most important thing (you're doing it wrong though, racers don't get pow, plus the freeride scene will be easier to break into, if you can master the headgames).

How to do it? Move somewhere cool, ski everyday. Get lessons with a top level instructor a few times a week. Invest time in your off-snow fitness. Couple of times a season try more intensive courses - race camps/moguls/freestyle/freeride/etc, as much variety as possible. Enter local races/freeride comps, see how it goes. Most importantly have a shitload of fun and an awesome time - which for me would rule out bashing gates and race courses over and over.

I'd seriously think about the mountain guide course idea too - would take a long time and a lot of hard work, but much much more achievable, much more fun (than racing) and would lead to about the most fulfilling and most fun job imaginable.
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Montles, my mate Lief is an ex olypmic dowhill skier who teaches olympic hopefuls in the US and Canada now - shall I see what his schedule is like? I guess one of the benefits of dropping out with loads of cash is that you can move around and follow the snow! snowHead
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iskar, quite so. Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil
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