 Poster: A snowHead
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Looking at skiing stateside this season for two weeks, 1 week in the feb half term and the other week either before or after so we only take jnr out of school for a week.
He's 9 and ski's blacks with us.
I haven't really thought about where to go yet, canda or the usa as its a niggling thought thats currently getting in the way of doing anything constructive at work.
Do you guys (and gals) have any reccomendations of resorts? I also need a rough idea of where to fly to for some of the bigger resorts. Our local airport is Manchester but I have no problem driving down to Gatwick/Heathrow for flights.
I'll more than likely go independant rather that TO unless I can get a free child place (again, is this likely on a long haul?)
I wouldn't say that cost is no object because that sounds quite arrogant, however I've not really got a budget but I wont be blowing £££££££'s on overrated hotels and 1st class flights.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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We've stayed here in vail before http://www.vailresortrentals.com/ap2.htm , location is pretty good, you a 2 minute walk to the bus stop for vail or a 5 minute walk to the bus for Beaver Creek. About 5-7 minutes to one of the main lifts up, and a couple of minutes into Vail Village Centre.
Drive from Denver is about 1.5 hours, depending on Traffic and weather. You can also play in the other nearby resorts if yo ufancy a change of scenery.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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We go as a family to the States or Canada most years, so here are a few random thoughts.
First, cost. You can save a fortune by: flying midweek instead of at weekend; by being prepared to change aircraft in an airport that primarily serves business passengers (eg Cincinnati, Chicago, Dallas) if you must fly on a weekend; by buying your lift passes from a UK-based tour operator or by getting a bundled deal with your accommodation; by carfully choosing a resort that will give Jnr a free lift pass; by returning to the UK on or before President's Day (20 Feb this year); by avoiding hotel and car hire companies' own web sites and booking through an independent web-based operator or through the resort; and by phoning up and speakin to resorts' accommodation offices directly (every time I've called a North American ski resort, I've been offered a better price than the web site shows.
At the risk of stating the obvious, your principal direct flight flight options are: Denver for the Colorado Rockies (transfer 2 hours or so); Calgary for the Canadian Rockies (transfer 2-6 hours); Salt Lake City for the Utah resorts and Vancouver for Whistler. Other great resorts need a change, but that shouldn't deter you: Jackson for Jackon Hole (transfer only 10 minutes to the town), Bozeman for Big Sky Kelowna for some interior British Columbia resorts. I'm not familiar with the Californian resorts, but I believe that you're generally looking at a very long drive from the coast.
Almost any resort will do, but some are much busier than others and therefore perhaps less ideal with a child. Breckenridge, Vail and Whistler are most likely to be crowded, especialy over President's weekend, so I'd dump them near the bottom of my list.
Your cheapest option is likely to be Jackson, as winter acommodation is stunningly inexpensive there and you won't pay for your son's lift pass. But Jackson can also get a little busy and the steep slopes are very fierce so you might not be able to take full advantage of the place. I would suggest Big Sky as an idyllically quiet spot where jnr could learn to get to grips with some powder and trees. You could also take him for a trip to Yellowstone (it's incredible in the winter) to break up the skiing slightly.
Finally, North American ski schools are usualy of an extraordinarily high quality and typically push the kids to do adventurous things that they wouldn't dare tackle with their parents. A couple of days in ski school would be just the thing to turn a European black run skier into an all-mountain monster. I can still remember the mantras my kids were taught: "We push you out of your comfort zone but keep you inside your danger zone" and, best, "If you don't scare yourself, you're not pushing hard enough"
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If you want to fly direct your options from the UK are pretty much Denver, San Francisco, LA/Las Vegas (for Mammoth longish transfer), Calgary and Vancouver. Seattle bit of an outside bet if you're into non traditional non-"resort" type skiing. SLC is probably the best single hub for lots of skiing. From the UK Canada is almost certainly more expensive due to exchange rate unless you get a TO deal in Banff. If you want great scenery then Banff, Jackson, Tahoe and then Whistler probably top the list with Whistler being most Euro in aspect & resort size IMO.
For 2 weeks you begin to be in with a prospect where season passes can make sense - Vail do cheap passes for both Colorado and Tahoe resorts and this encourages competitors to compete aggressively.
edit: echo the above re Jackson pricing - was there at New Year and could have got a room for the week in town for under $200 plus tax if I'd gone lowball, similarly for Banff winter is low season and Tahoe midweek is definitely off peak. Car hire is cheap and definitely adds flexibility so no reason to bunker down in just one place for the whole time e.g. you could split SLC/Jackson, Banff/Kicking Horse/Revy, Tahoe/Mammoth if you want to experience a bit of a "road trip".
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Thu 28-06-12 13:56; edited 1 time in total
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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we have had excellent times in Jackson, Whistler, Utah (various), Revelstoke and Kicking Horse. The latter two are a bit limited if the snow is crap.
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homers double, wherever you pick check out the season pass deals sooner rather than later. We left it too late (as did not know) last year and ended up paying way over the odds for 2 week passes even on a discounted deal via a UK TO. Specifically I'm thinking of the Summit Value Pass, but the Epic pass too and I'm sure other areas have their season pass deals.
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Thanks all, read and noted but please keep your tips coming. I've only ever skiied Europe so this would be the first time (in 25yrs) I've been.
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I like Vail, Beaver Creek and Copper Mountain all close together excellent for off-piste all mountain skiers each has half of each. Fly to Denver, then to Eagle, hire a car Vail 20 minutes. Stay in Vail, East is good, other resorts mentioned locally 30 minutes by car and Aspen 3 hours. The only down side is HMS, each sleeps at 8000ft and Copper is 9000 but they know how to treat it. I have been most places and I have always enjoyed Vail, the snow is fabulously dry, so powder skiing is just that. A bit like Val d'Isere without the French and Vail's strap-line is "People only spend money when they are enjoying themselves" so they make sure you do, from tissues at the lift stations, organised lift lines at the bottom using singles lines and the chef in whites serving free cookies to the morning lift line at Beaver Creek. Beaver Creek has the Birds of Prey WC DH track a steep treat to warm up the legs in the morning. I have been there when it was chilly I remarked that I was cold but it was only minus 19’ a local piped up “boy this is America and that’s Fahrenheit”.
If I had the cash I would stay at the Hyatt Beaver Creek, no cars in the resort a fabulous hotel with fire pits and a Whisky and sticky trolley for après, it is a tourist area unlike a gnarly La Grave, if that’s what you’re looking for you won’t be disappointed.
Lift tickets are expensive $50 a day some years ago but deals are available, we bought offers in newspapers being sold by touts in car parks and saved at least 50% but tickets are a consideration.
(I promised not to say anymore, it always rains in Whistler and it's cold as hell in Canada being near the Arctic circle, oh well)
Last edited by After all it is free  on Thu 28-06-12 18:11; edited 1 time in total
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
Fly to Denver, then to Eagle
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I don't do the hop to Eagle. I always think it's better to hire car at Denver Airport and then make first night in Denver - helps a tiny bit with acclimatisation too. Because of time difference, you're up and about incredibly early so can easily tackle the drive in half daylight and when the roads are empty.
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Bode Swiller, I would agree funds allowing. I have flown the red eye to Denver, then 3 hours on the highway in 6 inches of snow in an automatic barge getting to Breckenridge and no traffic to follow, no edges to the dual carriageway, guessing where the tarmac is, having to stop to pee on the lights to get the ice off; but what a buzz and complete exhaustion when you finally see the lights of Vail. You then find out three airport shuttles went off the road and 4 people killed on the bit where you couldn't find the road and earlier they were passing you at 60mph. I now fly Eagle.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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1. Jackson, Hole, USA;
2. Aspen, USA;
3. Whistler, Canada.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Cynic, I haven't been killed yet and sometimes that flight doesn't go.
homers double, for two weeks I'd be looking at a two/three centre - something like Winter Park, Steamboat, Vail or Winter Park, Breckenridge, Vail.
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go on epic ski the locals will tell you all you need to know about deals
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
| Your cheapest option is likely to be Jackson, as winter acommodation is stunningly inexpensive there |
Bergmeister may be along at some point....He swears by Winter Park for bargain accommodation. This year he and Mrs B also bought earlybird season passes for some ridiculously low price - which worked out cheaper than the week's ticket they would have bought for their Feb half term visit!
Mrs MA and I have been as well so can recommend the great (deserted) ski area and snow record. Nightlife is a bit limited but enough there to occupy and feed you for your visit.
Other than that, you'd probably love Banff, Whistler, Breckenridge, Copper Mountain or Vail for nice town ambience and great skiing.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
Cynic, I haven't been killed yet and sometimes that flight doesn't go.
homers double, for two weeks I'd be looking at a two/three centre - something like Winter Park, Steamboat, Vail or Winter Park, Breckenridge, Vail. |
If I were on my own, I'd agree. With a kid in tow, it's not worth the hassle IMV. Additionally, our kids love familiarity and would far rather stick in one place: even now they're teenagers, their natural instinct is always to ski a favourite route one more time rather than try something new.
homers double, you've been quite vague on what you're looking for in a resort. You say that your son enjoys black runs, but do you all have a strong preference for tougher skiing? Or are you simply saying that you aren't afraid to tackle the tougher runs. And what else matters to you? Do you want a recommended ski school? Ski in/out accommodation? A choice of decent resort restaurants?
FWIW, my kids' favourite resort that they've ever visited is Panorama in Canada. It's not for everyone: tiny, only a few groomers, a poorly structured lift system, nothing to do apart from ski. But, at the same age as your lad, when we visited they were rocketing through the trees, picking their way through rock bands, discovering the joys of powder and learning to deal with tight tracks through dense vegetation. Discovering cougar footprints on the piste (yes, really - I saw the beast close-up myself and the footprints were verified by the resort) was just the icing on the cake.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
Discovering cougar footprints on the piste
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Scarey!!!
Last spring break at Kicking Horse there was a bear wondering round the lower runs...........
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| gryphea wrote: |
| Quote: |
Discovering cougar footprints on the piste
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Scarey!!!
Last spring break at Kicking Horse there was a bear wondering round the lower runs........... |
Seeing the cougar was scarier. 10 yards away and BIG! I've rarely skied so fast.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Jonny Jones, Yes I was agreeing that day journey a very good idea, I was pointing out problems that can occur from Denver after midnight.
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Fri 29-06-12 11:18; edited 1 time in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Jonny Jones wrote: |
homers double, you've been quite vague on what you're looking for in a resort. You say that your son enjoys black runs, but do you all have a strong preference for tougher skiing? Or are you simply saying that you aren't afraid to tackle the tougher runs. And what else matters to you? Do you want a recommended ski school? Ski in/out accommodation? A choice of decent resort restaurants?
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I know I'm being vague for the main reason that I dont know what to do yet and am hoping this thread will save me from the depths of the internet or at least start me off in the right direction.
We all like a challenge but also like fast skiing so plenty of reds etc, we don't need ski school however one comment above got me thinking about a few gnarly lessons for the little feller, he goes to Grom Camp at Chill Factor quite often and likes that sort of stuff.
Ski in/out would be nice but it wont make or break the holiday, a choice restaurants is always good and I'm assuming most decent resorts would have a reasonable amount.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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homers double, have a look at Keystone - tons and tons of fast red/blue stuff, ski in/out, night skiing and A Basin is just up the road for some more gnarly stuff.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Park City for Deer Valley, Park City and The Canyons. With day trips to Alta, Snowbird, Solitude, Brighton, Snowbasin, Powder Mountain.
Quick transfer from Salt Lake City airport
Massive variety of accommodation options
Free and efficient transit network. Think Chamonix with manners and space
More food options than you can manage in two weeks
Unbelievable snow quality most of the time
Tremendous variety of skiing
Plenty of shopping and night time activities for the family - bowling, cinema, rodeo etc
And for something completely different consider Hokkaido, Japan.
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| homers double wrote: |
I know I'm being vague for the main reason that I dont know what to do yet and am hoping this thread will save me from the depths of the internet or at least start me off in the right direction. |
OK. If it helps, these are the things that keep dragging me back to North America.
- The tough stuff. You can't really do tough skiing in Europe without a guide. Even if you could find a guide that would take a family down he tough stuff, the cost would be prohibitive.
- Lack of crowds. Many American sorts, even the big names, are fabulously quiet.
- Comfort. Americans understand how to make life luxurious without being snooty. You can expect spacious accommodation, outdoor swimming pools and hot tubs, a roaring fire in your room, staff everywhere and an astonishing level of service.
- Kid friendliness. This is the country that brought us Disney (which I loathe, BTW). American businesses understand that childhood should be fun.
- Americans. Whatever you think of their government, Americans and Canadians are great people - more friendly and outgoing than in any other place I've ever visited.
- The West. I love the Western ambience you find in places like Jackson and Breckenridge. I love the buildings, the diners, the bars, the beer. Even the food's pretty good for a week or two.
- The Rockies. They're much wilder and more wilderness-like than the Alps.
Those factors coalesce in a very special way in Jackson, IMV. The only downsides are that it can get busier than many US resorts and the slopes face south so the snow can deteriorate quickly. Big Sky is quiet with better snow, but lacks the Western ambience. I'm less keen on the Colorado resorts I've been to - too many people (Denver is too big and too close) and proportionately too many groomers for my liking. Most Canadian resorts lack ambience but typically have extraordinarily gnarly skiing that's far beyond their reputation, and take the whole uncrowned wilderness experience to a new level.
Take your pick!
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Whistler baby !
Big enough for your trip, loads of cruisers and even more serious stuff should you want to scare yourselves.
The ski school is fantastic and with 200 shops, resturants, cafes, bars, etc plenty to do in the evening.
You won't regret it. People talk about rain, just jump on a lift and get to a different altitude and guess what, no rain !
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Excellent thread, am planning on hitting North America next year.
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Jonny Jones has a pretty good summary. It all just depends on how much you want different from a standard ski holiday and how much more you want to make it into a "trip".
2 possibilities which are more of a trip thing.
Fly into SLC. Ski wherever you want, a different place each day if you want (don't miss the redonculous luxury of Snowbasin) , go to an NBA game in the evening (the Jazz aren't much cop so tickets are realtively easy to get). Drive or short flight up to Jackson. Experience cowboy country, take a snowmobile tour into Yellowstone. Snowshoe or crosscountry a bit in Grand Teton NP.
Fly into San Francisco. Take a first or last day to explore the city : Golden Gate, Fisherman's Wharf, Alcatraz. Drive up to Tahoe and pick a base on the North or South Shore. Get skinanny to take junior for a day or morning being rad at Squaw. If there's something typically redneck on in Reno like a Monster Truck Show go down to see it. Gorge out on a casino buffet . Drive round the lake and see if you can spot locations from Godfather II or go on a boat trip. Get your Euro groomer fix in at Northstar or Heavenly.
If you want ski-in, ski-out in one single resort that's fine too and plenty of places will fit that bill. You can stay in Breckenridge for a couple of weeks and ride the shuttle to Keystone for variety and take a trip to Vail and Beaver Creek or a day in Copper so if you choose wisely it's not necessarily more limiting.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Inkling
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Jonny Jones,
I would agree apart from one point re comfort,.
We made the mistake of booking for our honeymoon a premium hotel in Vail, this wasnt cheap but the room was about the size of a 40k studio in France despite costing over 1/10th of the price for 10 days, we complained and got upgraded (it was our honeymoon after all) But you dont always get what you pay for, and added on to this some of the staff were pretty rude, I guess we weren't rich enough for them!
lodge at vail , i will never do again..... but Vail I will.
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Jonny Jones, you were making serious sense till you talked about food. I have usually had my fill of burgers by the time I'm out of the airport
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You know it makes sense.
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| Jonny Jones wrote: |
| gryphea wrote: |
| Quote: |
Discovering cougar footprints on the piste
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Scarey!!!
Last spring break at Kicking Horse there was a bear wondering round the lower runs........... |
Seeing the cougar was scarier. 10 yards away and BIG! I've rarely skied so fast. |
If you fall- do NOT drop your ski poles
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| meh wrote: |
| Excellent thread, am planning on hitting North America next year. |
Yeh! I was gonna go, then gave up on it, now thinking about it again!
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Poster: A snowHead
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| patricksh wrote: |
| Jonny Jones, you were making serious sense till you talked about food. I have usually had my fill of burgers by the time I'm out of the airport |
Not at the list of resorts being thrown about. Almost all of them have good variety of different food. Some pretty good one too. (Aspen and Jackson Hole had the best and most consistent food quality so far, for US. In Canada, I don't remember having a bad meal, period)
You must not been looking at all if all you got were burgers.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| abc wrote: |
| patricksh wrote: |
| Jonny Jones, you were making serious sense till you talked about food. I have usually had my fill of burgers by the time I'm out of the airport |
Not at the list of resorts being thrown about. Almost all of them have good variety of different food. Some pretty good one too. (Aspen and Jackson Hole had the best and most consistent food quality so far, for US. In Canada, I don't remember having a bad meal, period)
You must not been looking at all if all you got were burgers. |
Yeh, you can also go for pancakes, mexican, or any other food that is >50% fat!
Seriously though, you aren't telling me food in US is better than France or Italy?? I lived in US for 2 years. If so I have to consider that when assessing credibility of all other NA selling points...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| homers double wrote: |
We all like a challenge but also like fast skiing so plenty of reds etc, we don't need ski school however one comment above got me thinking about a few gnarly lessons for the little feller, he goes to Grom Camp at Chill Factor quite often and likes that sort of stuff.
Ski in/out would be nice but it wont make or break the holiday, a choice restaurants is always good and I'm assuming most decent resorts would have a reasonable amount. |
On this basis happy to recommend Breckenridge, we had two weeks there at Easter. Our first time there with friends who were there for their 4 th time.
Your lad sounds similar to mine and re. ski school it is excellent and very much dip in and dip out. My son and our friends' boys did a '2 day rocky mountain park and pipe camp', there were only 5 of them for the 2 days and they had a blast. My son and one of the other lads also did two or three days in kids level 8 class (top class - blacks and double blacks) and it was amazing. They skied the tough stuff and also did the Nastar course, they had a lot of fun. The group was small, the other kids were also good skiers and the instructor was great.
Loads of ski-in/out accomm and loads of choice of restaurants.
We also skied A Basin for two days, it's not far, and loved it there.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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patricksh, I couldn't live on mainstream American food for more than a couple of weeks. But for a skiing holiday when you're burning maybe 2000 calories per day, it's perfect. Subtle, no. Comforting and plentiful, yes. But you can get good quality food if you want, despite the rumours.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| patricksh wrote: |
| abc wrote: |
| patricksh wrote: |
| Jonny Jones, you were making serious sense till you talked about food. I have usually had my fill of burgers by the time I'm out of the airport |
Not at the list of resorts being thrown about. Almost all of them have good variety of different food. Some pretty good one too. (Aspen and Jackson Hole had the best and most consistent food quality so far, for US. In Canada, I don't remember having a bad meal, period)
You must not been looking at all if all you got were burgers. |
Yeh, you can also go for pancakes, mexican, or any other food that is >50% fat!
Seriously though, you aren't telling me food in US is better than France or Italy?? I lived in US for 2 years. If so I have to consider that when assessing credibility of all other NA selling points... |
US food is not as good as Italian food, which is the best in the world.
But it is tastier than the overhyped, overprepared, fussy French nonsense.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| patricksh wrote: |
| abc wrote: |
| patricksh wrote: |
| Jonny Jones, you were making serious sense till you talked about food. I have usually had my fill of burgers by the time I'm out of the airport |
Not at the list of resorts being thrown about. Almost all of them have good variety of different food. Some pretty good one too. (Aspen and Jackson Hole had the best and most consistent food quality so far, for US. In Canada, I don't remember having a bad meal, period)
You must not been looking at all if all you got were burgers. |
Yeh, you can also go for pancakes, mexican, or any other food that is >50% fat!
Seriously though, you aren't telling me food in US is better than France or Italy?? I lived in US for 2 years. If so I have to consider that when assessing credibility of all other NA selling points... |
When you're on ski holiday, you're there for what? 2 weeks max?
If in that time span, you can't find enough Mexican (which is NOT over 50% fat), Chinese, Japanese, Thai,... and god forbid, Italian food for 10 meals, you must not been looking at all!
There's no such thing as "food in US". It's the 5-10 individual resturants you end up eating at, in one (or a few) particular ski town!
The best food in the US, is the kind that blends different cuisine to create the best of the world! If you're not finding them in major ski destination town, you need new glasses. 
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If the food in the US is that bad, I wonder what I live on?
Tahoe has at least 12 different day resorts, so there is plenty of skiing.
Flights are Manchester - Las Vegas - Reno, and then about a 40 to 60 minute drive depending on where you want to be, although many of the casinos run ski buses up to the mountains daily.
Squaw is now combined with Alpine - it's the same pass and company. Plenty of blacks and extreme terrain, and a great ski school (thanks fatbob ).
Food is good - from sushi to burgers and pretty much anything in between. Californians like good food, usually lots of vegetarian choices, although I don't tend to eat on mountain as a rule - most people grab something quick at lunch and have a good meal at dinner. One of the best restaurants at Squaw is run by a Brit who can actually cook!
If you wanted to fly into San Francisco it is only about 4 hours by road to Tahoe - I know that sounds far by British standards but over here it isn't, most of our guests are from the Bay Area and they drive up every weekend. Tahoe resorts are basically deserted mid-week except for Presidents week, you'd be skiing straight on to the chair.
As for lift passes - get them before September if you think you might want a season pass - ie for the Vail Corp resorts or Squaw/Alpine.
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| Jonny Jones wrote: |
| patricksh, I couldn't live on mainstream American food for more than a couple of weeks. But for a skiing holiday when you're burning maybe 2000 calories per day, it's perfect. Subtle, no. Comforting and plentiful, yes. But you can get good quality food if you want, despite the rumours. |
Sorry if thread has been hijacked, just thought it was right to contest food as being one of reasons to go to US. But I can go with qualification above. We can get back to the important stuff
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Aspen and Park City to name but two have cuisine to rival Italy and France and I'm not limiting it to just ski resort restaurants.
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Completely agree with
Mike Pow, Have been for the past two years and have based ourselves in Park City. We have then been able to add different outlying resorts to Park City, Deer Valley and Canyons. we have also been snowmobiling both times at Christmas Medows which was fantastic http://bearriverlodge.com/index.php/equipment-rentals/snowmobile-rentals/. if you sign up to facebook you get some great deals. You can also save on the. lift passes by buying in downtown Salt Lake City - it about a five minute drive from the main highway to the shops and well worth it.[img][/img]
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FAQ
