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Resorts with state-of-the-art lift systems

 Poster: A snowHead
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rob@rar wrote:
stevew, Niseko in Japan.


Damn thought it might have been the single at Glenshee
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Crappy lift systems shouldn't be underestimated. They screen out those who are fussy leaving in general quieter pistes and much less competition for pow. I can think of some areas of some mountains that work great but would be turned to crap with a high speed 6 pack.
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Quote:

Tom W,
Quote:

St Anton - good overall but still some slow double chair lifts around


The only one I know of is the Albona 1 & 2


I also like Albona 1+2 as they are, but I think they are down to be replaced with a two stage gondola in the next few years too. I like Schindler in its current state as well - although there are often quite big queues, and the bottom station could do with being a bit lower, it's pretty brisk, and if it had higher capacity Schindlergrat would get tracked even faster than it does at the moment. The doubles up at Rendl could do with replacing - now the new gondola has gone in that might make that area a bit more popular, and take some of the strain off Kappall / Galzig. I guess the link with Kappl, when it eventually goes in, will also make Rendl more popular so might drive their replacement at that point.

Agree that Austria is streets ahead of France. I was quite shocked by the infrastructure in 3V / Espace Killy when I last visited 2 years ago, particularly given the ticket prices. Don't understand the apparent French aversion to bubbles. Also, there seem to be more avalanche fatalities in Espace Killy on average than the Arlberg, although I think the terrain in the Arlberg is actually higher risk (but perhaps better patrolled / blasted).

In my view the best lift system in the alps is in Serfaus / Fiss / Ladis. Now the Masner T bar has been replaced I think all the key lifts are detachable chairs or gondolas, and all but three or four have bubbles. The underground train that delivers you to the lifts in Serfaus is pretty cool too.
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Quote:

rob@rar wrote:
stevew, Niseko in Japan.


Damn thought it might have been the single at Glenshee


I think Glenshee has a cross bar or equivalent at least to prevent an accidental fall. Single seater is rare but Niseko beats everybody by the user grabbing to the steel pole hanging the chairlift.

The photo posted by RobRar shows the chairlift near the station where the users were quite relax as the height was low. The actual chair can get up to quite a height, say 3 to 4 m. It is reasonably safe because the speed is dead slow. I don't think the arrangement would be permitted in a European or the North American resort but the Japanese are more discipline and we also didn't find children appear in significant number in Niseko.
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Quote:

Agree that Austria is streets ahead of France. I was quite shocked by the infrastructure in 3V / Espace Killy when I last visited 2 years ago, particularly given the ticket prices.


There is a chairlift called Leissieres Express in Val D that crosses a mountain as an inverted "V". The sensation of going upward, crossing the peak suddenly descending downward at a sharp angle is quite shocking. I have to admit that it is also fun like riding a roller coaster.

Quote:

In my view the best lift system in the alps is in Serfaus / Fiss / Ladis.

Didn't find Serfaus / Fiss / Ladis stands out as the best of the Austria as I don't normally have a complaint with any of the Austria resort on its chairlifts which seem to be always newer and better linked than the others.
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I will throw out Nassfeld as one of the better ones out there. Haven't been to Kronplatz, but as an earlier post mentioned, it's supposed to be very good.
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I suppose Kronplatz, designated Area No. 2 of the 12 areas of Dolomites, is an odd ball.

It has a summit at 2275m that has 8 lifts all converging at the top and 6 of them are gondolas. When I skied it a couple of years back I drove from Arabba and accessed it via Picolino. In order to save time I rode 8 different gondolas (No. 215, 202, 205, 203, 205, 208, 210 & 201) all the way to its summit passing through 3 different valleys stepping outside only once for one short run. So it is fair to say this resort is full of gondolas. A piste map of Kronplatz is here. The place is very popular with the Italian families with loads of children around.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Serfaus has spent a lot on new lifts over the last decade or so. It's also the only resort I know of with an in-resort underground railway to keep the village traffic free.
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Okanagan,

Snowmass of Aspen has an open top gondola to ferry people from car-running village to a next level of village without cars. Zermatt and Saas Fee of Switzerland for years operate a car free zone (except electrically driven). Funicula is available through the town centre of Ortisei (Val Gardena Sector of the Italy Dolomitres). Don't really see a traffic free village is a necessary condition to make the resort to have the state of the art lift system.

As a skier when being transported in the open from a lower level to a higher level some time the wind, the cold and blizzard would make me think perhaps we could do with something to warm the bum or/and a bit of plastic to shield the wind and snow. If these are available then I appreciate the thought of the resort Owner has gone into. These resort owners will naturally do something if the queue is too long and can be cut down by increasing the capacity of the lift.

Having said the above a resort that provides a place for skiing in the summer and doubling up as a popular destination for the sight-seeing tourists is mostly likely to invest in the lift system so in that respect Zermatt will be hard to beat with a good combinations of surface drags, chairlifts, gondolas, cable cars and "trains".

There are SHs dismissing cable cars but it is an engineering feat if you have to install it at a lump of rock at about 4000m. Try Klein Matterhorn cable car. It will take your breath away. And when you come out skiing down the mountain it is like on top of the world with nothing but white snow, blue sky and yourself inside it. Such lift gives you a memorable experience for life.
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saikee wrote:
Okanagan,

Snowmass of Aspen has an open top gondola to ferry people from car-running village to a next level of village without cars. Zermatt and Saas Fee of Switzerland for years operate a car free zone (except electrically driven). Funicula is available through the town centre of Ortisei (Val Gardena Sector of the Italy Dolomitres). Don't really see a traffic free village is a necessary condition to make the resort to have the state of the art lift system.
Did I say it was? It was just something unusual enough to be worth mentioning - and to build a resort underground does show a bit of thinking beyond the obvious, which is reflected in the way they've developed and invested in the rest of their lift system in recent years.

From an article in Ski Canada magazine on Serfaus (and linked Fiss and Ladis) "This Tyrolean trio’s interconnected lift system forms one of the biggest ski resorts in Austria – 53 lifts stretching through five enormous basins along a chain of mountains. The resort offers nearly as much vertical and as high a peak elevation as its much better-known cousin and rival, St. Anton, barely 50 km away. On my visit there last March, everybody in the group agreed Serfaus-Ladis-Fiss have assembled literally the best lift system in the entire Alps." and "Today literally no resort has more modern, faster or consistently excellent ski lifts – quads, six-packs, nearly all detachable high-speed, plus fast six- and eight-seat gondolas, several with heated seats. Even with 12,000 guest beds and peak crowds of 14,000, there just aren’t any real lift lines. Serfaus alone has three high-speed gondolas radiating from its base, plus one of Austria’s two underground metros running beneath the main street of the drawn-out town (honest – Vienna has the other). The wonderful Pezid skiing zone, itself bigger than a resort the size of Fernie, was opened just a couple of years ago with four new lifts." - and they've built more new lifts and opened up more new runs since that was written.
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So it was the Canadian magazine's word Serfaus has the best lift system in the entire Alps. Trust these Canadians have tried out sufficient number of Alpine resorts when drawing up the conclusion.

St Anton's 280km piste, Ski Welt (Wider Kasier) 250km piste, Ischgl's 235km piste and Saalbach's 200km piste are all significantly bigger than Serfaus's 185km piste. It is true that Serfaus is full linked with Fiss and Ladis so for a like to like comparison it should be compared with Ski Welt (linked fully by 8 resorts), Saalbach/Hinterglemm/Leogang if we dismissed Samnaun being Swiss which should be discounted from Ischgl.

For fully linked up system 3V has 200+ lifts serving 600km piste while and Sella Ronda, as a fully linked part of Dolomitres, has 500km piste served by 220 lifts. Both of these are pretty modern, efficient, fast and among the best. The Canadians were talking about a peak crowd of 14,000 in Serfaus but the lift system of 3V is designed to move 260,000 every hour!
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The question was "the resort(s) with the most modern, fast, and efficient lift systems" - which doesn't necessarily have to mean which areas have the highest km of piste. So quoting "resort x has more km ofpiste than resort y" doesn't say anything about how modern, fast, efficient or well planned the list system is.
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Okanagan,

Agree with what you say.

My point is do not overlook a big resort or a big lift system can also have small portions just as good as the smaller resort you are in favour of.
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You know it makes sense.
saikee, Okanagan, Serfaus is now 200km after they have built another fast six chair and opened up new runs. So now you can access the whole 200km on all modern lifts - chairs and gondolas Wink
3V although very efficient and good have lots to catch up with Serfaus, Ischgl, Flachau etc....
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185km, 280km - all big enough that the quantum doesn't matter - it becomes more about the terrain. A tedious motorway blue paralleled by another tedious motorway blue which eventual ends at a slight different junction doesn't enhance the ski experience.
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fatbob, Agreed - I'd rather have 20 super-efficient lifts that take me to all the o/piste freeride terrain with minimual uphill hiking, rather than say 70/80 lifts accessing 300/ 400 km of rolling blues, reds and greens. Its the terrain accessability thats the main criteria for me rather than how many km I can ski interrupted via the fastest lifts. I think that this is what is becoming more apparent in Europe, people increasingly judge how good a resort is by how many km of piste there is, nothing further from the truth IMO. Personally I couldnt care less how big the ski area is eg Ski Paradise, EK, Milky Way or 3V, its more about how readily I can get to the remote places where no crowds are chewing up the powder, the more piste they make the less pow there remains.
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Quote:

Its the terrain accessability thats the main criteria for me rather than how many km I can ski interrupted via the fastest lifts. I think that this is what is becoming more apparent in Europe, people increasingly judge how good a resort is by how many km of piste there is, nothing further from the truth IMO.


+1
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Markymark29 wrote:
its more about how readily I can get to the remote places where no crowds are chewing up the powder, the more piste they make the less pow there remains.


I've heard it said about Ischgl, perhaps here, that this is precisely a flaw of the place. Stuff that previously was good and remote now has big pistes bulldozed through it served by high capcity lifts.
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fatbob, Yep, thats why I hope the Kappl link doesnt get built. Plus keeps all the Spyder-wallers out over the hill!
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Agree with above. But the tread was about resorts with state of the art lift system Wink
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How would you rate the lifts in Seefeld or Filzmoos?
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Vgunn, Both fairly modern and varied but neither will give you access to a good week's worth of skiing for the week. Seefeld is one of the resorts of choice for skiers from Munich & Upper Bavaria who find the prices in Garmisch too high for what you get, but they are day trippers. Filzmoos is a beautiful village and has very modern lifts, mainly gondolas and chairlifts, but the skiing is really just for beginners. I used to regularly ski in Seefeld when I lived about 60kms north of there and was usually pretty bored after half a day to be honest. Filzmoos is where I take nervous older beginners because it is so quiet and easy, for myself the nearby /Wagrain/St Johann-Alpendorf offers a very modern system with much more skiing.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Vgunn wrote:
How would you rate the lifts in Seefeld or Filzmoos?


Only got to ski half of Seefeld (only half was free with the Tirol Snow Card), but lifts weren't great... Old, cramped and busy furnicular up, IIRC. Pretty boring skiing too tbh, not much in the way of character or features to play with - we went home after a couple of hours. The other half may be better though.
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clarky999, No it isn't! Believe me I've done both many times, and gone home after a couple of hours if I had the choice.

Great cross country trails though, don't need lifts for them though! snowHead
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