 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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don't know what the snow's like this year but we skied Livigno last year 24th April and had great conditions (exept the resort runs)
it's a bit of a trek to get there but it is duty free so food and beer are really cheap and late on in the season (after 14th april this year i think) certain accomodation gives you free lift passes into the bargin!!! 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Dubai snowdome - gteed snow and the beaches/souk/desert. Great place.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Really? Everyone talks about Dubai as if it's so ace but it's absolutely vile in every way. Wilfred Thesiger called it the Arabian nightmare and I agree. A fairyland built on slave labour, gambling on the financial market and whores, of every kind. While you're larging at it the "yacht" club, thousands of Pakistanis and various others are stuck in the desert, too poor to go home but "wealthy" enough to survive.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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andersont,
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Everyone  talks about Dubai as if it's so ace but it's absolutely vile in every way. Wilfred Thesiger called it the Arabian nightmare and I agree. A fairyland built on slave labour, gambling on the financial market and whores, of every kind. |
Really
Your post seems to imply that your rant is not based upon facts or personal experience, but upon an opinion of Thesiger who died in 2003: Hardly topical or indeed relevant, especially
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Fairyland built on slave labour, gambling on the financial market and whores, of every kind |
I'm a numbers man, and a curious one at that. Can you please enlighten your fellow SH's, (and please bear in mind that some of us are akin to the slave labour in your story that donate to SH keeping it free for those that choose not to pay) precisely how many "kinds" of whore's exist in your "imagined" version of Dubai.
Your "everyone" claim is wildly optimistic and myopic as it doesn't include me or colinstone, and I strongly suspect, (but cannot actually claim or verify) many other SH's 
BTW which version/author of the Arabian Nightmare are you referring to
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Just to start:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/oct/08/middleeast.construction
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/may/16/dubai-sex-tourism-prostitution
Not a rant eh pal? Thesiger was referring to Abu Dhabi, but as that is the capital of the UAE I hardly think the difference is so pronounced. So, as he died in 2003 he can't be topical? The quote is from "Arabian Sands", he was referring to the extinction of the rather more noble nomadic life of the Arabs in that area before they became "settled" as a nation. As for gambling on the international markets and building on nothing: who do you think lent as all the money to keep going? The Americans went cap in hand to the Chinese, we went to the Arabs. Ironic, eh? As for when the oil runs out, what is to prevent the Arabs returning to the desert? The Arabian peninsula was a sun-baked hole before they found and oil, and to that it will return.
You can't build a society of that wealth on nothing, sustainable populations have to be built on the basics of agriculture and industry.
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| Jivebaby wrote: |
| and please bear in mind that some of us are akin to the slave labour in your story that donate to SH keeping it free for those that choose not to pay |
Eh? You're saying because you donate to snowheads you're akin to a slave? I don't follow.
I have also heard many things about "slave" labour in Dubai, but obviously from secondhand media sources.
We have an office in Abu Dhabi, several of my colleagues have been, it sounds OK.
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Yeah, good point: not sure about that slave labour one. You seem to confuse donation with fee. Snowheads is free, and jolly good it is too. I also appreciate those who cough up. However, I haven't chosen to and there is no obligation to. I've not heard of a major forum that does charge in fact.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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bobmcstuff,  Tend to agree and yes perhaps my ref to paying SH's supporting (as slaves) the utility to provide access for all as this is voluntary is a stretch. I meant that perhaps as the "andersont" poster felt so strongly about a fairer society, perhaps he would consider "upping" his membership, and perhaps not as he confirms that it is indeed free and he feels no obligation. When people choose not to pay there is ultimately a cost -perhaps here in the form of stretched resources as SH could potentially collapse if no one paid to support it....
Likewise andersont, The lowly paid labourers, often from the ISC are supporting the development of infrastructure etc in very poor conditions for a variety of reasons. I've never been to Dubai either but do have many friends working and living there and elsewhere in the Gulf. These labourers, opted to accept jobs in the gulf albeit in return for very low wages and bad working conditions: They were not forced to accept these jobs, in the same way you are not forced to pay a SH subscription: You both have a choices, and if the employers chose/choose to pay more and/or provide better conditions to their workers from the ISC, perhaps the world would be a better place. That would imply that they acknowledge some social responsibility, and on that the old adage (not written by Thesiger) but perhaps relevant "that charity begins at home" is a good place to start. The bottom line is that if everyone chooses not to pay whether it's for whore's, slave labour (somewhere in the Gulf depending upon which opinion one is claiming) or indeed Snowheads.com, then some of these things will implode, but probably not whores what ever "kind" or type they are. 
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andersont,
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| Thesiger was referring to Abu Dhabi, but as that is the capital of the UAE I hardly think the difference is so pronounced. So, as he died in 2003 he can't be topical? The quote is from "Arabian Sands", |
He wrote this in 1959 At this time, most of the gulf was like a poor, undeveloped fishing village in the Gulf of Oman, not that unlike areas of Bangladesh now but without the flooding.
Your strained/strong opinion seems to be based on a book, or perhaps quotes from part of a book that you may or may not have read as extracts in the Guardian, and as it now transpires that you also misquoted the title, AND you are oblivious to fact that Sir Wilfred died nearly a decade ago and cannot even quote the title of his book correctly which he first published in 1959.
If you must express an opinion, please have the decency to make them your own rather than misrepresenting the views of dead people who are unable to argue plagiarism.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hang on, what? Where did I misquote the title of the book? Thesiger called it the "Arabian nightmare" in his book, "Arabian Sands". Can you read, or did you just skate over the top of what I said? I own a copy of the book and I don't read the Guardian.
As you clearly haven't read the book, the whole point (as I have already said) is the loss of the Bedouin way of life and a movement towards settled, perhaps Westernised culture. Oil had been found by then and the changes which he saw were the beginning of the process that lead to the modern UAE. I'm not oblivious to the fact he's dead, I knew that. Stop assuming.
As for your argument about the workers, that's just tedious. Have you considered that they may've been lied to? That as they are effectively stuck in the UAE due to lack of funds slavery is not such an unfitting word? I highly doubt the workers who went knew about the poor pay and conditions first. Anyway, to say that there isn't an argument because the workers volunteered is infantile. Is that really what you meant? That the responsibility should lie with the company, not any kind of regulation? You seem to be suggesting that as these people volunteered to work they can be treated badly. Your analogy with Snowheads is c rap by the way, I'd best drop that one chap. To suggest I should cough up as a kind of moral duty is really odd, I'm exposed to advertising on here. It's not some kind of welfare problem, the moderators aren't living on the street becuase I haven't donated a fiver and Snowheads isn't a charity established for the good of needy individuals.
P.S. You sound really pompous. I doubt Thesiger would argue plagiarism, that's theft of ideas without reference. Are you absolutely sure that you can read?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Perhaps fs should take her boyfriend to Dubai and sell him. Or better still, rent him out. That would fund loads of skiing, and certainly make Tignes affordable.
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You know it makes sense.
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Referencing a couple of stories doesn't mean I "read" it in the sense that most people would: that they read it frequently and regularly. How is his book relevant to life and people in general? It is very specifically about the Bedouin and a particular way of life. I've said it twice, but for a third time: what Thesiger saw was a precursor and could see what it would become. Where did I refer to everyone agreeing with me? I like your way of using smily faces instead of answering an argument. Are you twelve?
I don't understand why I have to explain things like the meaning of the word "read" and repeat myself, are you incapable of countering an argument. Also, I do have a view: that's what you're disagreeing with.
P.S. 1959 was 53 years ago. Not 30 or 50.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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andersont, andersont,
I feel now feel like a dentist at the end of a long day. I'm a generous, easygoing guy and usually accept that any contributor means what they type and that what they type is actually true. If you mean something else then why not say so? Not difficult, if not I’m sure on-line training can be provided and I’m really glad you like the  smiley’s, but the sadist in me now prevents further use of them in this posting.
You stated that you do not read the Guardian and then modify this ground breaking news by confirming that is not what you meant and that you actually do read it. Occasionally.
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| Everyone talks about Dubai as if it's so ace but it's absolutely vile in every way |
” =
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| Where did I refer to everyone agreeing with me? |
question.
Answer= I was so confused by your convolutions I inadvertently made a mistake. You actually acknowledged that everyone (except you) thought Dubai was/is an "Ace" place. I'm confident that Thesiger would agree with you, and I mean this sincerely.
The next answer is of course 42, however you’re beginning to sound like a jaded Aldous Huxley with two broken shoulders and a sense of humour bypass, so it really is goodnight from me.
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Poster: A snowHead
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What? No, Christ please read what I've written. I'm having to re-type everything again: referencing doesn't equate to reading in the sense it's normally meant: read regularly and frequently. Please re-read that closely to avoid me having to repeat myself yet again. I'm struggling with the bit after the dentist gag: where have I typed something to which I don't attach my meaning? I'm not sure what it is that I've said that isn't true, I have genuinely no idea what you mean.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I never get into internet arguments. (A waste of time, if ever there was one!) However, I've read stuff about Dubai and I certainly would not choose to go there.
And I subscribe to snowHeads so I must be right!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Wow, this is some aggressively quick thread-drift. Is someone out to win a bet or do peolpe really have a problem with slave labour building beautiful buildings in the dessert?
(grabs some popcorn)
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Sun 1-04-12 0:11; edited 2 times in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| CathS wrote: |
| Perhaps fs should take her boyfriend to Dubai and sell him. Or better still, rent him out. That would fund loads of skiing, and certainly make Tignes affordable. |
Can I be rented out too please?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Arctic Roll, What's the going rate for commission?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I'm sure there is a web site to be created somewhere... I could farm that out to students on their summer holidays.
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maggi,
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However, I've read stuff about Dubai and I certainly would not choose to go there.
And I subscribe to snowHeads so I must be right!
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+ 1
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People are wrong on the internet!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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andersont, Have you spent any time working in the country you show so much contempt for, or are you basing your opinions on what you have read? I have worked there and I have mixed with and spoken to plenty of the nationalities that service the growth and quality of life that some enjoy there.
I assure you that most regard themselves as lucky to be able to work in a country that is safe, disease free and where the pay levels allow tham to send 'relatively' large sums home to their families. There are many many countries where that is not the case.
Oh and for what its worth those at the top regard all non native peoples in the same light, so me as a middle aged, british, white male, is the same as the Nepalese taxi driver, we are all the same....immigrants or foreigners.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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So you've been to the camps where the labourers live then?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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andersont, I will take that as a 'No I have only read about it'
FWIW Labourers tend to live in camps on all big civil engineering projects.
Why dont you try and come and live on a camp next to a land rig in the desert for a while...........
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andersont, Stop assuming.
After assuming and making a comment that i do not like Pakistan or Pakistanis without any evdidence of the same anywhere on SH i do wish you would practice what you preach.
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FAQ
