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SALOMON SCRAMBLER 77 or HEAD C160i

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Need a pair of decent all mountain intermediate skis as I am getting bored of my blades.

Mainly red skier and not too aggressive but want to learn more.

Anyone got experience of any of these or Head XCR500 which all come in around 190 at the minute which is good value.

Any help appreciated

Thanks Puzzled
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Don't ever buy skis without testing them in resort. Everyone skis differently and therefore different skis suit different people. est and find the ones that suit you, not what the magazines say
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
FastCarver wrote:
Don't ever buy skis without testing them in resort.


Or at least an indoor ski slope!
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Wear The Fox Hat, Disagree mate sorry. I really don't think you can fully test a ski on an indoor slope. There is no way near enough diversity in terain and conditions to get good enough feedback. How can you test a really stiff on-piste performance ski on a dry slope? No way near enough speed can be generated to work the ski in it's intended maner
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
FastCarver, not a dry slope, but an indoor one.
You can't "fully" test a ski without trying it in all conditions - this would take several weeks - skiing in Europe, North America, Chile..., using that argument, no one would ever buy skis!
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I am well aware you meant indoor slope. Still not good enough. The only place to test skis is where they are to be used - A MOUNTAIN.

Would you test a 4x4 vehicle on roads only? Oh maybe you would!!
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
FastCarver, would you test a fat ski in Europe?

Come on, get real, not everyone lives in a ski resort for several months of a year, so only have a few days - if they are going to buy skis, I believe it is perfectly valid to test on an indoor slope - if they aren't capable of understanding a little of how the ski is going to behave by doing that, then they shouldn't be buying skis!
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Wear The Fox Hat, watch out - this guy used to be a ski host so he's obviously weewy weewy good
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Would i test a fat ski in europe? Yes if it had dumped down for a few days as it does. Where would i test them? Bellecote Glacier's Nort Face.

But i guess by what you are saying you would test them at milton keynes.

All i'm saying is you should test them where they are meant to be used. Sensible enough i'd say.
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FastCarver wrote:
Would i test a fat ski in europe? Yes if it had dumped down for a few days as it does. Where would i test them? Bellecote Glacier's Nort Face.

But i guess by what you are saying you would test them at milton keynes.

All i'm saying is you should test them where they are meant to be used. Sensible enough i'd say.


No, actually, I'd test them in real powder. So forget Europe, that's my point. I don't want to try them in wet, sticky, Euro pow. Give me champagne powder to test powder skis.
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so you have turned full circle on your original argument and have come round to my way of thinking.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Wear The Fox Hat, fat skis are pretty good in chopped up junk, slush, crust, crud etc etc too NehNeh
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
FastCarver wrote:
so you have turned full circle on your original argument and have come round to my way of thinking.


heh-heh, the whooshing sound of irony passing by its intended recipient...
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:

forget Europe, that's my point

Wear The Fox Hat, your US obsession is quite tiresome. Fastcarver is correct - a 3 day dump in La Plagne would be a perfect place to test fat skis. Milton Keynes is a crap place to test any skis.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Hey , the alpes ain't that bad, I saw an awful lot of americans at the places I went. And I agree with Arno, big skis crash through crud pretty well. Why do you think so many use them...?

The Europe V America gets a bit silly, carry on like that and you wont be able handle Europe...!
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Poster: A snowHead
Thanks Plake. It's nice to see someone talking sense
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Well, I'm glad Cedric is smarter than the average response on here!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
JT, my point is that any decent skier will be able to test an on-piste ski and get a good idea of whether it has good characteristics for them or not on an indoor slope in a couple of runs. What fastcarver is proposing is to test skis for several days in multiple resorts, with varying conditions, so you can see whether they are any good. For most skiers, that is somewhere between impractical and impossible, as, by the time they have tested a ski as well as he suggests, it will have been replaced by the following year's model, and maybe the one after that as well!
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Wear The Fox Hat,

Personally I wouldn't put that much store in a MK or a dry slope test. But then I am not much interested in those places anyway and see them as something to put up with as regards getting back into skiing. Better do that than nothing type of thing. I try ALL my skis in the resort on the terrain I want to use them on. I am very picky here but I will know if it is my kind of ski on the first couple of runs pretty much. Whether it is a ski I love will take a bit longer.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Wear The Fox Hat, I don' test for days at a time. A couple of hours is good, but you need varying gradient etc to judge, if you are going to spend 300quid + on a pair of skis.

As i and most others (except you) have agreed "the best place to try is the environment they were made for" and not a giant fridge!
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Wear The Fox Hat, I think I've already presented the -third- viewpoint: only test when the conditions are an absolute nightmare. Any ski that works well with you through that . . .
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
FastCarver, no, I agree, the BEST place to try skis is in a resort, but to invalidate everywhere else is a bit narrowminded.


comprex, sounds like you've skiied indoors! Wink
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Quote:

"the best place to try is the environment they were made for" and not a giant fridge


True. But I actually agree with WTFH. You can find out quite a lot about most skis by skiing them in a giant fridge. Not ideal but certainly do-able, if you know what you're feeling for.
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Is anyone even going to try and answer rednipkin's question?

Poor guy/girl, only their second post here and they're greeted by a load of male testosterone with associated bollox.

Would you post again? Puzzled
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I would go for the Heads.
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Rednipkin,

Never skied either ski but maybe the ski review links in this thread will help with info on the skis you are interested in

http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=3390

Fischer & Völkl make some cracking piste skis too - might be worth looking at them too. Try and get along to a demo day at one of the indoor slopes - (can anybody help out with demo day location & dates here?)
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
JT, I reckon I fall in love (or not) with a pair of skis on the first run. Often before the first run if I like the graphics enough. On which have you seen this seasons Volkls? I know they have a history of lairy graphics but these are tooo muuchhh!
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
David Murdoch wrote:
JT, I reckon I fall in love (or not) with a pair of skis on the first run.


DM, I agree with you.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
eEvans, you're right, of course, but what was your answer, again? wink

Rednipkin, I apologise for not addressing the topic of the thread. I've never skied the Scrambler 77 but i have the Head C160i. Can't therefore compare but can say the Head was a very nice on piste intermediate to advanced ski. It's one of those a fairly advanced skier could enjoy but that an intermediate would have no problems with either. It is easy to turn and holds an edge pretty well for some fun carves. One of those skis you're immediately comfortable with but when pushed still has something to give back.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Wear The Fox Hat, Cheers! I totally went head over heels for the Stockli Laser GSs in the shop, without even putting them on. Such a nice red and matching bindings too. If they still have them next year I may need to make an offer.
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Poster: A snowHead
slikedges, If I had anything to offer I would have ! rolling eyes Suffice to say the crap stopped ????? AND you had something real to offer rather than the Gonad-Sizing stuff !

Hey, I'm allowed to be an old prat aren't I?? wink
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
You're not really comparing like with like. The Salomon Scrambler 77 is a freeride ski with a 73mm waist. The Head Cyber iC 160 is an on-piste ski with a 64mm waist. Both are last year's models. This year's equivalents are the Salomon Scrambler 7, and the Head C260i (Head are trying to move on from the "Cyber" era). Very Happy
I agree that you probably can test a ski in a snowdome, but only for its performance on a low-gradient groomed slope, obviously. Don't get too grumpy WTFH, just keep thinking of last week's footie result....
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Martin Bell, I've been smug, yet polite about it all week!
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Martin Bell, Cheers Martin. Hear that Foxy wink
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
FastCarver, what? the bit about "you probably can test a ski in a snowdome"? Yup, I heard it loud and clear!
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You obviousy have selective eyesight.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
eEvans, only if i am too!
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Well, the initial poster got barely a sensible answer because we all know diddly about the skis in question with the exception of Martin B.
So Rednipkin, you will have to continue to make up a list of skis that fit your profile and cross rrference them with as many reviews as poss. You might want to start with a few ski mags - they should be coming out soon -. I don't know the skis but
they sound ok for the price. Most people on here wll demo the skis they are interested in the resort or even at an indoor slope....!!!!.
If you are near a snowdome such as MK ring up EB or the slope to find out about any demo days.
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David Murdoch,

Haven't seen those Volkls, in fact not been on many Volkls full stop. I'm not sure about big graphics too much, I like an understated ski design myself. The XL graphic is bordering on naff and the Legends look great, so great I might have to use a pair just the once because of it..!!

But only because they are rated a great ski, tho'
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Wear The Fox Hat, I probably should have said "you can test certain types of ski in a snowdome". With a SL ski or any tight-radius ski you can get a few turns in. With a legal (21m) radius GS ski you would need at least half the snowdome to get up enough speed, then you would be able to make 2 GS turns and would have to base your judgements on that. And with freeride skis (like the Scrambler 77 mentioned here) you obviously wouldn't be able to test their ability in deeper, softer snow, which of course is a big part of a freeride ski's performance.
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