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Is there anyone who actually owns a pair of B2s who doesn't like them?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
They get a bit of a hard time on here, and various other forums, so what I would ask, is there anyone who actually owns a pair of B2s who doesn't like them?

I really like mine, I really enjoy skiing in them, and think that they'll do pretty much anything, now I know that I'm biased, but surely if they're that bad, there will be someone out there who has actually owned a pair and hated them.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Kramer

You like them and that is all that matters. Have confidence in your own opinions. Don't worry about others.

How many glowing reviews do you need ?

If it really worries you, I am sure some kind Snowhead could oblige by slagging off B2s - even if it is just a wind up. Laughing
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Kramer, surely owners of B2s are a self selecting group and so are much more likely to like them than those who don't? wink

Anyway, I'd agree with Latchigo - if you like them, enjoy them and you're certainly not alone. I can't see the point of them for what I want to do, but everyone has different aspirations, skiing styles etc etc
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Kramer, Latchigo, I rented a pair and they were very slow at the start of a turn, had real problems holding an edge at Grand Montets, and felt decidedly "wooden" after the Rossi XX. Happy to oblige, glad you enjoy yours wink
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[quote=Kramer]Is there anyone thick enough to have paid that much without a demo and who also wound up getting lucky, and who wouldn't mind admitting to it?[/quote]

Umm. No.





Not a real quote, a real quote would have "" marks


Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Fri 9-09-05 16:00; edited 2 times in total
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I love my B2's, and you're right, nobody else out there is better qualified to tell me what will work for me. They've allowed me to take my skiing to places I never thought i'd be ... Very Happy
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I find that although demos are ok in theory, the problem is that a ski shop rarely has the type of ski that you want in exactly the right size for you unless they also hire them out.

I demo'ed my B2s back to back with a pair of apache recons, however the only size that the shop had were 160s of the recons, so it made a comparison almost useless with the 186 B2s.

I'm quite happy with my B2s, and everyone else that I've met who actually owns a pair really likes them, I was just wondering if there was anyone who had bought them and then decided that they didn't like them after all?
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Kramer,

If it is a small comfort I test drove a pair and decided to buy them but they had sold out in my size and I bought a pair of x screams instead, now sadly defunct. But I thought the B2's were pretty good.
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Kramer wrote:
........if they're that bad, there will be someone out there who has actually owned a pair and hated them.


rockyrobin, where are you when I need you? Feel free to step in anytime Laughing

kramer, I've never owned a pair of B2's but have demo'd the 04/05 B2 five times now (four times on & once off-piste) in a real attempt to like them. After the first couple of tests I was really concerned about my skiing as I couldn't understand why they were just 'ok' when loads of people raved about them Puzzled

I think that technology has very recently moved on (ie the 04/05 Metrons, the Recon & the 05/06 Top Fuels) & there are now skis available that do both on & off-piste in a single package better than the aging B2 which does everything 'ok'.

One reason for my problem with the B2's could be that I'm a recent newcomer to this sport & have therefore only ever received 'modern' instruction which best suits these new breed of skis. I would suspect (?) that the B2 would be relatively easy to ski by people who were originally schooled in 'traditional' technique.

I found the Recon (in 174) a vast improvement over the uninspiring B2's but the Recon is also pretty damp & lifeless compared to the Metron's &, I believe, the new Nordica Hot Rod range which I hope to try at the Pre-Season Bash.

Sorry Smile
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I reckon skis are very personal. I find the B2 very quick to turn, reasonably stable at speed, holds an icy edge pretty well, soft enough for bumps, give me enough support in slush and powder, heavy enough for crud, light enough to jump or lift on occasion, maybe not quite as lively as I'd like but fun enough and something's gotta give. That's why I'm now looking for a stiffer pair to complement it for days with harder conditions. However the B2 are as good an all-rounder as I hoped for.
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spyderjon, Here i am mate eager to oblige Laughing

I bought my B2's without demoing them with the intention of using them as a tool to improve my technique compared to my little Metron M9's which were making life far too easy for me.
First few runs out I hated them. Felt slow edge to edge and not brilliant for hardpack. Also struggled to initiate slow turns.
This was a few months ago. Last week they were ressurected as all my other skis were in at repair Sad
Before using them I gave them a thorough detune tip and tail to make turn initiation easier and ran the gummy stone full length a couple of passes to take the edge off them ever so slightly and make them less grabby.
Upon trying them they were fine for skidding though low speed carves were a no go just skidding and skarving with only large radius turns getting any jind of carving treatment just riding the sidecut.
This was as far as I got with my mate Spyderjon.
Couple of hours later I went back on to play further and the slope was really busy now so ended up cranking the speed up and this is where I found the B2's shine. Once speed is gained I could happily drop my knees into initiating a carve and hey presto I could load them up and pop from one carved turn to another. This is more like it! Smile
I think the problem I had with them is riding short radius skis for so long has left my technique ability needing some dusting off to get to grips with how to get the best out of the B2.
Going from 11 meter radius metrons that turn on autopilot to 17 meter B2's was my problem and no bad reflection on the B2's in hindsight.
I'm now thinking that riding them like a GS ski will be a blast and can get to grips with other types of turns once my technique adapts some muscle memory Laughing
Looks like i'll have to take back all I once said about my B2's. FWIW - I'm now taking such a liking to them i'm treating them to a pair of Fritschi Freeride bindings for the upcoming season. Cool
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
The general trend with people's opinions that i have read seems to be that the B2's are pretty good at almost everything, and are a great all rounder, but perhaps lack a bit of liveliness and stiffness as a result of this, and are therefore not the most exciting of skis...

I have just ordered a new pair of '05/'06 B2's ready for an instructor course which i am doing this coming season in Zermatt-i have read a couple of reviews on this season's B2's, and it seems that they have managed to make them a bit stiffer and more lively, which to me sounds like a good thing. They also both said that the ski had improved and overall were very positive. I demoed a pair of last season's B2's and quite enjoyed them-they did what they are meant to do, which is pretty much everything, and were enjoyable at the same time. However, whilst out there, i also demoed a pair of Atomic Metron M:11's....a very different type of ski! I must say, i did enjoy them, but they were quite hard work at times-more lively than the B2's, but in my opinion not as good an all-rounder.

I really do think that if you are looking to buy a ski that you can go out on and ski anywhere on the mountain, the B2 is right up there.

Out of interest, has anybody skied/heard reviews on the new B2. I would love to hear any feedback on them and how they differ from last year's model, and see whether they agree with the reviews i've already heard. Personally, i can't wait to get out and ski on my first ever pair of skis! snowHead Very Happy
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Chris_5000 wrote:
I also demoed a pair of Atomic Metron M:11's.....but in my opinion not as good an all-rounder


Sorry Chris but I just don't agree so I'd be pleased to hear your reasoning.

My demo'ing experience (two full days at La Rosiere switching between the M11 & the B2 for the first day & then the M11 & the b5 on the second day) is that the M11 is a far better on piste ski being a far superior carver with a wider range of turn shapes due to the tighter radius of 11m (v 18.5m for the B2) with way better edge hold on hardpack. They're not just a carver & they skid well although they do require subtle inputs. You ski them short (which is hard for some long time skiers to get their head around) which gives great manoeuvrability. Although they are heavy the swing weight is real low so this is not a problem on the slope, but the mass makes them far more stable through slush & crud than the B2. The M11 is also waaay quicker edge to edge than the B2.

Admittedly the above comments are all on-piste related but as these skis are really 60/40 on/off (maybe 50/50), but most people will actually spend the majority of time on piste, usually dictated by conditions rather than choice, so I think the on-piste performance is a major factor.

For off-piste the M11's 127-76-114 shape gives more off piste float on paper compared to the B2's 113-76-103 although the B2 is skied longer so that probably evens things up. I'd still prefer the M11's stability snow busting ability when it gets cut up etc.

The B2 however is a more relaxing 'easier' ride & is pretty forgiving to fore/aft balance errors compared to the M11, &, many of it's competitors. This is demonstrated by how easy the B2's are to braquage. I think that this 'easy ride' is one, if not the main reason the B2's are so well liked. This, with their relative softness also makes them suitable to a wide range of skier weights as I know owners ranging from 140lbs to 200+lbs. Whereas there's probably three different skis in the Metron range to cover this weight range & the correct one needs to be selected.

I tried the B2 again at the recent EB/Xscape test although I forgot to check if it was the new model. Apparently the 05/06 model is a few mm wider at 116-78-105 & tighter at 16.6m. Realskiers.com say that it's more like the original XX so it should offer slightly more performance & liveliness than the 04/05 version. This, as you say, should be a good thing.
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I skied the B2 for a week with the UCPA in Chamonix. Didn't like them, but they were a bit short and beaten up (second year of being skied hard every week). I found them wobbly at speed, hard to carve clean lines (really hard to carve without skidding a bit) and not powerful enough to bust crud easily. That being said , they were not limited to one turn radius and skidded easily (good in tight spots)
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spyderjon, You took the words right out of my mouth Laughing
I totally agree with you, hence my B2's now being relegated to touring only and a pair of M11's currently on order.
A friend of mine skis a pair of B2's all the time and I feel sorry for him when i'm hyper carving it up on my Metron's or ST11's. Anyone who is limiting themselves to a pair of B2's as a one ski quiver is missing out on a lot of fun that can be had on these more shapely skis.
If people trying the M11's are just riding the sidecut they're missing out on what the M11's/B5's are capable of. Get some decent edge set angulation going bouncing from turn to turn, bouncing from one short radius carved turn to another keeping the upper body quiet with skis crossing under. Then go back to a slower turning less lively ski will make you feel short changed IMO.
Also one thing I did notice the other day is how unstable the B2's are compard to the M11's going through chopped up snow at the side of the piste. The B2's have to be nursed through compared to the M11's just charging through whatever angle of turn you choose. As for braquage - I feel the M11's or B5's are way easier with shorter length and edge control was easier too.
I have the choice of either the B2's or the M11's as my staple ski for my coming season so have no bias to either due to ownership of only one. It's the M11 that will be coming with me every time. If they ever do a Telemark version of the M11 with no plate I can see me getting a pair and whacking some Fritschis on them and punting the B2's.

Please don't feel i'm bashing the B2's. They still have a place in my quiver Smile
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Maybe it's just me but there's something of the "If you really are a good skier you can't like the B2 wink " about all this. A bit like a 3 series beemer. Common as muck and regarded by many as driven by such. But a truly fine car consequently under-regarded and over-looked by those who feel themselves to be above it. I'm sure all your opinions are honest and accurate appraisals for yourselves and your skiing, but I consider its very versatility and suitability for many to be a strength and not a weakness. Of course I don't think it's a master of all trades but if one has to be very technically attentive all day in order to feel another ski betters its all round ability, frankly I suspect most couldn't be bothered. Little Angel
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Slikedges,

I totally agree with you, the versitility, user-friendliness and forgiving nature of the B2 is exactly what makes it a great ski. Yes, there are probably a few better performing skis around now, but many of them require a better skier to get the most out of them. The B2 is disregarded by those who feel they are better than us mere mortals on the snow.

How many British skiers really are that good and need the top end performance orientated skis? How many get to ski more than 2-3 weeks a season max? or can afford to have more than one pair of skis in their quiver? For most people, most of the time, the B2 is the best all round ski on the market.
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A mate of mine has a promo video of Bode hossing it down a course on B2's and apparently he does all right with them!!
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stuarth wrote:
A mate of mine has a promo video of Bode hossing it down a course on B2's and apparently he does all right with them!!


Mad Mad Mad
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The Rossignol B2 scores right up there at the top of the 2004/5 Freeride Ski Tests in Falline Skiing and Daily Mail Ski magazines, along with the K2 Apache Recons, both scoring well above the Atomic Metron range in all but short turns and edge hold (not surprising due to the metron's sidecut and construction). Although it has been suggested the case might be otherwise in this forum, the B2's finished in first place with testers for high speed, low speed, and groomed piste, their only weaknesses highlighted as being a slight lack of width (76mm) for powder / off piste compared with other wider skis in the group (although stil scoring higher than the Metron B5 which got the lowest score for powder / off-piste.)

Surely this suggests the B2 is a great ski??

Yes, they may be replaced as "the industry standard" by another manufacturer this season, but a good ski doesn't suddenly become a bad ski when a new model comes out.
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To be honest, i agree with slikedges- i think it is almost like people think they can't be a good skier if they like the B2.....however this is not the case.

I know a couple of ski instructors who ski on B2's and say they are the best skis they have ever had....and they are certainly not average "punter" skiers.
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BrightonSki wrote:
The Rossignol B2 scores right up there at the top of the 2004/5 Freeride Ski Tests in Falline Skiing and Daily Mail Ski magazines.....Surely this suggests the B2 is a great ski??


Don't believe everything you read in magazines were advertisers pounds/dollars carry a lot of influence. There's plenty of stuff on Epic re magazine testing methodology/accuracy etc which makes interesting reading.

Prior to purchasing I had a few days on the B2, the Recon, the M11/b5's & some Volkl's. All I can say (in my defence) is that my experience was quite different to that of the Daily Mail report & some of the other magazine reviews. I actually exchanged a few posts with Martin Bell on the very subject at the time.

However, my experiences & those of friends on these skis were all in line with Pete Keelty's Realskiers.com reports.

BrightonSki wrote:
Yes, they may be replaced as "the industry standard" by another manufacturer this season, but a good ski doesn't suddenly become a bad ski when a new model comes out.


Exactly (said in my best scouse accent). No it doesn't, but by the same reasoning that means others could now be better. Just try 'em & I'd be surprised if they didn't enhance your enjoyment. And you don't need to be Bode to ski 'em.
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Thing is, Rossi are changing the B2 significantly. I liked a bit better the stiffer Bandit XX and it seems that Rossi are going wider and stiffer. In fact they seem to be replicating the Dynastar Legend 8000, a ski I enjoyed much more than the B2. Like i said before they are not a bad ski, just not very exciting, especially if you are seeking a ski that blasts out of a turn.
Chris_5000, diffrent strokes for diffrent folks. None is arguing that the B2 is rubbish but rathe that they found something that is more fun for them.
BrightonSki, don't put too much faith in those tests, as they closely reflect advertising ties.
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I haven't spent much time on Atomics but asking around the higher level skiers I know, they only seem to be favoured by a relatively limited number of people, but these people really swear by them and the ski revolutionises their skiing and I guess must just really suit their skiing style. Others think they're heavy, not great in bumps and powder and not particularly easy to turn. The only way I'm going to know is if I make the effort to get on some B5/M11 (and I'm also curious about the Recons) this season.
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Anyone reading these last few posts would think that the Rossi B2 and the Atomic Metron series were the only skis available rolling eyes
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Arno, no, the only skis available are actually Salomons, except for a couple of B2s that slip through! wink
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Arno,

The topic of this thread is the likeability of the Rossi B2 !

I've tried the Metron B5 on a day's demo in the three valleys and found them hard work and demanding to ski. Great for short radius turns, not bad in the limited off-piste available, but oh so tough on the legs if you like to cover some mileage, and very unforgiving in the moguls. Yes, they are probably a great ski for a technically good expert, or anyone who likes to ski fast and aggressively all over the mountain, but for me they were just too hard work which takes some of the fun away. Maybe will address this with the new season's Metron range - a little more compliancy and weight would go a long way to making this ski more accessible to mere mortals.

The B2's may be lacking the top end performance that the B5 Metrons would no doubt have, but they allow me to ski anywhere I want, with a massive grin all day long. Very Happy Isn't this what your typical British skier (i.e. 1-2 weeks a year) wants?? Most of us never have the opportunity to put in the time needed to get above advanced level??

Not tried the K2 Recon's, Stormriders, Dynastars or new Nordica's etc but really interested to compare them with my B2's, as well as Rossi's new bandit range.

oh roll on December,serious withdrawal symptoms now Crying or Very sad
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BrightonSki, From what you say of your experience with the b5 I'd recommend trying the M11.

Please excuse the personal question but how heavy are you?

I'm not tall at 5'9" but I'm pretty heavy at 200lbs. I plan to be 185lbs by Xmas when my season start proper & when you add my backpack etc the b5 is fine for me all day. But if I was 30lbs lighter I'd certainly be on the M11's. I could handle the b5's at 170lbs but I wouldn't fancy it all day every day for a week - well not at my level of expertise anyway.

Apparently the 172cm b5's are too much ski for all but the heaviest truly expert skiers.

Come to think of it I'm probably just too damned fat for the B2's Laughing
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You know it makes sense.
spyderjon wrote:


Apparently the 172cm b5's are too much ski for all but the heaviest expert skiers.



I think you could re-arrange those words a bit and describe another feature of metron M5s - Apparently the 172cm b5's are truly the heaviest ski!! wink
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stuarth, This years Neox bindings and rail setup are a LOT lighter than last years. Comparing my ST11's to the B5 of similar length theres not much in it.
This is why my B2's felt like they needed nursing through the chopped up stuff at the side of the piste as they are quite light and flexy. The stiffer and heavier B5's were a lot more reassuring in these conditions.
Perhaps if this years B2 is stiffer and heavier it will be a more versatile ski than last years?
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I'm with snowbunny on this, the B2 is the new Xcream to me....
Now if they are stiffer this year that might be because they are trying to match the XL or b5, 8000 or trying to get back to the XX which I preferred as it happens.
But what does it matter? we aren't on them, you are, and if they do what you want, how you want, then stick with them. Picking a so-called uber ski that gives you cred in the lift queue doesn't help if you can't rely on them/turn them in those tight spots.

As I have said before my ski buddy skis xcreams - which I wouldn't - and he is hard to keep up with on tricky pitches. What works with what you have got, works IMO
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JT,
Quote:

I'm with snowbunny on this, the B2 is the new Xcream to me....

I do agree with your point that this ski will appeal to many different skiers. If the 06 model is stiffer, it can only be good news for the performance, of the ski. As to the idea that the B2 might be like a Salomon X-Scream, well I'm not fussed, but I can think of one snowHead who would absolutely hate the idea of that analogy. Laughing Laughing ise, where are you? Laughing Laughing
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snowbunny,

I'm sure Ise can look after himself, I think he knows what he wants from a ski so if the B2 fits the usage they get used.
And I actually didn't think the Xcreams were too bad...well not the ones I used to ski on. Haven't been back on them in a few years tho'
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JT,
Quote:

I'm sure Ise can look after himself, I think he knows what he wants from a ski so if the B2 fits the usage they get used.

Quite.
But when he makes comments like...
Quote "You get picked up at the airport, I throw out any punter kit on the way, Salomon skis, snowblades, soft ski boots"
Aligning Rossi B2's and Salomon X-Screams.....
I duck and run Very Happy
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Everyone is different, everyone skis differently, everyone wants different things from a ski, so therefore different skis fit different people. We can't earmark any ski as the best ski out there for everybody, just for us.
I think B2's strengh and weakness is exactly this, they do everything very well but nothing great. Reminds me a bit of Gloria Arroyo...(sorry)

Kind off ironic then, the first time i used B2's i didn't like them, but now own a pair. But I get pretty frustrated with them, because they've improved my skiing in many conditions, but at the same time have limeted further progress, which is why ive been using other skis with them... I have complete confidence in these skis though... But all great things get critics, because everyone wants perfection, but as someone much wiser than all of us once said, 'we must look inside for perfection', which tranlates into go back to ski school!

P.S. Selling a pair of 176 B2's with bindings, poles, bag etc. PM me.
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First time I tried them - in 182 or something - I hated them, went straight back to XX's.
Second time I tried them in 177 - ish, they were better but I then knew they weren't for me - something missing!!
Swapped next day for M75's which I had a spendid day in the deep stuff.

Swapped M75's for XL's and will stick with them. Might try the new B2 if I can't get XL's.
If that doesn't work I wil be buying..and no surprises what I wil buy, even though I really don't want to lug skis around again.
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Spyderjon,

I'm just under 170lbs at 5'10" so you might be right. Will try to give some M11's a go this season.

The B2's still do it for me though, confidence inspiring, no worries fun skis, suits me!
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I'm not a brilliant skier, but I've been told that I've got nice technique. I weigh 220lbs and I'm 6' (ish). I've not tried the Metrons, but I have tried the recons, but only in a short size. The B2s are by far my favourite ski that I've used. People tell me that they're too soft, but I can get them to pop me out of short radius turns no problem (and I'm not a small bloke), I also find them really good for largeish radius pure carved turns. The only place that I find them to be less than ideal is when it's icy and hard pack, when unless they're really sharp, I can find it difficult to get them to hold an edge.

I do agree that there is a bit of snobbery about B2s, but there are many instructors, hosts, guides who've I've seen using them, so they can't be all bad.
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spyderjon wrote:
BrightonSki wrote:
The Rossignol B2 scores right up there at the top of the 2004/5 Freeride Ski Tests in Falline Skiing and Daily Mail Ski magazines.....Surely this suggests the B2 is a great ski??


Don't believe everything you read in magazines were advertisers pounds/dollars carry a lot of influence.


Not in DMS&S, mate. Our testers ski them and score them purely according to their performance. In the 7 years since I have been Equipment Editor, we have had a couple of occasions where manufacturers have actually cancelled a season's series of ads because the results didn't come out the way they wanted.
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Nice one, Martin. When I used to test skis for Ski Survey magazine we similarly had a major advertiser cancel advertising because they didn't like our test results.

It's almost a 'test' in itself of editorial impartiality!
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