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Freeride/tour boots: good value? Or just convenient?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Quote:

Don't forget that getting knocked about on shite snow because your boots are too stiff won't help your skiing either, whatever your ability. Snug-fitting, stiff boots are good for precise control on prepped, hard snow and that's about their only forte. I wish I'd come to appreciate that several years sooner.


Errm, just loosen the coller buckles? wink rolling eyes rolling eyes rolling eyes
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
meh wrote:
Serriadh - Softer boots nominally make the ski harder to control obviously depending on the ski, your ability and what you're trying to ski. They tend to be lighter though which is nice going uphill. I'm tottling about in Garmont Radiums which are a nice combination of light and stiff. I've also skied Dynafits on piste without exploding and dying. Smile


moffatross wrote:
My final 10 days last season were skiied exclusively on S4's clipped into Dynafits and my old alpine boots are now permanently retired. Those last 10 days were a 70/30 mix of on and off the piste and now, I honesty can't think of any good reason why I'd want to reinvest in Alpine. Very Happy


Its hard to get a good picture of what bindings can and cannot do... seems like the vast majority of stuff on the internet is written by giant americans (is it me, or do most reviews start with '6'7", 250lbs, aggressive skiier...' on other sites?). I'm a slightly more modest 5'11 and about 12st and I've never been 'aggressive' enough to overpower a binding set to some sensible rating. Quite often the same people mention things like 'my girlfriend uses dynafits for resort skiing', but I can't think of a polite way to say 'yeah, but is she more substantial than me?' Embarassed

It would be great to have one set of skis, one set of bindings and one set of boots. Nonetheless, whilst I can be reasonably assured that a decent set of alpine bindings will last me a fair old time even if I spend a few weeks riding over icy lumps. If I do somehow manage to them it'll be less than half the price of some tech bindings to replace. I also believe (but have no particular evidence to back this up) that alpine soles in alpine bindings are probably the best things to use to avoid twisty knee popping fun. Not that I make a habit of dramatic wipeouts, mind you.

CEM wrote:
Serriadh, we do have dynafit titan in stock and some salomon quest (if you are not wanting a low tech compatible and have a "high volume" foot") they just haven't made it onto the website yet... kind of busy fitting boots right now and the website does get neglected (no excuse)


That's good to know. As and when I finally make my mind up, I'll drop you a line and see what's available!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
SMALLZOOKEEPER wrote:
Quote:

All you can say is in a standardised testing environment AT boots don't release as consistently as normal alpine boots from the same alpine binding.


If the toe height is adjustable like the new Marker Jester or a Salomon S9, no reason why they shouldn't.


The test was done in a binding with adjustable toe height.
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Quote:
Errm, just loosen the coller buckles? wink rolling eyes rolling eyes rolling eyes

Why would I want to now ? rolling eyes After about 200 days skiing, I have determined that 85 flex Spirit 4's work better for me just about everywhere and with far less need for fine tuning on the go than the Rossi Power Race lampost stubs I'd used from about my 20th day. wink

Edit ... to be fair, the Rossis were truly shagged and my skiing had improved somewhat over their lifetime. Laughing

Serriadh wrote:

moffatross wrote:
My final 10 days last season were skiied exclusively on S4's clipped into Dynafits and my old alpine boots are now permanently retired. Those last 10 days were a 70/30 mix of on and off the piste and now, I honesty can't think of any good reason why I'd want to reinvest in Alpine. Very Happy


Its hard to get a good picture of what bindings can and cannot do... seems like the vast majority of stuff on the internet is written by giant americans (is it me, or do most reviews start with '6'7", 250lbs, aggressive skiier...' on other sites?). I'm a slightly more modest 5'11 and about 12st and I've never been 'aggressive' enough to overpower a binding set to some sensible rating. Quite often the same people mention things like 'my girlfriend uses dynafits for resort skiing', but I can't think of a polite way to say 'yeah, but is she more substantial than me?' Embarassed

It would be great to have one set of skis, one set of bindings and one set of boots. Nonetheless, whilst I can be reasonably assured that a decent set of alpine bindings will last me a fair old time even if I spend a few weeks riding over icy lumps. If I do somehow manage to them it'll be less than half the price of some tech bindings to replace. I also believe (but have no particular evidence to back this up) that alpine soles in alpine bindings are probably the best things to use to avoid twisty knee popping fun. Not that I make a habit of dramatic wipeouts, mind you.


I wouldn't want to challenge any assertions on release safety but I rarely fall so don't worry about it too much. I'm only 70kg but have pretty strong legs as a result of lots of hill running and I ski quite aggressively. My FT12 Dynafits are set at release 8 (as you probably know that's not the direct equivalent of an Alpine binding DIN rating as Dynafits don't conform to the same standards for release) and have carved really quite hard and fast on firm snow and not popped off. They also released just when they needed to when I walloped hard into unseen terrain submerged in powder snow.

As for durability, the thing that concerns me most is damage to the heel & toe of the boots and subsequent damage to the metal inserts rather than the bindings themselves. This is much more of a worry for off-piste skiing as for me, a certain amount of hoofing it amongst lacerating rocks is inevitable
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
meh, With mobile AFD, we've found that Vibram or other rubber soles release just fine infact engage the afd pehaps petter than the standard polymers. With toe height adjusted perfectly that is, I guess again there is room here for error so again we can toss all this into the "randomiser" Little Angel
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, I demand science! Wink

I think as long as the person in question can get their chosen setup working in a manner that they are personally are happy with then if they tear their own leg off it's their own silly fault. Very Happy

I occasionally ski with my toes locked out. Skullie
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
meh, 3 ticks to all that!!!!
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Regarding Dynafits in the resort, I have never actually overpowered them. I'm 5'11 and a bit under 70kg and skied ST10s with the DIN at 9. I was able to ski exactly as I normally would in all terrain, although I did my best to stay on the ground and avoid hard moguls.

Despite the performance being equal to alpine bindings, I did not like using the Dynafits inbounds at all. The connection between the binding and boot is metal on metal, and the vibrations from the firm snow transmitted straight to my legs. Many people have no issue with this, but I would encourage you to try Dynafits out on a firm day in the resort before selecting them as an everyday binding.

Another great option is mounting the skis with Sollyfits or Dynafits: http://bindingfreedom.com/
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brshain wrote:
Despite the performance being equal to alpine bindings, I did not like using the Dynafits inbounds at all. The connection between the binding and boot is metal on metal, and the vibrations from the firm snow transmitted straight to my legs. Many people have no issue with this, but I would encourage you to try Dynafits out on a firm day in the resort before selecting them as an everyday binding.


my feelings precisely. i just don't like the feel of my dynafit setup on packed snow
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If you buying Dynafits to mostly ski on piste or even mostly from lifts you are doing something wrong. Very Happy
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Sollyfits are exactly the sort of thing I've been looking at. I did start off looking at the Marker Baron, but there are an awful lot of people out there expressing dissatisfaction with them for various reasons.

Anyway, I think I've more or less settled on getting some stiff freeride/tour boots now... given that they can be used just fine as alpine boots, worst case scenario is that I end up wanting some lighter boots for more strenuous tours, and that's by no means a certainty.

Been looking at skis this morning. Seems like there's not really much chance of being able to compromise there and get single set that will do for everything... ho hum. I'll probably be back with more questions about those in future Smile
ski holidays
 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Serriadh wrote:
Been looking at skis this morning. Seems like there's not really much chance of being able to compromise there and get single set that will do for everything... ho hum.


Scott Crusairs. Little Angel
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
The Crusairs were one of the first ones I looked at... I'm still trying to find similar skis (or at least reviews of similar skis!) for comparison, without much success. Maybe I'm just crap at searching though. I'm leaning towards slightly heftier all-mountain skis at the moment, but I don't think I trust myself to stick in some extra gym time over the next 4 months or so that the extra weight won't slow me down too much on the uphill bits!
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Scott Crusairs.

I was stroking some of these and another couple of scott models the end of last year, they are very nice and were bigged up by the guy in the shop, plus light.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Since last year I ski everything in scarpa touring boots. It works fine: I even skied Megawatts with Barons on them.. Now looking at some whitedot preachers as a do it all ski, as a replacement for my Armada ARV's (which are by the way really nice do it all ski's and I will keep them for touring and ice) I just want a bit more float (and I do not really tour a lot).

Never I will go back to alpine boots: they hurt! Also bootfitted: they hurt less but they still hurt! And the sole is brilliant. Only thing is you are very limited with binding choice....

If the preachers will be mine I am considering Marker Griffons, as they seem to have the same toe piece as the barons.

Specs griffon:
Vorderbacken Tripe Pivot Elite
AFD-Gleitplatte stainless steel, height adjustable

Specs Barons:
Vorderbacken Triple Pivot Elite
AFD-Gleitplatte stainl. steel, height adjustable

They are just lighter and you stand lower on the skis...
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
jbob, so you recommend the Crusairs based on some guy in a shop bigging them up and you thinking they look nice?
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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horizon, you sound like my wife.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
skiester wrote:
Never I will go back to alpine boots: they hurt! Also bootfitted: they hurt less but they still hurt! And the sole is brilliant. Only thing is you are very limited with binding choice....


For AT boots? The heavier ones with interchangeable soles often have optional alpine soles so they'll work with any old binding. I know there are some Salomon binding toe pieces with adjustable height that can be made to fit touring soles too... the STH-XX Driver models should, for example.
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jbob, let's hope we ski together this winter and share thoughts on skis bought based on someone else's review. I've got three pairs!

Your wife sounds like a sensible person - but then I'm sure the selection process you went through was more thorough wink
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
sadly enough mine do not have interchangeable soles, plus I like the soles when I walk...
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so let me reverse this question, when would someone who has only ever had alpine boots 'benefit' from touring boots? Is it when they start doing full day tours, hut to hut kinda stuff??
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
kitenski, i guess a few things might make you change to touring boots:

- your alpine boots aren't comfortable enough for the walking/skinning you want to do
- you find them noticeably too heavy
- they aren't up to something more technical (eg don't feel good when scrambling on rocks or climbing snow slopes; don't give range of movement in the ankle for technical bits of skinning)
- you want to use dynafits
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Serriadh, You coming to Cham? Swing by, we'll sort out the boots and get your set up ready for the course if needs be. Little Angel
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Serriadh, Have to say i'd be a little concerned about all this new kit at once, if there are any minor issues it will be tricky to identify the cause. Start with boots, during which we can talk through skis and chat about pros and cons of various binding systems. Little Angel
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
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Arno wrote:
kitenski, i guess a few things might make you change to touring boots:

- your alpine boots aren't comfortable enough for the walking/skinning you want to do
- you find them noticeably too heavy
- they aren't up to something more technical (eg don't feel good when scrambling on rocks or climbing snow slopes; don't give range of movement in the ankle for technical bits of skinning)
- you want to use dynafits


You forgot the most important one! Looking 'core' in the lift line. Laughing
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meh, and, of course, if you are concerned that your alpine boots don't match your trousers
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