 Poster: A snowHead
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Years ago, I had the following insights given to me by a couple of brothers who had worked a few seasons (3 Vallees & Portes du Soliel):
- most resorts are controlled by a few families, who control the local council, own most of the shops/hotels/restaurants/rental shops and the lifts.
- the resorts are run for them, not the guests.
- they charge what they do because they can.
- they charge what they do because they make no effort in the summer season, so have to make a year's income in half a year.
plus a few other equally disparaging views that I've long since forgotten.
All that said (and who knows how much of it is true), surely the fact that the £ has lost 1/4 of its value against the € has been the biggest recent influence on cost. A 33% price increase is difficult to swallow. Same in Canada, I'm afraid to say.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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This will probably fill people with horror. This is one of the reasons why I am going to go back to Bulgaria next year as its cheap and the skiing is good. I really resent paying 35 euros for a lukewarm spaghetti bolognese in France.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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If f you think anywhere in France is expensive you should try Verbier (or rather you shouldn't). I'm not going to Switzerland again till the exchange rate changes a lot. It has gone in about 5 yerars from about 2.5 CHF to the pound to about 1.5.
In Verbier you pay about the equivalent of 530€ per day for a guide instead of the 350€ in France I'm used to, or how about 400 CHF for a one week lift pass (about 325€)! 
It was a relief to get to France and pay (literally) about half for my hotel compared to the cheapest I could find in Verbier (actually not in Verbier but in Le Chable).
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Sun 1-05-11 13:06; edited 3 times in total
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| jb1970 wrote: |
| This will probably fill people with horror. This is one of the reasons why I am going to go back to Bulgaria next year as its cheap and the skiing is good. I really resent paying 35 euros for a lukewarm spaghetti bolognese in France. |
I'm more filled with horror that anyone, anywhere would pay that for spag bol (even a hot one) than I am about Bulgaria 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
I really resent paying 35 euros for a lukewarm spaghetti bolognese in France.
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This will probably fill people with horror
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Yes as it's absolute bullshite.
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snowball,
| Quote: |
or how about 400 CHF for a one week lift pass (about 325€)!
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But also see my post above, the 6 day price for a 4 valley lift pass is about €20 more expensive than a Mont Blanc unlimited, but 4v offers a lot of discounts for families and the lift pass for us works out a lot cheaper in 4 valleys (As did self catering accommodation)
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| Lizzard wrote: |
jb1970, the sort of restaurants charging 35€ for a main course are not serving spaghetti bolognese.  |
The sort of people who pay €35 for a main course would not normally then decide to go to Bulgaria.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
that's a Cervinia only pass which gives access to 150km of piste, a smaller area than 2Alpes or any of the other high profile French resorts.
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that's smaller than a lot of low profile French resorts too.
Another thread full of tired generalisations. Someone goes to one of the world's top resorts and concludes that "France" is expensive. If they went to St Anton would they conclude that "Austria" is expensive? If they bought a drink at a café on the Grand Canal in Venice would they conclude that "Italy" was expensive?
Apples and pears.
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Another thread full of tired generalisations.
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pam w, best coment in this thread 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| pam w wrote: |
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that's a Cervinia only pass which gives access to 150km of piste, a smaller area than 2Alpes or any of the other high profile French resorts.
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that's smaller than a lot of low profile French resorts too.
Another thread full of tired generalisations. Someone goes to one of the world's top resorts and concludes that "France" is expensive. If they went to St Anton would they conclude that "Austria" is expensive? If they bought a drink at a café on the Grand Canal in Venice would they conclude that "Italy" was expensive?
Apples and pears. |
Is it a generalisation, personally I don't think so. Yes there are places like where you are that are more reasonable, I have been to Valloire and that wasn't too bad, the lift pass relatively speaking was a bargain.
But let's look at where the tour operators go, which is probably how 90% of British skiers take there hols, remember Snowheads are the exception not the norm. They go to the French Massifs and quite frankly these places are out to bleed you dry. And as long as good old Johnny foreigner keeps on throwing his hard earned €'s accros the bar/restaurant they will continue to do so.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Kel, I think we've already established that equivalent high-profile TO-favoured resorts in other countries charge similar prices for their lift passes if not necessarily for beer and spaghetti.
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I never feel that I'm paying over the odds for the Three Valley lift pass because the way in which a) the lift system connects up brilliantly over an immense area b) the lifts and runs are well signposted and c) the pistes are exceptionally well-maintained, is IME second to none. It was very impressive, in Val Thorens last week, to look out of the window at any hour of the night and see the mountain alive with piste bashers harvesting snow to keep the pistes going.
The theme of how to eat and drink without bankrupting yourself, even in the big French resorts, has been done to death on here. It is possible.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Quote: |
| Another thread full of tired generalisations. |
pam w, But you were telling me that Val Thorens wasn't expensive in another thread a couple of weeks ago 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Last week me and MrsW (well me just really Confused ) paid 31 Euros for an open cheese butty, a lasagne (no chips), can of pop and a cup of sludge that they called coffee.
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Why?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Wayne wrote: |
What tight fisted git came up with the idea of an Open Sandwich.
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Actually I think the Earl of Sandwich's original Sandwiches (for when he was gambling) were open sandwiches.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Lizzard wrote: |
| I think we've already established that equivalent high-profile TO-favoured resorts in other countries charge similar prices for their lift passes ... |
Similar yes but a little more expensive in my recent experience (7 days pass in Ischgl was 192 Euros 3 weeks ago with many more lifts open and much more skiing available than the same week at say the 3V's). And then there're the hidden extras you might have to pay for in France ... http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=76341
Not that the price of a lift pass would make one spot of difference to which Eurozone destination I chose (30 to 40 euros per day is good value whatever), nor the cost of eating at a motorway service station (sorry, I mean mountain restaurant) either. They're pretty much all revolting.
Your own Deux Alpes is a fine case in point. Inside a restaurant on the hill and you could just as well be by the side of the M6. Ski to town for lunch and you get great views, ambience, space, quality, service and value.
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moffatross, you clearly haven't eaten in the Diable au Coeur recently. And I'm not sure how you can describe piste rescue as a 'hiden extra' when a) the rates are clearly posted at every ticket window and b) you're not actually obliged to land on your @rse in the snowpark and dismantle your spine.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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10€ each (Spag Bol & Huge Salad ) La Fee Restaurant LDA with great views.
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No, you're right Lizzard, and I probably won't be sitting on any of those tables next time I'm in L2A either ... http://www.lediableaucoeur.com/index.php?to=carte ... although their snack menu looks a little more reasonable and might try them out. Don't you think town would offer more for a 10 Euro lunchtime meal budget though ?
Edit ... Colin_B. That's my kind of value. 
Regarding piste rescue, call it what you want but it's an extra in France that's included in similarly priced access elsewhere. Thankfully I've never needed it but I don't think it's fair to infer that it's just park poseurs who need the sled down.
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But my hobby horse complaint about France is cost of passes for teens, they don't get charged adult prices anywhere else but in France. Recently I paid 400€ for 7 day passes with insurance for my 15 year daughter and me in St Anton and 600€ for 9 day passes with insurance in LDA. Don't mention family passes I don't ski with a family 
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moffatross, eating in town is always cheaper. However, you were complaining about service station food, not prices.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Alot of talk about prices in france, but go to Bansko then, its cheaper, but limited skiing, and pay to bulgarian maffia,, a prefere to pay to legal busniess,,
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I don't think it's fair to infer that it's just park poseurs who need the sled down.
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Don't do it then.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I'm done with France, unless it's for short breaks. Italy has my Euros from now on.
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You know it makes sense.
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moffatross, erm. I was taking the pîss, I'm afraid. Imply/infer, two different things.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Kel wrote: |
Is it a generalisation...
But let's look at where the tour operators go, which is probably how 90% of British skiers take there hols, remember Snowheads are the exception not the norm. They go to the French Massifs and quite frankly these places are out to bleed you dry. |
Well, (I haven't got the numbers infront of me but from memory and for the sake of some accuracy...) something like 65-70% use tour ops, the rest are DIY or property owners. And maybe 40% go to France. Austria & Italy account for another 40%, and the rest is taken up by Switz, Andorra, Bulgaria, Scandinavia, USA, Canada and up-coming destinations like Spain, Slovenia. Mustn't forget Scotland either - those 5 resorts probably saw as many skier days from UK skiers as USA.
The talk at the school gates for a few years now has been how pricey France has got yet people still keep going and that's possibly because they aren't stupid and know that the main areas of fleecing can be in bars and up the mountain. You don't HAVE to be fleeced, although fleeced is an apt word as it describes the sheep mentality that often leads to resort choice. Chalet hol with free wine and a few boxes of cheap stubby lager on the balcony, makes it no more or less affordable than anywhere else.
My problem with the place isn't the pricing, it's the poor humour with which the funds are often extracted. Most of us have no problem paying higher-than-home prices for good food/drink with good service and nice surroundings/ambience. I think the French fall down at the service end of things so it can feel like a proper fleecing - whereas the Austrians score big time on service and do it for way less.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Bode Swiller, If I understand yoy? You realy have point about this, the french serviceminded is not very good, and its a real problem for the tourism in france, but they are funny, if you talk good french and have a french family, its different, your are more accepted, but they must think in a different way, we can all the time make the choice where to go for skiing
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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we had some excellent, and friendly, service in val thorens last week - we actively chose to visit a different place for apres after indifferent and slow service at the usual place.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Wayne, .. DOH !!!
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| Why is skiing in France so expensive ?, |
-- 'cos it's worth it
-- 'cos it isn't Italy ( the pits with skiing)
--
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I witnessed service both friendly and unfriendly, just as I would expect to experience in any other country. I didn't avail myself of unfriendly service more than once and I wasn't ripped off at all.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hurtle, that whole 'voice of reason' thing isn't impressing anyone, you know.
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holidayloverxx, Good point - I can think of three places, that one included, where the service and attitude of the staff added to the experience - you just accept that's what it costs and if you are still happy to pay it - having been before it came as no suprise. (Didn't stop me rolling my eyes when I got back at the thought of the rate my wallet emptied though )
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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MoodyFFS, Mine was the salad
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FAQ
) paid 31 Euros for an open cheese butty, a lasagne (no chips), can of pop and a cup of sludge that they called coffee.
) + bussinesses that take the view of "sod it, I can charge what I like and if you don't like then someone else will pay it anyway = me skint 