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What do you think is the biggest challenges or problems we face as snowboarders?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
rob@rar wrote:
stevomcd wrote:
2) Instruction/ability - hugely more snowboarders than skiers are self-taught to a greater or lesser extent. I think this shows in ability levels on the hill. Sure, snowboarders can zoom around the place pretty quickly (and in control) but most people's riding plateaus big-time because they lack some technique basics that would allow them to progress.

If the number of snowboarding lessons that I see is typical I think that's right. Many, many more ski lessons compared to snowboarding lessons taking place. While I'm not a snowboarder so maybe not in the best position to comment, I do see a very high proportion of boarders who rely on kicking their board around with the backfoot and a lot of sideslipping to get around the mountain. I see fewer skiers relying on the equivalent low level technique to get around the place.

So maybe the key thing which is generally holding snowboarding back is a lack of available instruction and/or the perception that lessons aren't necessary to get better?


I completely object to skiers moaning about snowboarders side slipping and doing quick kick turns. They are both completely valid techniques.

Take a look at terjes first decent vid here ... http://video.mpora.com/watch/qZ8eXazjq/

He sideslips - kicks - sideslips - kicks to get his position in the main gully.

If you suggest he needs lessons ... then... pfft you can tell him... not me Very Happy

Tux
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Bum Fluff, in my opinion is the biggest challenge that faces snowboarders. I mean if you have spent all your pocket money ( bar the bit you have saved for your eighth!!! ) on off yer back bottom baggy do not fit trousers, your not gonna be able to afford a razor are you.

I would say acne is possibly the second biggest challenge, which is most likely why you don't shave.

Which all brings me to the serious point of my thread.

The biggest challenge a boarder faces is image, that is how others see you, i think a lot of that has to do with things like language used ( awesome, dude, megga, ) and clothing.

My mate snow boards in a Fartbag !!!! and he is very posh, He can often be spotted on the piste as he boards past you saying things like " Sorry old chap, one did not see one Yah".
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tuxpoo wrote:
I completely object to skiers moaning about snowboarders side slipping and doing quick kick turns. They are both completely valid techniques.
Yes, I agree entirely that they are both valid techniques, and they have an essential place in the toolbox for all snowboarders. But it seems to me that a fair number of snowboarders can only steer and and get down slopes by mostly kicking around their backfoot and mostly sliding sideways. I'm only a skier (although have dabbled on a board) so I might not be recognising that the snowboarders I see using these techniques on moderate blue runs are, in fact, choosing the best way of getting down the hill. So I've added a viewpoint (not a moan) as a non-snowboarder to this thread, which I thought might be helpful (or at the very least interesting), but should probably make no further comment.

And before you suggest that I'm on a skier v. snowboarder crusade, the equivalent technique for skiers is creating turns by swinging their shoulders, making every turn a short radius one, usually interspersed with a traverse of some kind.
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tuxpoo, agree, they are perfectly acceptable techniques, and Rob@rar if you've never seen skiers furiously holding onto their snowplough in an inappropriate part of the mountain, then you've been luckier than I who've been caught behind many before now. One groups no worse than the other for sloppy technique IMHO.
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I think rob@rar is right, actually.

lots of my snowboarding mates have never had a lesson. cost of lessons seem to be the big reason as they feel lessons are unneccessary (as they can actually "get down" anything too). there is also I think a slight "macho" culture about saying you taught yourself. you could also look good in front of your mates by compensating for weaker technique with slightly less regard for personal safety on the flattish (say, easy reds and below) bits - i.e. .

I can ride most slopes and fair amounts of off-piste in control and am a far better rider than any of my mates, but (perhaps because I have another mindset / attitude towards coaching due to having done another sport at international level) I still have lessons just about every time I go to the mountains as there is always something to work on.
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i.e. go as fast as you can (slightly quick on the trigger there...)
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SooperSlyder, question re your mates - were they skiers prior to being boarders or did they take straight to snowboarding?
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I must admit I have never had a boarding lesson. That doesn't stop me carving my way around the hills or squirting a bit of powder up. I don't do the park though and have no interest in it. It seems the preserve of the kids and their freestyle skills can be great.

We have all seen people way out of their depth, on boards, skis, blades and now on those scooter like things. Having rubbish technique is not the preserve of any one category of mountain user.
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bar shaker, interested in how you learned to ride. Was it by learning from friends or some other instructional material (book DVD) Did you have any previous experience with board sports (skateboard, surfing) or a more trial-and-error approach?
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Summary of problems so far:

- can't do flats
- can't stand still
- can't do drags
- can't traverse
- have to walk
- not enough tuition

So, (leaving aside all the adolescent image-related rubbish) our biggest problem/challenge seems to be that we're frankly quite cr@p at snowboarding. Laughing Laughing Mind you, that's my biggest problem on skis as well.

PS: bar shaker, I'd bet a week's wages that you're not carving at all. I don't think I've ever seen a self-taught boarder who could identify it, let alone do it.
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Lizzard wrote:
I don't think I've ever seen a self-taught boarder who could identify it, let alone do it.


I'm self taught and I can carve (on a good day) not throughout the whole run but I'm still learning. If you want some validation - carving is a technique where you use the sidecut of the board to take a turn. The back of the board follows through at all times, no slipping - no I did not google it!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I've been boarding for 19 years, doing 3-4 weeks a year for the past 6 years. In my 20s I windsurfed professionally sailing for 7 years at 'top flight' level and I skate boarded from 12 years old to 16 years old. When I learnt to board, there were no instructors. I read a book, put myself on a nursery slope with tiny kids and rode down it until I could do it without falling over. The accepted technique back then involved lots of upper rotation. It must have looked awful.

Lizzard, There's some **** comes out of your mouth isn't there? I'm in Tignes and will be out boarding with Rorie next week. I'll get him to report back then I'll pm you an address so you can post the money.

I never had a windsurfing lesson either.
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Richard_Sideways, Once I could get around, albeit with arms flailing around, I watched other riders and tried to copy their stance and movements. Stance is everything in boarding and you can instantly spot a good rider from a nervous newbie just by their posture on the board.
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You know it makes sense.
Never had a lesson either, and pretty sure I can lay down some nice carves. Been snowboarding for about 15 years, last 8 getting a lot of days in, and surfed for nearly 30 years.

I think the notion that you need to have had lessons to be able to snowboard well is a load of b0ll0cks TBH.

What it really needs, IMO is a lot of practice and growing a set.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Quote:

I think the notion that you need to have had lessons to be able to snowboard well is a load of b0ll0cks TBH.

Have a look at them bext time you're in a lift. Flailing arms, shoulders across the board, kicking the tail around, sliding straight downhill on alternate egdes uner the impression that they're turning .................. etc. Most of them never improve because they think they're good at it on the grounds that they can 'get down anything'
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hang11, do you think that there's no need for snowboarding lessons at all? Just a positive mental attitude and the opportunity to practise?
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Clearly lessons help beginners, but the idea that you need to have had lessons to be able to carve is a bit out there I think.

Anyway, I'd rather spend the cash on some baggy pants so I look cool Very Happy
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hang11 wrote:
Clearly lessons help beginners, but the idea that you need to have had lessons to be able to carve is a bit out there I think.
Do you think everyone can learn a full range of technique, including carving on a board, without lessons?
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Yes, given enough time, and natural ability
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hang11 wrote:
Yes, given enough time, and natural ability

I think the 'natural ability' bit is key, and clearly you've got it. But I see loads and loads and loads of boarders who seem unable to steer their boards without kicking their back foot around. From the speed they are boarding at it doesn't look like they are inexperienced, maybe they've just cemented their initial moves on board?

Unless they are playing a trick, thinking "look, here comes a skier, let's board incompetently so they all think we're rubbish" I think there's a whole bunch of boarders who need lessons to help them develop a wider range of technique. Unless where you board everyone is either a beginner or brilliant...?
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You see the same with skiers, surfers, whatever - obviously lots of levels of ability out there, and that's down to lots of reasons, but I would guess that the main reason is down to the amount of time spent doing it?

It's getting away from my point, which was that it's quite possible to ride a snowboard well without ever having had a lesson.

Personally, I've never felt the need to have a snowboarding lesson - part of the fun of learning is having some rib crushing injuries, getting back up, doing it again, and figuring it out. Lots of my mates haven't had lessons either, and ride very well. But we're lucky enough to be living near the snow, so get to rack up the days, which sorts the technique.

If I ever decided to get in touch with my feminine side, and play golf or start skiing, I'd probably have some lessons.
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I've had abuse about this on here before, but I'm with rob on this. I ride pretty-much every day and I see about 1 snowboarder a week who can carve (and that's usually an instructor!). Carving <> turning.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Lizzard wrote:
Summary of problems so far:

- can't do flats
- can't stand still
- can't do drags
- can't traverse
- have to walk
- not enough tuition

So, (leaving aside all the adolescent image-related rubbish) our biggest problem/challenge seems to be that we're frankly quite cr@p at snowboarding. Laughing Laughing Mind you, that's my biggest problem on skis as well.

Genuinely made me laugh! Laughing

rob@rar wrote:
I think the 'natural ability' bit is key, and clearly you've got it.

I'm not sure natural ability is necessary, actually. I'm certain I didn't have any at the beginning. Although I had lessons for my first ever week on the mountains, I reckon they held my snowboarding back by many days, since it was years ago and so I too was taught to steer with the upper body. The lessons certainly taught me nothing that I couldn't have taught myself (given that I progressed very slowly) beyond a little bit of good safety info.

Just as Lizzard says, frankly I was crap at snowboarding! Then one day (and I can still remember the exact spot on the piste) after yet another failed turn, thinking "Christ, I need to learn how to do this", I just sat there for two minutes and actually watched other boarders go past, identifying the differences between the few who obviously knew what they were doing, and those who didn't. Within a few minutes of getting up again - bearing in mind I had a bit of experience on a board by that time - I was doing my first real carves (no doubt poorly and inelegantly) but the feeling was immediate and amazing, like it really "clicked".

rob@rar wrote:
But I see loads and loads and loads of boarders who seem unable to steer their boards without kicking their back foot around. From the speed they are boarding at it doesn't look like they are inexperienced, maybe they've just cemented their initial moves on board?

bar shaker wrote:
Once I could get around, albeit with arms flailing around, I watched other riders and tried to copy their stance and movements. Stance is everything in boarding and you can instantly spot a good rider from a nervous newbie just by their posture on the board.

Exactly, and taking the time to really observe the difference was the key to transitioning from merely being able to getting down the hill (even with some under-the-lifts type off-piste) and actually being able to snowboard.

Of course, lessons could maybe steer you directly to that discovery... but only if they've improved considerably in recent years.

hang11 wrote:
What it really needs, IMO is a lot of practice and growing a set.

Too right.

That day (four years ago) was one of my first after having moved to within driving distance of snow; and many, many days and weekends have since been spent. I feel myself improve with almost every single day spent, and now I like to think that I'm a pretty decent boarder both on- and off-piste, albeit still with plenty to learn (eg I'm a freerider at heart and I've only very recently got into park stuff, well jumps mainly, and am currently working on spins etc.) Actually, I suspect I'll never stop learning, since there's always something more difficult out there than what you've just mastered.

On other thing that unquestionably helps is that I almost always go with a mate who's always been more or less the same level as me, and we constantly learn from and motivate each other. He's better at jumps than I am, which is why I'm now following him into the park cos I don't want to let him get too far ahead wink. In fact, the only reason I'm a good switch rider is because a while ago he started doing it in preparation for learning spins, and I got píssed off that he was better than me, so we decided to spend two entire days doing nothing but switch...

Incidentally, thinking more on the natural ability thing, the other defining day in my snowboarding career was the day I started inline skating. What I knew about balance from snowboarding helped me progress quickly, then practice got me to a pretty advanced level... and that fed immediately back to snowboarding since I was totally comfortable with having my centre of gravity way outside of the edge. Again, balance practice was the key, rather than ability per se.
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As for problems/challenges, I agree with what someone said above that the complete lack of independent, unbiased equipment reviews is a PITA.

Secondly, the fact that piste maps are designed for skiers rather than boarders is a constant irritation; they indicate nothing about the actual characteristics of the slope, eg variability of gradient, width etc. The colour divisions seem to work well for skiers but aren't a useful way for a beginner or intermediate boarder to choose a route.

(In fact, I'm sure that good skiers also share the map pain: is it really possible to cut cross from piste X to piste Y like it appears on the map or is there in fact a raging cliff-face between them that the mappers couldn't be bothered to draw? Which direction does piste Z actually go in? etc etc.)
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hang11 wrote:
It's getting away from my point, which was that it's quite possible to ride a snowboard well without ever having had a lesson.
I've never said it's impossible to develop good skills without having lessons. I'm simply observing that:

(1) I see a lot of snowboarders using a very limited skill set, often inappropriately. My (very) general impression is that it's a higher proportion of snowboarders at this level than skiers, but I've not really paid much attention to this so wouldn't defend this point.

(2) I see a lot fewer snowboarding lessons taking place than I do ski lessons.

hang11, so if it's possible to ride well without lessons how come I see relatively few people snowboarding as well as you?
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Pyremaniac wrote:
Of course, lessons could maybe steer you directly to that discovery...

Do you think that every boarder (or skier for that matter) will eventually develop a good range of effective technique? Or do you think some riders/skiers will embed their limited skill set by using those movements all the time they are sliding down slopes? Practice makes permanent, or practice makes perfect?
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With you again rob@rar, many of the techniques required to get off the "intermediate plateau" (both on skis and a board) are counter-intuitive and you'd have to be very lucky to arrive at them without some kind of external input (whether that be lessons, books, dvd's or just watching people who know what they're doing).

I've been riding recently with a girl who's out here doing a season. She only started snowboarding at the start of the season, but she's a kite-surf instructor and has picked it up incredibly quickly. She can comfortably ride any piste and I've taken her down some pretty steep and tricky (tight trees, etc.) off piste and she coped with it all really well. But it only takes one glance to see that she's self-taught and her technique is terrible. She's having loads of fun and I wouldn't even begin to criticise that, but I also know that she could progress unbelievably fast with just a couple of lessons.
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rob@rar wrote:
Pyremaniac wrote:
Of course, lessons could maybe steer you directly to that discovery...

Do you think that every boarder (or skier for that matter) will eventually develop a good range of effective technique?

No. I think you have to want to become a good snowboarder. Many people would say they want to become a good snowboarder, but in reality are actually happy just mucking around with their mates on their one-week holiday, more interested in having a laugh than worrying about technique. And absolutely fair play to them. I sense that snowboarding and skiing are quite different in that regard; I mean no offence to anyone with this, but skiing to me doesn't actually look all that fun from my personal perspective until you're a very good skier capable of taking on some off-piste, jumps etc. Whereas snowboarders tend to be fooling around up the banked sides of the piste, through the trees round the edges of the piste, near piste /under lifts off-piste, etc, from more or less their second week. (Whilst some skiers do stuff like that, the majority don't.) Judging from the conversations on this forum, for many skiers a significant part of their enjoyment is the act of improving skiing technique in and of itself.

If you genuinely want to become a good boarder/skier, you'll be looking at what more skilled people do, and imitating them. I do think that lessons can play a part in that (although in these days of cheap video cameras there's more and more that one can do on one's own to analyze and improve one's technique). It takes dedication and discipline to analyze oneself, though, and I think an individual lesson or two is a more realistic way for a once-a-year holiday boarder to improve. Even if you do learn on your own, sooner or later it's got to be useful to find out what someone who really knows their shít thinks of your boarding. (I'm toying with taking a private lesson for exactly that reason.)

My scepticism lies more with beginner lessons (from a necessity standpoint). A friend of mine is going to join us as a first-timer next weekend. They don't do weekend group lessons where we're going, and he doesn't want to pay for a individual lesson (and I wouldn't recommend it as value for money at that stage either) so he's bought the McNabb book. Looks pretty good; with some tips from us throughout the weekend I'm optimistic he'll be OK. I feel the same about skiing lessons incidentally; I don't think you need to pay someone to teach you to snowplough; much better to faff around on your own for the first couple of days and then have someone to teach you once you're at the point that their advice (eg learning to parallel turn properly) will actually mean something to you. This of course all assumes that you're the kind of person who's capable of learning stuff on your own. Many people aren't, and for those people lessons are the only sensible option. Also, group lessons can be fun if it's you're first time on the mountain and you don't have much company cos your mates don't want to hang around.

I also think that a lot of it is cultural; no-one takes skateboarding lessons (or at least, they didn't used to!). The concept of going to the hill for your third week and having a couple of snowboard lessons feels weird to me, although I can't really put my finger on why.

Quote:
Or do you think some riders/skiers will embed their limited skill set by using those movements all the time they are sliding down slopes?

Yes, although I don't think that it's the end of the world. I think that people can un-fix those errors if they take the time to observe what they're doing wrong (perhaps having it pointed out to them by an instructor wink.) The issue boils down to what people really want to get out of their time on the snow. Most people have a great time despite their bad technique, and don't realize that things could be even better if their technique were better.

Quote:
Practice makes permanent, or practice makes perfect?

"Practice makes permanent; correct practice makes perfect!" (I read that on another thread here; it might even have been you!)
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stevomcd, your story's interesting. It's pretty hard to describe these things I know, but can you give me an idea of how her technique is terrible and exactly what advice an instructor would be able to give her that would up her game? Is it the stance? The turning technique?

Do you think that her technique will improve with experience (bearing in mind that good boarders have often got tens and tens of days under their belt)? Does getting instruction serve as a shortcut to the same end result?


Last edited by You know it makes sense. on Sat 22-01-11 14:11; edited 1 time in total
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Pyremaniac, all very sensible, and much that I agree with, although not about teaching yourself to snowplough. I've seen some insanity with incompetent skiers trying to teach their beginner mates. First few lessons are the most important you'll ever have IMO, as you can begin to instil the core movements that will underpin all the skiing you'll want to do.
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Pyremaniac, she turns entirely using the back foot with lots of rotation of the upper body. Weight is towards the back of the board, not the front. An instructor would rapidly get her steering with the front foot, shifting weight forward and using more vertical motion of the body.

All of these will be of massive benefit in genuinely steep terrain. This is where a lot of self-taught riders come un-stuck - they think that because they can ride any piste, they can ride anything the mountain has to offer. Then they eventually get into some properly steep terrain off-piste and their technique just doesn't work, they can't make a turn.

All of the above pointers would also be good steps on the road to proper carving - I love carving, but at the same time I don't think it's the be-all-and-end-all of snowboarding. For me, when there's no powder, one of the most fun things to do is make big, smooth arcs down some nice groomed piste.

One nice definition of a competent boarder is someone who can ride any piste (or indeed, any off-piste!) without having to speed-check, because they're doing nice, round turns, whether carved turns on gentler slopes or dynamic skidded turns on steeper ones. For most riders, as soon as they're on anything steep, what they're really doing is a series of speed-checks to either side. This is pretty-much the definition BASI uses for assessing entry-level instructors.
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stevomcd, good post. I see many parallels to that in skiers (including in myself before I started to make a determined effort to improve my skiing).
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rob@rar wrote:
Pyremaniac, [...] much that I agree with, although not about teaching yourself to snowplough.

rob@rar, well, if you say so then I believe you, since I suspect that you spend a lot more time observing and correcting beginner skiers than I do! It interests me though; I wonder if those first few hours of snowboarding are equally critical... are there really so many incorrect ways of sideslipping and "falling leaf" that the failure to take instruction is going to damage your ability? (Full turns and linking is rather different, and does require some sort of external input, even if it's just taking a keen interest in how better riders do it.)

(Edited to include quote, since more replies were submitted before I got mine in, and the context got a bit lost.)


Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Mon 24-01-11 17:54; edited 1 time in total
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Pyremaniac wrote:
I wonder if those first few hours of snowboarding are equally critical
In my first few hours on a board the instructor got me on the front foot not the back foot when initiating a turn, stressing that the same flexion and extension movements that I made skiing were useful when riding a board. If someone new starts off on the right foot (if you excuse the pun) it's then much easier for them to "self-teach". If someone starts off making instinctive but incorrect movements they are already at a disadvantage if they want to develop good technique.
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stevomcd, thanks, that's interesting. I agree that you have to find out from somewhere that your weight should be central with pressure forwards, that your steering comes from your sidecut not your shoulders, etc etc. I think that your mates can teach you that... if they're themselves good. Here's another relevant point: now that I live near the snow, I know a few trustworthy riders. A once-a-year holidaymaker coming from the UK might not, and so might not be surrounded by such good quality advice. I was never taught about where to put my weight and pressure for example (which is one of the reasons that I look back on my initial lessons with dismay) but when I started to take my boarding seriously I certainly knew about it somehow, I guess just from having it discussed by people around me.

Totally agree with that definition of a competent rider, by the way. Hits the nail on the head.


Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Sat 22-01-11 15:06; edited 1 time in total
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rob@rar, but as a skier I'm sure you could just "feel" that having the pressure on the front was the right way of doing it! It's interesting cos I've just had my first six hours of skiing over two mornings last weekend (when the snow levels were very poor and I wasn't too interested in spending all day gouging holes in my board). Needless to say, I did so without lessons, although I do think I will benefit from lessons on my next trip. Right from the start, thanks to my boarding, I knew that if you want to carve (which presumably we do) then there's no use weighting the back of the skis, and that you need to employ the sidecut. (Snowplough hurts so I tried to abandon that within the first half hour and move to something resembling a parallel turn, which of course was inevitably a bit snowploughy but not too shoddy for a novice.) I don't yet know how to stop because I can't skid the skis, so I have to do a huge snowplough at the end! My boarding experience paid dividends, since obviously I'm not afraid of the slope, nor to look in front rather than down at my skis; and I have fast turning reactions and a good awareness of what/who is around me, and don't bat an eyelid when someone comes zooming past me, so I don't think I was at all dangerous to anyone else. By the end I was going down the easier blues in some sort of vague "carved" turns from top to bottom concentrating on keeping my upper body and hips still and facing down the fall line. (I appreciate that that sounds a bit ridiculous; I'm sure they weren't actually carved. But I was constantly conscious of trying to eliminate all skid from the back of the ski, and I think I succeeded some of the time.)

Would I have got so far if I hadn't had prior experience as a boarder? Definitely not. I agree with you; you need someone to tell you what's right or wrong, or already have the understanding of the physics from a similar sport.

I guess I just don't think it necessarily needs to be an instructor in the case of learning to board; it could be advice from an unqualified but trustworthy source, careful observation, or perhaps books/DVDs. Weirdly, however, I did feel that skiing was more technical and that there were more things that I was probably doing wrong that would be harmful to my technique in future, and so I really will take a proper lesson the next time that there's 5 weeks of unbroken sunshine wink. Is this an illusion? Maybe. Perhaps I'm now much more self-aware and capable of self-analysis than I must have been at the start of my snowboarding career. If I weren't, possibly I'd think that my skiing is just fine on its own, and I'd end up being one of those nightmare-looking skiers utterly lacking in elegance!!


Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Mon 24-01-11 17:55; edited 1 time in total
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Pyremaniac, I definitely think that being able to do one helps when learning the other. Dynamic balance, understanding the shape of the ski/board and what you can do with it, reading the snow or the slope, being comfortable with sliding down hill, etc are all great headstarts. I know two or three snowboard instructors who have had a go at the first ski instructor qualification after not much more than a couple of weeks skiing experience (they had to start skiing in order to pass their 2nd discipline qualification). They skied in a very similar way, and their long radius turns were very good and there's no way you would know that they were so new to skiing. But their short radius turns were hideous. Just couldn't do them.

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I guess I just don't think it necessarily needs to be an instructor in the case of learning to board; it could be advice from an unqualified but trustworthy source, careful observation, or perhaps books/DVDs.
Yeah, sure. Take advantage of whatever resources you have available. If you know someone who skis or rides well (and, crucially, understands what they are doing) follow them around, copy what they do, ask them to give you tips and feedback. Still instruction in my opinion, even if it's informal and not paid for. One question though, how do you know whether your mate is a good role model if you don't actually know what good technique looks like?
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rob@rar wrote:
One question though, how do you know whether your mate is a good role model if you don't actually know what good technique looks like?

Ah, that's the key, isn't it. You need to find out what good technique looks like even if you don't yet have it. This basically means observing people around you. Not just passively glancing at others during the day's ride, but really stopping and analysing. I know nothing about skiing, but I reckon I can pick out the really good skiiers on the hill, and I'm not talking about the fact that they're on any particular grade of piste, or their speed. It's more to do with the way they hold their body, the position of their legs, how energy-efficient their stance is, etc. Same for boarders. It's kind of inexplicable but you know it when you see it... if you're prepared to really stop and look. Then I guess you compare that to your mate and decide whether to listen to a word he's telling you Happy.
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Pyremaniac, I picked-up skiing fairly recently too (actually, rob@rar, because I've started the BASI snowboard thing and know I'll eventually have to ski!) and, like yourself, got into it pretty quickly. There are a lot of similarities (weight up, weight forward, steer!), but some entertaining differences as well. e.g., the first time I tried to carve on skis, I simply leant towards the inside of the turn (as on a board). On skis, this results in a somewhat comical sideways fall! (You need to move your hips in, but not your upper body so much!).
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It's not often I have the pleasure of watching good quality boarders. Most are indifferent, and as mentioned above, I don't see too many genuinely carving. However the same can be said of most skiers - but for both this changes from resort to resort.

It's a shame more boarders don't persevere with lessons but it's a free(ish) country.

I'm largely a self taught boarder, having took a few lessons on plastic which descend into a spiral of pain and discomfort. I eventually downloaded some instructions from the Internet and used them to get sorted while on a skiing course (tell's you all you need to know about how I was feeling about skiing at the time!) I'd grab a board at 3pm and leg it to the beginner slopes. Within a few sessions I was linking turns and built from there. No more lessons until my Instructor course.

However, I ski to a reasonable standard and was able to convert concepts and skill from one to the other and I'm keen to get my boarding to the same level as my skiing.

Pyremaniac,
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I wonder if those first few hours of snowboarding are equally critical...

Yes. If you can get the posture & balance sorted early on it's going to save a lot of time later.

I was once of the thought that skiing and boarding had inverse learning curves. Skiing was easy to get mobile but then most find themselves on a plateau, compared with boarding where it's hard to get mobile but then you progress fast. I now think boarding has exactly the same plateau as skiing wink

But the main problem facing boarders is choosing a new 'all mountain' set up from all the boards and bindings on offer - suggestions welcome Happy
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