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The Perfect Powder Ski

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Arno, I must say your enthusiasm for DPS really makes me want to try a pair of Wailers they look great, just seem so hard to get hold of!

fatbob, I think its a mayrhofen thing, and i am very aware of my hypocrisy, pretty sure if i moved to verbier or chamonix people would laugh at my pathetic attempts to survive the backcountry. I also recognise this ski will not make me a skiing god overnight.

To get this straight, i am doing this because i want to, not because i need to, a pair of my own skis has always been a dream!
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
dulcamara, haha - take it with a grain of salt. i have seen some people who didn't get on with them, like any other ski Little Angel
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Quote:
I also recognise this ski will not make me a skiing god overnight.


^ Assuming you have a race ground then you might be surprised on that one...

Quote:
Around 185 long ~20m turn radius about 110/115 underfoot, ~30cm tip rocker (softened), into a fairly stiff but hopefully light normal camber mid section and a 0 camber tail into a semi twin tip


Couple of comments.

1) Off-piste skis need to be long as well as wide. Its overall surface area is what makes a ski float (not just width).
Dont be scared to go upto 190cm, especially with a rocker-ed ski. You might find 185cm might even be a little short.

2) 100mm-112mm ish is about optimal for European ski. Plenty float. Any wider becomes a specialist soft snow only tool IMHO.

3) Tip rocker doesnt need to be massive. If its too big you loose effective edge length and hard snow / piste / mogul performance (i.e HellBent)

4) Loads of people have recommended indie skis. Because that is the cool thing to do on web forums Wink But the big boys with heritage (especially Volkl, Movement, Dynastar, K2, Rossignol) have some ripping and progressive skis that wont disappoint. DPS have certainly developed ski design in terms of engineering, materials, shapes and build quality. However they are also an expensive pair of skis. Especially if you put core shots in them...

Skipass.com have a comprehensive link with tech specs of whats out there

http://global.skipass.com/gearguide/
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How have i never seen this site before? well there goes my afternoon!

You might be right with the length actually, with the rocker it does seem a little short, was simply aware that my 193 scotts have let me down a couple of times on tight turny couloirs....

anyone ever used ski logik, igneous or wagner skis? yup the last two are expensive but if they're as good as their own hype i might be tempted...
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
if you look around on forums like TGR or telemarktips you will see people raving about igneous
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You'll need to Register first of course.
BTW I do agree that 'any' ski will work in fluffy light hero power, but to me, off piste is more than that, and that is where rocker, width and length helps, ie when skiing cut up crud, spring slush, heavy fresh snow etc etc
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
them ski logiks are boo-tee-full! getting good reviews too and seem to have a healthy stiffness
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Arno, I would spend time looking, but i don't like TGR, while the guys there certainly know their stuff (it is probably the best source for independent advice) you have to search for ages to make sure your question has not already been asked before otherwise you will be shouted at and called a newbie-gaper..... I had no idea what that was before i went on that site, and even then i had to search for ages to find a description of it. Absolutely no offence meant to those who use the site.

Every year we get new seasonaires here in Mayrhofen and i have to spend the first month learning the new words. I ski ok, but i am certainly not cool.
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
dulcamara, in customary style i shall now slag you off for being too lazy to search wink

and someone did go to the trouble of indexing reviews:

http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=104129
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
point taken, that's a pretty helpful index
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
one of the logiks

http://www.telemarktalk.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=71606&highlight=

they do a custom service too
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I quite look forward to testing out my new ON3P Wrenegades against my new Wailer 112 RPs (Hybrids)...sometime in March-April I guess!

Yes I know I succumbed to the indie=cool factor...
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
JONG!

Couldn't quite help myself, sorry.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
kitenski wrote:
BTW I do agree that 'any' ski will work in fluffy light hero power, but to me, off piste is more than that, and that is where rocker, width and length helps, ie when skiing cut up crud, spring slush, heavy fresh snow etc etc


Wholeheartedly agree. I still enjoy skiing on my slalom or GS skis in proper light pow and don't find them a struggle, but for wet or heavy snow they're a nightmare compared with my Mantras, no float and far too hooky/turny.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
dulcamara, and in even truer TGR style, there is a way to use google which works very, very well....

it has been discussed almost assuredly before. so just search. its easy. GO HERE: http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=01...%3Agoe34wkkkv8 then enter what you need to know. if you find a thread with good info, bump it and keep it fresh. other people are probably wondering the same thing.

taken from how to use tech talk effectively thread.....http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=141499
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Quote:
I still enjoy skiing on my slalom or GS skis in proper light pow and don\'t find them a struggle, but for wet or heavy snow they\'re a nightmare compared with my Mantras, no float and far too hooky.


^ look at it the other way...
your not going to win a slalom race on 100mm wide rockered pow killers.
but you could happily get down the course.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Haggis_Trap, anyone able to get round a slalom course on a properly hard race-prepped/injected piste (the Face during the WC weekend say) while wearing reverse/reverse powder boards deserves respect. I certainly don't think it could be described as 'happily getting down' either.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Sideshow_Bob, Go last and it'd be easy! a reverse camber ski is the perfect rutt shape!! ...

I can't say i've ever got "happily" down a salted piste, even on factory skis, it was always a case of surviving as fast as i could.
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Sideshow_Bob, Haggis_Trap skis on the natural version of that every week in Scotland wink
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
^ Ha Very Happy
Here is a cool video of Didier Defago on the Bec des Rosses using GS skis. Not as fast as Kaj - but good style.
Pretty sure he could also ski a race course on Hell Bents (with his jacket wide open and no gloves ?) if required.


http://youtube.com/v/-uR5PFvMg_0
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Haggis_Trap, Defago already has my respect NehNeh
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
I am looking at something similar and currently am pursuing the Amplid Rockwell. They are a probably a bit too park for some, but as an all round ski, on paper at least, they seem right up my street and they look great too.

Rockered tips and tail, camber underfoot, short effective running length, light, available in 175 and 182, big surface area. Not a powder slayer like some of the skis mentioned, but as a one ski quiver, if it carves well, it just might be the ticket, or at least as a workable ski for days when it's been snowing.

Expensive is the downside, 550 Euros before you've looked at bindings..
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Err... that looked like didier was really fighting the ski there, admittedly i am slightly better than him, but still
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
dulcamara, Laughing
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
dulcamara wrote:
Ahh masque but I could have a face like Gary Busey...

Jerry from some like it hot wrote:
Oh, you don't understand, Osgood! Ehhhh... I'm a man

Osgood wrote:
Well, nobody's perfect,


But with a place in Mayrhoffen you'll do for me. Then again we could elope & look for the perfect snow in Utah for our perfect skis. wink
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Quote:

the_doc,Out of interest, what is it you do?



...stuff you can't do on 66mm carvers...
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Kastle MX108, stiff, dual radius, and I think this years version has a tip rocker. Unique design features. Should be easy to test in Austria.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
You could go for the Volkl Gotama. Enough rocker to make the turns easy and stop the tips from diving. Great for all those less than perfect powder days when its a bit wind blown and crusty. Great in that heavy snow that has already been chopped up by the early birds and with your level of skiing just a dream on the perfect 1 metre plus days Very Happy
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
[quote]
the_doc,Out of interest, what is it you do?

...stuff you can't do on 66mm carvers...
/quote]

It was a genuine question TBH and I'm completely stumped by your response, particularly as you've just repeated the response that lead to my original question...

Go on, give us a clue.... Puzzled Puzzled
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
dulcamara wrote:
Lots of great skis here, getting an idea now of what im looking for, might try putting some ideas into boardcrafter, see what they look like.

To explain my choice of ski. I want an all-mountain ski because I don't believe off-piste should be limited to days when there is a meter of fresh powder, lucky for me really as we never get that here. Those who know Mayrhofen will attest to this, one is normally sliding down a foot of powder with back breaking ice underneath (not right now, but usually). Plus with the tight narrow valleys in resort, you often have to ski a few hundred meters of wind blown ice before you get to the sheltered-perfect runs that the 20 million kids on K2 Hell bents and floppy twin tips won't ruin. Everyone here seems to have the latest coolest stuff every year, but very few can really ski powder without superfat, soft rocker type skis that hold your hand on the way down, (little rant sorry about that)

oh, found a few interesting custom ski makers, anyone have any experience?


It's called having "fun" you should try it..
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
head jimi`s good ski slight rocker tip and tail good flex tip and tail work for me if you want something bigger go for the carlos.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Bergmeister, He normally tows a caravan around Austria or if you mean on skis, he tends to ski deep stuff backwards or if you mean by employment, he's one of the owners of WDF.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
I need to learn to ski powder switch, I'm always terrified when i look down steep things, but never when i look up them... missing a trick there i think!

milnerhome, I apologise if i have offended you, actually I apologise to all other spoiled rich kids who can't ski powder and use floppy girly skis to slide sideways down the off-piste for whom the statement was intended, 'twas never my intention to offend.
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actually that leads to a real question, are there any twin tipped skis that float backwards while still being stiff enough to handle hard stuff?
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
dulcamara wrote:
actually that leads to a real question, are there any twin tipped skis that float backwards while still being stiff enough to handle hard stuff?


movement gladiators will do that for you, also suspect looking at those ski logiks that whatever their fat twin is will do so too (will be a fair bit fatter than the glads i would think)

black diamond zealot is apparently pretty stiff with a twin and i think a rise tip in the latest version
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Mosha Marc wrote:
The High Society range is also worth looking at.

126mm underfoot in either traditional build or with a bit of rocker.


And reasonably stiff twins too.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
stockli rotor?
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
dulcamara wrote:

milnerhome, I apologise if i have offended you, actually I apologise to all other spoiled rich kids who can't ski powder and use floppy girly skis to slide sideways down the off-piste for whom the statement was intended, 'twas never my intention to offend.


Yeah.. maybe I should trade my hellbents in for some 200cm battle axes to make me manly and ski "properly", your a joke haha
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Quote:

actually that leads to a real question, are there any twin tipped skis that float backwards while still being stiff enough to handle hard stuff?


Armada JJ. Soft at the tips and the tails and very stiff underfoot.

Regarding demoing. I'd split my time between the trad skis with a bit of tip rocker (Sidestash etc.) and the more accessible funshapes (the JJ, the S7 and the Bentchetler).

Otherwise, Haggis Trap's suggestions are bang on: 100-110mm with tip rocker is a good choice for the bulk of European skiing.
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Okey dokey, milnerhome, I'm not having an internet forum argument, I have no real issue with the way any people ski/live/spend/think as long as it doesnt hurt me/others, i certainly have no actual issues regarding which model of ski people use. lets just leave it there.



Everyone else, I thank you massively for your time, I had never heard of so many of the skis mentioned and some look amazing, though looking at my list of ones i want to try i may end up spending more on testing than on buying a pair of skis but its always fun to look. Hacked together a couple of designs on boardcrafter and on paper so gonna send them off to some companies and get their opinions and quotes.

cheers
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