 Poster: A snowHead
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I'm afraid to sound like an unbeliever but I don't like deep powder. I can't ski it, and get it so infrequently that I've never practiced on it. Last year did Styx in Flaine in about 2 metres of powder and I ( and three others with me) hated it.
I like a few cms of powder until it gets churned up (before mid-day!) and then I'd rather that it hadn't snowed for ages and was a firm surface.
It's really "cool" to talk about fantastic powder and I usually just shut up and play alone when I'm with people gagging for fresh snow secretly hoping that the pistes will stay firm and the sun stay out! Anyone else with me on this one?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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MIxed one Chris, don't like it hard and icy either. Prefer the powder. Skied a piste above PLagne Centre at New Year, the pisteur was removing the barrier as we got there. No piste basher had been down and it was fantastic.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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During a huge dump in 1999 I skiied behind an expert in deep powder - copied what he did and presto it worked, and for the rest of the week. Probably the biggest buzz I ever got from skiing. You should have seen the smile on my face.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Chris: focus on the watch . . . .
You will learn to board . . .
Come to the dark side . . .
Repeat after me . . .
"I will learn to board . . . I will learn to board"
That goes for the rest of you two plank mogul makers 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Masque,
How about you take him to an indoor slope, and teach him how to board. I'm sure that after a couple of days of lessons, he'll be as acomplished as you.
All the time leaving the powder to me. 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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On the very deep snow experience that I had it probably didn't help that I was too s**t scared to face down the run. I got about half way down and then started to fall over and got so very very tired dragging myself out of the snow. One of the people I was with who loved it had Pocket Rockets.
On my last trip I cut fresh tracks on a blue run and had great fun - I'm OK it it's sort of boot deep and un cut up. I can manage but don't terribly enjoy carved up powder it's the really deep stuff I can't get on with!
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Each to their own.
Because you don't get it all the time, because it's not as easy to do (such as piste skiing or boarding for example) and therefore takes more skill, because it lets you reach the areas groomers don't reach - that's the attraction of powder for me.
As for going over to the Darkside (blindside more like), I know quite a few boarders who are coming back to skiing because touring with a board can be a pain.
Off-piste requires different techniques (see powder skiing thread in the Bend zee knees section). You are probably trying to use the same technique in deep powder as on the piste, this only tends to work in shallow powder.
Last edited by After all it is free  on Fri 12-03-04 12:42; edited 1 time in total
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Boardski - Following a good skiier on all sorts of terrain can work wonders - because it provides confidence as well as improved style. You are right, following a good bump skiier probably works, but must need guts if the bumps are big.
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Steveb, It is all about confidence. Knowing that by following a good skier you'll definitely pick a good line gives you that confidence and also teaches you the right route, speed and tempo (particularly on bumps and powder).
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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DB, Boarding's easy eh? May you be infested with the piles of a thousand boarders (old boarder curse)
You still up for a challenge 3rd. week in April? 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Chris Reed, I used to feel the same, but I forced myself to tackle pistes with deep powder on them to improve my technique. It worked and now I love them  Agree with the comments about copying good skiiers - I do the same and it really helps.
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| Masque wrote: |
DB, Boarding's easy eh? May you be infested with the piles of a thousand boarders (old boarder curse)
You still up for a challenge 3rd. week in April? |
I ski and board and it's not quite the point that powder's easy on a board, it is of course. It turns out the modification to technique from piste to powder for a board is fairly minimal almost just a different balance. In point of fact it's not altoghether different for skis, it's a pretty minor adjustment, ergo, if you're needing a major alteration you might want to revisit you general technique. YMMV etc etc
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You know it makes sense.
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| ise wrote: |
| In point of fact it's not altoghether different for skis, it's a pretty minor adjustment, ergo, if you're needing a major alteration you might want to revisit you general technique. YMMV etc etc |
Interesting, as someone whose been trying to master the deep stuff for years I'd like your take on that adjustment is you could expand a little.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I love the stuff. Just can't find any.
Five genuine powder days in 70 odd days of skiing is not a very good return...
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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[quote="marc gledhill"]
| ise wrote: |
| Interesting, as someone whose been trying to master the deep stuff for years I'd like your take on that adjustment is you could expand a little. |
Well, is some continual improvement from lessons and training a part of your skiing or not ? If it's not then it's something to think about. I'm skiing better everywhere on the mountain from personal tuition that was about 50% on glaciers in the summer.
My girlfriends skiing more powder now and doesn't herself really believe how easy she's finding after skiing with a trainer on piste but she's thinks more about her skiing now. She was knocked out the other week skiing in the Gers area of Flaine to look back up at her tracks and took some convincing they were hers 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ise, yes it is. Unless I'm on a short break I always have lessons when I'm on a ski trip.
But I have always had week long class lessons, never private, I tend to be in the top "English" class but the level of fellow skiiers does vary a lot. So I suppose the answer will be to get the private lessons sorted out.
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| marc gledhill wrote: |
ise, yes it is. Unless I'm on a short break I always have lessons when I'm on a ski trip.
But I have always had week long class lessons, never private, I tend to be in the top "English" class but the level of fellow skiiers does vary a lot. So I suppose the answer will be to get the private lessons sorted out. |
sounds like you're at that plateau then, private lessons are the answer even a few hours here and there is good.
Looking back I really regret not taking more lessons, buying flash boots and skis ought to be a distant second to lessons.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Ise: I’d agree, but only to a point. I’m a very aggressive piste boarder (I really ought to buy hard boots and an alpine board) but foot stance and torque carving are a)different and b)not used in deep powder. Even on ‘all mountain’ boards it’s very unusual to be able to ride ‘all the mountain’ well without adjusting binding positions and technique (hence the move to sliding base plates from some of the manufacturers). I love riding deep powder quickly but to make it an effortless joy I have to set my equipment up suit it and make compromises in my riding technique on the piste. It is a matter of horses for courses. A great skier or boarder can ride/ski anything with anything, but they will require a lot of effort, high levels of skill and may not enjoy the experience. On deep powder it’s surface area (with its nose/tail differential) and balance that make it possible to learn the skills without spending most of your time digging out or sucking snow. (and I’ve sucked a lot - - - take that both ways - - - but not “THAT” way) JohnB
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marc gledhill, maybe consider the epicski academy next year - it's as good as private lessons with top English* speaking instructors.
(* when I say "English", I mean the American variation of English )
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| Masque wrote: |
| Ise: I’d agree, but only to a point. I’m a very aggressive piste boarder (I really ought to buy hard boots and an alpine board) but foot stance and torque carving are a)different and b)not used in deep powder. Even on ‘all mountain’ boards it’s very unusual to be able to ride ‘all the mountain’ well without adjusting binding positions and technique (hence the move to sliding base plates from some of the manufacturers). I love riding deep powder quickly but to make it an effortless joy I have to set my equipment up suit it and make compromises in my riding technique on the piste. It is a matter of horses for courses. A great skier or boarder can ride/ski anything with anything, but they will require a lot of effort, high levels of skill and may not enjoy the experience. On deep powder it’s surface area (with its nose/tail differential) and balance that make it possible to learn the skills without spending most of your time digging out or sucking snow. (and I’ve sucked a lot - - - take that both ways - - - but not “THAT” way) JohnB |
I'd certainly not describe myself as an aggressive piste boarder, in fact I only ever took up the board to see if was as much fun as it looked in powder (it is), I'm actually a rather nervous piste boarder to be honest, I can't do all that half pipe, rail slide nonesense either and I've no inclinination. I probably do have my bindings and stance angles optimised for powder. I really do find powder pretty much effortless on the board, I assumed everyone did
I don't have high levels of skill on the board, I'm not bad but nothing fantastic. I've a reasonable level on skis, comparitivly better than on a board, I'm beginning to find powder and off-piste more enjoyable on skis.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Wear The Fox Hat, DavidS, ise, I hear what you're saying.
Thanks for the info on the lessons, I'm going to be in negotiations with the "green and scaley one" about my trips next year. I'd love to do the epicski week, the language is the big selling point, but I'll take what I'm allowed.
Mmmmm, a skiweekend off piste to limber up and epicski to polish it off. Now where's my brownie point bag?
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Ise: If you find me in a park I’ll be (delete as applicable) p*ssed, st*ned, being carried out on a stretcher – though I do enjoy playing in the pipe. But I’m too old and crumbly to bounce these days and I much prefer exploring the boundary between terminal velocity and how big I think my stones are. (I’m one stack away from developing a pair of pumpkin seeds)
Though I did start skiing last week.
JohnB
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Chris Reed, AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sacriledge!
The deeper the better! The lighter, the better!
Patience in your turns makes a huge difference--let the snow turn your skis (and thus change your line) instead of actually using lots of muscle to try to turn them. Another nice thing about deep snow is that it actually slows you down--you don't have to worry about your skis running away with you!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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My view is Off-piste skiing technique is different to skiing the groomed. I've seen a young group of trained Austrian racers hit powder for the first time and it wasn't pretty. These school kids were flying down the race course early on in the day but then floudering around in the powder later.
For those of you wanting to learn how to ski powder but can't wait for the the Epicski week and/or would prefer real English from a real Englishman instead of the American twang then ....
http://skimountaineering.com/off_piste.htm
They do four levels from off piste begineer to steepest and deepest. Graham has been in St Anton for 16 years, he teaches exclusively off-piste during the winter season. I spent the first day with him picking my skis out of the snow. Within 3 days he had me skiing deep powder on black graded runs. Other people in the group had similar experiences with him. Pocket rockets do help a lot when you are learning to ski powder too.
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Hey! Masque! I'm JohnB! (when I'm not jonpim - very confusing these noms-de-plume). But I suppose you got there first...
Chris R and Marc G: I agree with the advice: get private lessons. Before last year I was crap in powder. Like you, I gritted my teeth, got exhausted, and pretended it was fun. Then last year I cracked it. Few feelings like it. It's well worth the effort.
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