Poster: A snowHead
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Boredsurfing, they are certainly available in gyms. Well in my local gym I've seen a couple of them on the wall ready to use if need be.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Boredsurfing, but we're not comparing like with like. I ski and golf, and my skiing companions are much fitter than my golfing ones, many of whom are at an age and in such a state that death is almost expected!!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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not long before i do the 13 miles from newcastle to south shields again. sadly have seen a couple of deaths along the way, or very serious and often they are younger and have run too fast in warm conditions. hope this is not the case on the 19th
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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chrisb, do you think that because it's a half marathon some people think they can run it without hardly any training over time and that's why they have trouble on the day? Or just the additional demand on their hearts trying to cope with a problem that's already there (e.g. narrowing)?
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VolklAttivaS5, i think it is your first comment. I am no advert for a proper training schedule. This will be my 9th GNR and I never manage a training run of more than an hour before the day, and normally have a bit of a walk at 10 miles - often walking faster than some people are running! I am always overtaken in the last miles along the coast by some bloke who is at least 75.
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Boredsurfing wrote: |
FWIW I read somewhere (like Bode Swiller I don't remember where) that Golf is more dangerous than Skiing when judged by deaths per participant. |
Would that be because the average age of golfers is ancient?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Of course snow can cause problems even without skiing...
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Studies published in the Lancet and the American Journal of Cardiology, among other outlets, show that the incidence of heart failure goes up in the week after a blizzard. The Lancet study, based on death certificates in eastern Massachusetts after six blizzards from 1974-78, demonstrated that ischemic heart disease deaths rose by 22 percent during the blizzard week and stayed elevated for the subsequent eight days, suggesting that the effect was related to storm-related activities, like shoveling, rather than the storm itself. Similarly, the AJC article, based on medical examiner records from three Michigan counties, found that there were more exertion-related sudden cardiac deaths in the weeks during and after blizzards, and that 36 of the 43 total exertion-related deaths occurred during or shortly after snow removal.
It's possible that snow-shoveling is no more dangerous than any other physically draining activity—that the same individuals who die while clearing their driveways could just as well succumb to a vigorous jog. The post-blizzard spike could be attributed to the fact that sedentary people with potential heart problems have no choice but to engage in heart-pounding work with a shovel, whereas other aerobic activities (at other times of year) can be put off or skipped altogether |
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Zero-G wrote: |
Boredsurfing wrote: |
FWIW I read somewhere (like Bode Swiller I don't remember where) that Golf is more dangerous than Skiing when judged by deaths per participant. |
Would that be because the average age of golfers is ancient? |
I played golf on a snow-covered frozen lake once and my balls were bright orange. Was I in any danger?
Average golfer is older but we've all got to drop dead somewhere. In any one week there are more people playing golf than go skiing in a year so no surprise that some croak on the course... like my neighbour did a couple of years ago. He missed the putt too.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Bode Swiller wrote: |
I played golf on a snow-covered frozen lake once and my balls were bright orange. Was I in any danger? |
Only if your helmet was blue.
Bode Swiller wrote: |
He missed the putt too. |
That's just bad form.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Zero-G wrote: |
Bode Swiller wrote: |
He missed the putt too. |
That's just bad form. |
it was dead straight
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You know it makes sense.
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Here are the Total Austrian Alpine Incidents including 311 Deaths ( Not detailed cause ) for 2007/2008.
Only 31 People died on the Piste.
http://www.alpinesicherheit.at/alpinunfall/index.php?id=100
As you can see far more people die in the summer walking & mountaineering.
Just this last month (August) 6 people
http://www.alpinesicherheit.at/alpinunfall/index.php?id=1
For Austria last Season 2009/2010
http://vorarlberg.naturfreunde.at/Berichte/detail/25833/
44 died in controlled ski areas.
A leading cause of death in Austria skiing was - as in the winters before - internal emergency such as heart attack. 27 people died from cardiac circulatory failure. 8 Winter sports enthusiasts were involved in deadly accidents, when they hit a stationary obstacle, 6 people died after a fall without external influence. Furthermore occurred three fatal collision accidents, far fewer than the year before (seven deadly collision accidents).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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stanton, good stuff. So 27 out of 44 (61%) were heart-related deaths.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Bode Swiller, so whilst it is true that the majority of ski rescue incidents may well be broken bones, knee injuries, head injuries etc, the majority of actual deaths occurring are heart related. I can see that if someone dies whilst out skiing then they are likely to have hit something which kills them like a tree or a post, been in an avalanche or something, or they've had a heart attack or stroke maybe.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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stanton, that's deaths, not people being stretchered off which is what you claimed - you beclogged muppet.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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stoatsbrother wrote: |
you beclogged muppet. |
That's almost Shakespearean! (Might be better with 'thou'.)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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VolklAttivaS5, loads of people out running across newcastle tonight - the panic sets in!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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chrisb, well best of luck to you on 19th.
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stoatsbrother wrote: |
stanton, that's deaths, not people being stretchered off which is what you claimed - you beclogged muppet. |
Many folk have cardiacs which are non-fatal.
If you ever lived in the mountains you'd know about this...
You have to remember they do not waste Helicopter resources/rescues on dead body's therefore they are transported down the hill on the traditional sledges/blood wagons
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Having worked as a ski patroller for six years and another six years as an instructor/guide have a pretty good idea as to why people are taken off the mountain.
There are something like 7000 recorded injuries for every 1 death due to injury in skiing/boarding. If there are twice as many deaths due to heart attack (and generally about 20% of heart attacks are fatal) that is still a small number compared to the injuries. So almost all the patients you see being stretchered off the mountain are injuries. And in some situations they do use helicopters to transport bodies.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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stanton, I have seen 12 people being stretchered off before midday at one US resort - so 7 of them were MIs?
get a grip clogboy
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2 hours 4 mins, a personal best in the 30th GNR. There was a few people on the side of the road on the final mile - hope they are all ok
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Be careful about translating this. Most of the people you see getting carted off are injured. The article says 40% of deaths. Sure, everyone sees half a dozen people getting carted off every day, but more often than not this will be a broken bone. Maybe 0.1% of people that you see on a stretcher will die. Only 40% of them are due to heart attacks. So if you see 6 stretcher cases a day, you will need to ski for over 400 days before one of the people on the stretcher dies from a heart attack. If you ski one week a year, it will take you 66 years
Boredsurfing - The golf club I used to play at had a very steep 1st hole. The locals called it 'Heart Attack Hill.' In its 'most productive' year, that hole claimed the health of 14 people on Saturday mornings before 12.00. Sounds deadly until you realise that most of the heart attack victims survived, and that over the course of a year, around 15000 people will tee off between dawn and 12.00. So 0.1% suffered a heart attack and about 1 in a thousand died. (The course did give a bit back though. Only one person who survived the first hole went on to have a heart attack later in the round. He was playing in front of us. Took them half an hour to clear the green and I missed an 18 inch put due to the damage inflicted by the people who crowded around. Wrecked my 'hole' day :grrr:
But yeah - I think the golf probably does kill more fat middle aged men than skiing
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Sarge McSarge wrote: |
Latest stats from the US show one death for every 2.5 million skier/snowboarder days |
So if I skied every day of my life, I could expect to live for 6849 years, 115 days? It sound like the medieval alchemists were looking for the philosopher's stone in entirely the wrong place.
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Thornyhill wrote: |
Sure, everyone sees half a dozen people getting carted off every day, but more often than not this will be a broken bone. |
Half a dozen? So, you see 42 blood wagon cases in a week? Where is this place I need to avoid at all costs?
I'd suggest a heart attack on a mountain could be a bit more serious than one on a golf course - altitude, temperature, time taken to get proper attention etc. Anyway, my cousin, late 50s and very active, died at the wheel of his car - pulled up at traffic lights and never moved away again, taken just like that. This week-end I learned about a bloke I vaguely knew, 50, who I considered to be active, healthy - was at home, went for a shower and dropped dead in the tub. So, if it's going to happen, might as well be doing something you enjoy - which is why prostitutes see their fair share of stiffs (I know, I know)
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You know it makes sense.
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Bode Swiller wrote: |
Thornyhill wrote: |
Sure, everyone sees half a dozen people getting carted off every day, but more often than not this will be a broken bone. |
Half a dozen? So, you see 42 blood wagon cases in a week? Where is this place I need to avoid at all costs?
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There are a couple of runs in Killington that fit the bill. Outer Limits is usually good for a bit of pain. (apparently the steepest mogul run on the East Coast, which doesn't say much, but given that it is generally pure ice makes it more interesting)
Also, any resort on a Monday just between the hire shop and the nursery slopes will create some damage.... sometimes even before they put their skis on.
My favourite observation point is watching El Cappa in Arinsal. It looks fairly innocuous from the lift or while you ski past the bottom looking up, but once you get to the top, the only way down is black. The problem is that from the bottom it looks greenish blue I have watched people who have been skiing for a day fall at the first turn and slide face first to the bottom. They should have gone to ski school
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thornyhill, injury lawyer?
Exaggeration is the sincerest form of invention.
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