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Why have helmets made people so arrogant?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
This year more than any other helmets have become ubiquitous. I have no problem with that.

The problem, though, is that it appears that people think that the helmet makes them immortal and therefore they do not have to check up the slope before setting off. This is discourteous at best, downright dangerous at worst and, of course, a breach of the FIS code.

Because hearing is generally affected, they may not hear an oncoming skier, because goggles are usually worn, peripheral vision may be reduced and because there is a certain sub-conscious feeling of immortality maybe they don't care.

I am one of those that bangs their poles when there is a group of people poised for the off at a choke point that I am not stopping at and I don't care if that annoys people or seems arrogant - it is only the skiing equivalent of sounding the horn - it does draw attention and may even get them to look up the hill before moving into my path.

The helmet itself will not help you if you move into the way of someone travelling even at only 20mph and you are practically stationary. I have seen someone killed this way (as mentioned in a previous related thread).

So, whether you are a helmet wearer or not and are parked at the side of the piste for a breather, the view, for your pals/parents/kids to catch up, then for heaven's sake please do us all the courtesy of looking before you push off - I weigh 100 kgs and will probably win if we collide, helmet or no...


Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Thu 25-02-10 9:25; edited 1 time in total
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Powderhound, I get the issue, but don't you think as a larger ratio wear helmets, the more braindeads will happen to be in helmets rather than hats when they stop in daft places?
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Powderhound, not sure it's a result of the spread of helmets. There have always been - and sadly always will be - numpties who have not so much never heard of the FIS code than lack basic common sense. Would you pull out into the road without looking? Some people do, it seems Sad
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Powderhound, I'm a helmet wearer.
I'm actually not convinced that helmet wearing has anything to do with failing to follow the FIS code rolling eyes
But I would agree with you that at the same time as increasing numbers of people are wearing helmets, increasing numbers of people are also failing to follow the FIS code.
However, that does not mean that the two are necesaarily causally linked.

My bugbear (other than the obvious skiing faster than your ability to stop) is the people who venture off the side of the piste in order to do a little jump back on again - often re-joining the piste blind and in the air (and therefore out of control because you can't turn if your skis are not in contact with snow) Evil or Very Mad
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Freddie Paellahead wrote:
Powderhound,

My bugbear (other than the obvious skiing faster than your ability to stop) is the people who venture off the side of the piste in order to do a little jump back on again - often re-joining the piste blind and in the air (and therefore out of control because you can't turn if your skis are not in contact with snow) Evil or Very Mad


Mine too!

I dont think its helmet wearers particularly. I find a large number of skiers wearing earphones & listening to music, seem to be completely in their own little world & have no awareness of others on the slopes.
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Powderhound, y'know i never knew that banging your poles together was the skiing equivilant of honking your horn. Always thought that it was just people knocking snow off their baskets or generally just ar$eing about - the kind of people who are more interested telling other people what the should be doing than paying attention to their own skiing and making sure that they are decending safely avoiding potential risks by looking ahead and being prepared... but then i wear a helmet and am arrogant, so what do I know.

Now i'm off to write out 100 times "I will not feed the troll". rolling eyes
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genepi, oh no, don't start the headphones debate!
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Freddie Paellahead, Twisted Evil Twisted Evil wink
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I disagree completely, I started wearing a helmet recently but I've always been arrogant. Toofy Grin
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nothing to do with helmets... people either look or they don't. wether or not they're wearing a helmet is irrelevant.
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All good points, maybe it is simply a question of statistics and maybe as I get older I am more aware of the damage that will be caused to me - and the time it takes to heal - than I was a few years ago. I have definitely noticed a propensity among helmet wearers not to look though.

Perhaps (and controversially I know), people not in helmets have necessarily got a greater sense of self-preservation and will go to greater lengths to ensure that they are safe, including looking uphill??!

Interestingly, I have noticed less headphones about this year...
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Richard_Sideways, having the horn is an occupational hazard I'm afraid and banging poles is purely through frustration at the need to get home to bang something more satisfying. Safe descents are a luxury, so move over and if you hear poles being banged behind you, look up the hill and get out the way, I'm in a hurry!! wink
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Powderhound wrote:
Interestingly, I have noticed less headphones about this year...


They're hidden under the increasing helmets... wink
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Agree with Powderhound, all these helmet wearing, dorsal protections "I'm fricking robocop" types are a total menace. I don't care too much when they are on the black slopes or in the park but they are usually crap skiers who wouldn't need all the hardware if they had learned how to ski in the first place. You can usually find them in big resorts which market "freeride", often on blue "beginners" runs where they are using the learners as slalom posts. They rarely make it down the slope without crashing into someone. Also to be seen skiing backwards a lot, again rarely getting far before hitting something or someone.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Quote:

I am one of those that bangs their poles when there is a group of people poised for the off at a choke point that I am not stopping at

Bit pointless really, since huge swathes of people have no idea what you mean by it.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Lizzard, but they might look up at least to see who the prat with the poles is... Mission, therefore, accomplished!

davidof, best off in the back country really. This year has been mixed though. Two killed, one seriously injured in the Highlands in the last two days in avalanches... CH has been bad too. How about your way?
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I wear a helmet because I am risk averse and am concerned what the other guy (or girl) might do to me, I don't think that this has any effect on how I behave on the slope, it doesn't make me ski faster and I still look up the slope setting off or joining a piste ... if I remember.

I think people who don't wear helmets are probably more arrogant because they are not prepared to admit that they would be better off wearing one.

Interestingly the Skier X on the Olympics makes me think that this sport will push the development of helmets and possibly make them seem cool.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
My helmet is so comfy that just last Tuesday I forget I was wearing it and stopped being arrogant. Luckily I soon remembered and went back to being a complete T**T.
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davidof wrote:
Also to be seen skiing backwards a lot, again rarely getting far before hitting something or someone.

Saw a bit of this in Les Arcs plus what we call "Kevins" (apologies to anyone called Kevin!) Bent over, poles out wide and going straight down the piste.
Before we set off every morning and throughout the day I nag my family about looking up the slope when starting off and at cross points. Personally I appreciate it more when someone taps their poles behind me when coming down a forest blue run or something so I know they are coming and I can let them past.
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Powderhound wrote:
How about your way?


bad bad bad down here, take it easy. I've spent the season to date pretty much in the trees, not that it always helps, look at this slide that happened last Friday

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With refernce to pole tapping, it's also a damn good idea on traverses/cat tracks if you are approaching a snowboarder from their heel side, in the blind spot.
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Powderhound wrote:
Safe descents are a luxury, so move over and if you hear poles being banged behind you, look up the hill and get out the way, I'm in a hurry!! wink


Do you drive a BMW by any chance? rolling eyes

Anyone doing this to me when I'm in progress skiing slowly with my intermediate fiancee will get exactly the opposite response. On an open piste no-one has any right to force or intimidate others out of their way, no matter how fast they're going or how good a skier they are. If you're that good a skier ski go round us leaving a wide berth.
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Davidof, Looks unpleasant. Those big blocks are perfect leg breakers... The helmet will protect the head against the trees but not your neck or legs. Everyone OK? Looks like some tracks coming out the bottom or are those where you crossed the rubble?

Off to Hochkoenig tomorrow for the weekend then the following week in Lech. Given the warm weather, some snow up high and old rotten snow pack beneath, probably going to stick to the obvious, safe routes rather than anything too adventurous.
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Quote:

my intermediate fiancee

Sideshow Bob does she know she's not your final fiancee? Toofy Grin
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Powderhound, to state that once someone gets a lid on they think they're robocop and immortal is retarded...i have been wearing one for 6 years and my speed or confidence has not changed from when i wore a hat...i always skied hard and was always confident in my abilities anyway...this is the general consenus amongst the 8-10 people i ski with who also wear lids...i can say one thing though..i took my niece and nephew away again this year and my nephew borrowed my lid because he had grown out of his..i wore a hat for the first time in 6 years and did not feel safe at all...my view is that anyone in a hat is a fcui<ing imbecile...they should be mandatory pieces of equipment...i know that much of the problem is that retards don't like change, and aren't comfortable with embracing the new, even if it is clearly the most sensible safe option, they ignore it and invent all this krap in their heads to justify being a moron i.e. your robocop statement... typical british gaperness...as for goggles and peripheral vision, that is more bile...a good pair of goggles will not effect vision adversely in any way...as for where you choose to park up or pushing off without looking, that is common sense...you either have it or you don't...unfortunately the way parents are with kids these days, common sense is not allowed to manifest itself, so things will get much worse and more dangerous, hence the need for a helmet ...



okbye
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Sideshow_Bob wrote:
Powderhound wrote:
Safe descents are a luxury, so move over and if you hear poles being banged behind you, look up the hill and get out the way, I'm in a hurry!! wink


Do you drive a BMW by any chance? rolling eyes

Anyone doing this to me when I'm in progress skiing slowly with my intermediate fiancee will get exactly the opposite response. On an open piste no-one has any right to force or intimidate others out of their way, no matter how fast they're going or how good a skier they are. If you're that good a skier ski go round us leaving a wide berth.


Reading this with interest I'm a helmet wearer who wears it to protect my head - you only get the one and I wouldnt go out clcling or horseriding without one and certainly not skiing. I think the arrogance factor doesnt come from wearing a helmet, its already there and you arent going to change it. My pet hate are the idiots who come flying down blues or on crowded pistes - I narrowly missed getting taken out in a big way in St Anton last week by just such an idiot - its funny you very seldom see that sort of behaviour on reds or blacks isnt it?

I do take issue with the BMW driver comments- Who's forcing or intimidating anyone out of the way?Your attituide is more BMW than Powderhounds ie I'll ski at my pace and bug anyone else who wants to get past ( think the Highway Code)- Pole banging is just a way of letting you know someoners else is there and on narrow pistes its easier to let someone go past in control than put yourself and fiance under pressure - perhaps you'd prefer air horns and indicators tro be compulsory on all ski wear .Common sense and courtesy are all thats needed.


Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Thu 25-02-10 12:53; edited 1 time in total
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Schuss in Boots wrote:
I disagree completely, I started wearing a helmet recently but I've always been arrogant. Toofy Grin

DB wrote:
My helmet is so comfy that just last Tuesday I forget I was wearing it and stopped being arrogant. Luckily I soon remembered and went back to being a complete T**T.


These are the correct answers, Everything else I put down to headphones, I'm so surprised how many people do it nowadays, just look out for it the next time your on the slopes.

Don't they know they are missing out on one of the great joys of Skiing, the Silence of the mountains as your just about to push off then the sound of good turns cutting through the snow. It's one of my great joys.


Freddie Paellahead wrote:

My bugbear (other than the obvious skiing faster than your ability to stop) is the people who venture off the side of the piste in order to do a little jump back on again - often re-joining the piste blind and in the air (and therefore out of control because you can't turn if your skis are not in contact with snow) Evil or Very Mad


Mine to and if one of the Fitzwilliams ever hits me he had better make sure he knocks me unconscious first. Twisted Evil
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Powderhound wrote:
The helmet will protect the head against the trees but not your neck or legs.
As a helmet wearer, I've always taken the view that trees are so sturdy that my helmet wouldn't really help very much if I head-butted one. The only way to stay safe in the trees is to ski defensively with an appropriate level of caution. OTOH, my helmet is likely to be of great value if I strike my head hard on a hard-packed piste. My son took a nasty tumble last week and had a headache for a couple of days after whacking his head on the snow. I suspect that things would have been rather worse if he hadn't been wearing a helmet.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Hundred quid on a helmet or a hundred quid on a ski lesson. Most injuries are self-inflicted and as a direct result of losing control, most often attributable to poor technique, being over-equipped or tiredness (out of shape). I don't wear a lid but then I'm an arrogant SOB.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Arrogant people like me need all the protection they can get for when it kicks off. Plenty of ventilation slots mean my lid is comfortable enough to wear for Apres Ski too.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
DB, plenty of ventilation means that your head is not getting all the protection it can get. Racing helmets appear to have no obvious vents. As ever, life is a shabby compromise.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Powderhound wrote:
This year more than any other helmets have become ubiquitous. I have no problem with that.

The problem, though, is that it appears that people think that the helmet makes them immortal and therefore they do not have to check up the slope before setting off...

I ski in North America more than in Europe. Almost everyone wears a helmet over there, and behaviour on the trails is generally exemplary. I suspect that overcrowding is a much bigger encouragement to bad behaviour than helmet wearing.

Last week I noticed that Jackson has prominent signs about helmets near many of its lifts. Essentially these said that the resort encourages you to wear a helmet but to ski as if you weren't wearing one. Coming from a resort with a famously gung-ho approach, that felt like a very sensible attitude.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Quote:

Powderhound, to state that once someone gets a lid on they think they're robocop and immortal is retarded...i have been wearing one for 6 years and my speed or confidence has not changed from when i wore a hat...i always skied hard and was always confident in my abilities anyway...this is the general consenus amongst the 8-10 people i ski with who also wear lids...i can say one thing though..i took my niece and nephew away again this year and my nephew borrowed my lid because he had grown out of his..i wore a hat for the first time in 6 years and did not feel safe at all...my view is that anyone in a hat is a fcui<ing imbecile...they should be mandatory pieces of equipment...i know that much of the problem is that retards don't like change, and aren't comfortable with embracing the new, even if it is clearly the most sensible safe option, they ignore it and invent all this krap in their heads to justify being a moron i.e. your robocop statement... typical british gaperness...as for goggles and peripheral vision, that is more bile...a good pair of goggles will not effect vision adversely in any way...as for where you choose to park up or pushing off without looking, that is common sense...you either have it or you don't...unfortunately the way parents are with kids these days, common sense is not allowed to manifest itself, so things will get much worse and more dangerous, hence the need for a helmet ...



okbye



snowpatrol writing rational commonsense - is he growing up? Laughing
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Quote:

snowpatrol writing rational commonsense

Where? All I saw was the usual aggressive cretinous tripe.
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achilles wrote:
DB, plenty of ventilation means that your head is not getting all the protection it can get. Racing helmets appear to have no obvious vents. As ever, life is a shabby compromise.


Thanks good point, I think I'll get one of these then ....
http://pix.motivatedphotos.com/2009/2/13/633701136919450060-darkhelmet.jpg
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Sideshow_Bob wrote:
Powderhound wrote:
Safe descents are a luxury, so move over and if you hear poles being banged behind you, look up the hill and get out the way, I'm in a hurry!! wink


Do you drive a BMW by any chance? rolling eyes

Anyone doing this to me when I'm in progress skiing slowly with my intermediate fiancee will get exactly the opposite response. On an open piste no-one has any right to force or intimidate others out of their way, no matter how fast they're going or how good a skier they are. If you're that good a skier ski go round us leaving a wide berth.


BMW rear-wheel drive or gimmicky x-drive in the Alps? Don't think so. DP Pros actually. You are demonstrating a mature attitude indeed - it is for your and your fiancee's benefit that people want them to know you are there and I am not talking about wide open pistes. Too often people of lower/intermediate ability believe that they have a god-given right to use the entire width of the slope, turn completely unpredictably, flail their poles and look steadfastly straight ahead. I, and those I ski with, ski as far to the outside as we can, usually on the soft snow swept aside by those gone before us and taking great pains to give as wide a berth as we can - this for our benefit as well as the downhill skier. If it looks like there might be a chance that the person in front is going to turn into our path - or set off into our path (the subject for this thread in the first place I you care to remember) - then it is good manners to alert them to your presence and shouting is antisocial at best, alarming at worst so a last resort only.

snowpatrol, best you read who is saying what before you launch without checking your 6 (apposite given the thread subject though), not me making comments about immortality and o robocop-ness. Although I do tend to broadly agree with davidof as it happens. I think you should perhaps check who you are calling an imbecile or a retard too. I do not wear a helmet regularly, out of choice, despite having lost one friend who died from head injuries after an innocuous fall a few years ago and that is up to me, not you or any authorities. I have been variously an Alpine racer specialising in Downhill, a mountain guide and a ski crosser so understand this game better than many. The thread was not inviting comment on whether it is right or wrong to wear a helmet - something I am completely disinterested in - but the correlation between the wearing of helmets with the associated loss of sensory input and then becoming a nuisance, or danger on the slopes. Like Sideshow Bob and his part-time (sideshow?) fiancée.

And do you know what, most of this chat reinforces why I, and most of my ski friends spend 99% of our time avoiding pistes and ill-mannered, ill-informed punters to search for fresh tracks or new lines...
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Powderhound wrote:

And do you know what, most of this chat reinforces why I, and most of my ski friends spend 99% of our time avoiding pistes and ill-mannered, ill-informed punters to search for fresh tracks or new lines...


good

OKBYE
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Retards who set off from choke points without looking up first, morons who jump back onto a busy piste without regard to other skiers, dicks who treat beginners like gates, gapers who ski backwards on busy pistes, Boarders who sit in the middle of pistes just below a rise, idiots who stand around gossiping in the lift drop off zone, Darwin award contenders who risk their own lives and those of others by skiing 'out of bounds' and ignoring avalanche warnings.

Yes there are foolish and rude people in the world. This has NOTHING to do with their headgear.
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Powderhound, 32nd word in on your OP...what is that word? it looks like immortal to me....and i was calling ANYONE without a lid a retard and imbecile, not just you...this includes my two sisters and B.I.L's who will testify to the fact...


okbye
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