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Ski Beat - the worst ski trip experience ever?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
sloop wrote:
stoatsbrother wrote:
anyone noticed any changes to the OP ? wink

It could just be one of the mods expressing their deep affection for Terry....


Or maybe someone has received a solicitor's letter. wink
snow report
 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
PJSki,
Quote:

Or maybe someone has received a solicitor's letter

Do you think a big company like Ski Beat would do that rather then come on here like Neilsons did and explain/apologise/reassure?
snow report
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Or maybe someone is just reflecting on the issue that they recounted their awful holiday experience and treatment by a TO on Snowheads as a warning to others only to get slaughtered by "know-it-all's" and "barrack-room lawyers"???? Just an alternative scenario..... but some of these threads do make u feel that way at times...... wink [blindfold in position sir..... firing squad take aim..... and.... FIRE] wink
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Actually I am still here, but as I know every post I make (all 3 of them on this subject to date Confused ) seems to excite some of the more, ahem, excitable members here, I am only posting when I have something relevant to say. (Some other members would be wise to follow that sentiment Laughing ) Also, as some of the members here who seem to be familiar with my private life should be aware of, I am a very busy person wink .

I feel I ought to point out here that there are people posting on the week and experience in questions with other names who are NOT me, because Ski Beat managed to upset more people than just me. Also, someone stated that I had made posts on this subject on at least 4 other websites. Again, that was NOT me. I have just posted the review at the start of this thread, and I copied it over to Mumsnet - no, I don't know why they pulled it. And I don't believe it was Snow Joke either. I will repeat what I have just said - Ski Beat managed to upset more people than just me that week. If anyone would like to direct me to where these other people are commenting on their holiday in negative tones, though, I would be most interested!

Anyway, as the thread no longer seems to be a review of a TO's shortcomings, and seems to be a lot more personal in so many different ways, please all get back to whatever it was you were up to. I have a thick skin (remember, I work with angry holiday makers too - and I would certainly never deal with a passenger who had felt let down by their treatment the same way SB treated me and my group.) I am frankly astonished at how upset some of you have got that I had the temerity to complain (and yes, I was using the last resort when I started this thread. Sometimes the last resort is called for when other more civilised approaches have failed.) And to those who think there is nothing at all wrong with getting upset about being kept in the dark for nearly 2 days, carted across the Alps in a hair-raising way by a dangerous driver, and then yelled at by 2 separate members of staff when we have done nothing more than ask for for info and assistance - a genuine thank you! Proof that not everyone in the world has gone mad.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
pandora, http://www.reviewcentre.com/reviews148725.html
Another negative review of Ski Beat that was mentioned in this thread a couple of pages ago .

Quote:
Once we were finally loaded on to the coach we realised it was filthy and that the driver was tired and kept veering from one lane to other! While on the coach the rep said nothing - no apology, no this is what is going to happen etc and then proceeded to jump off half an hour before we arrived at the resort leaving us totally baffled!

Thought things would get better but oh no the next morning the Area Manager decided to yell at us that he didn't have to listen to our complaints about how we had been treated.

The above sounds very similar to your 'Ski Beat' experience.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
pandora wrote:
Actually I am still here, but as I know every post I make (all 3 of them on this subject to date Confused ) seems to excite some of the more, ahem, excitable members here, I am only posting when I have something relevant to say. (Some other members would be wise to follow that sentiment Laughing ) .


...and how do we explain a ten fold drop in posts Very Happy
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
pandora wrote:
I am frankly astonished at how upset some of you have got that I had the temerity to complain (and yes, I was using the last resort when I started this thread.


IMO most people feel you have the right to complain and will defend this right. No problems what-so-ever with that. It's just that your only possible reason in posting as you did was to cause harm to the tour operator, it stopped being a complaint very quickly and turned into an attack. However you dress it up or try to justify your post, there is simply no other possible explanation.

You may, as many people do, use the adage of "ensuring it doesn't happen to others", or "vent my anger as, after months of correspondence, nothing has happened", or "feel that people should know what really goes on", or... well you get the meaning. You posted on a public forum about what you felt was a problem (or a number of problems). You littered your post with innuendo, used children's discomfort to back up you arguments (which is always a bad mistake), and generally went over the top. You argument were so plainly subjective and littered with (well thought out) emotive adjectives that you lost the main topic of your complaint.

Basically due to snow your transfer was messed up, you didn’t like the reps, your group and the reps had a shouting matching and you feel the coach driver was not driving safely. Please read your own post and see if you really did (with hind sight) extend your argument way above this.

You can't expect to slag off someone or a company and then feel aggrieved when the same thing happens to you. OK, many of the post concerning you may be incorrect, stupid, malicious or just downright silly (that’s the nature of the internet). Maybe it would have been better if you had remained stoical and pursued the matter through the normal channels rather than, in a spat of holier than thou maliciousness sort to wound the TO.
Always remember that "live by the sword, die by the sword", you started this off, so you can’t complain now, when the thread doesn’t just follow blindly along with the tone your original post.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Wayne, Cool
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Couldn't put it better myself! Whta's more, does she seriously expect us to believe that the coach company would allowe their driver to exceed his driving hours. He would be driving on a tacho and the law is rigorously upheld by the Gendarmes in France. She seems to have exagerated everything to illicit as much sympathy as possible - I bet she can shout. Cool
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
Has snowheads always been a place for people to demonstrate what utter cocks they are, or is it just this thread in particular? Whenever you think you might have found a little corner of the internet that is actually civilised it just goes and disappoints you again.

Thanks for the info op. Of course I know its a subjective view (how could it be anything but) but it was interesting nonetheless and I'll bear it mind next time I book a holiday.
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
A storm in some D Cups IMO
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Mattgcp, Snowheads, like any internet forum, has always been the same......and always will be.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Mattgcp,

Yes they manage it on an astoundingly regular basis, probably why so many have posts counts in the tens of thousands...
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
cabin boy, I'll have a bloody mary, please.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
pandora, another well measured post, puts those egos with their petty sniping back biting posts to shame. I actually think many SH are probably quite embarrased about this thread, if I had stumbled across this through a Google search then I doubt i'd be rushing to sign up to SH. I also once made a post complaining about a TO and, as in your experience, got many attacks against me...no idea why that is...perhaps we shouldn't be messing with the "old boys club" rolling eyes
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I was interested in the report in the same way we look at a car crash when we go past. We shouldn't be interested but we are.

The OP clearly felt very strongly about the trip, and I don't mind one jot that she used strong language and emotion to convey that. It made clear to me just how bad it probably was for her to post openly such a strong reaction. Unless she has some weird axe to grind against Ski Beat, which nobody seems to have suggested she does (and there's no reason for her to, other than her experience on this trip) it came across as a customer who had been really badly let down and treated badly. Simple.

For all those who'd rather have a bullet point summary of complaints and problems, unfortunately that would make the world a lot less interesting, the detail helps to build a picture instead of us just assuming it is someone coming along to have a whinge.

Personally when I encounter trip reports like the OP I sign up for that kind of forum. It's not just someone venting at a company they don't like much, it's specific, it helps me to decide who to travel with and where to spend my money (as a relative newcomer to booking my own ski trips) and it gives me plenty of info to decide whether that standard would be acceptable to me or not. When I sign up for a forum and all I see is "Isn't XYZ wonderful, they were nice to me" for page after page, it means I know I can't rely on any problems to get flagged up by users for everyone's benefit.

Plus it's much more fun reading horror stories than TO brochures for trip reports Very Happy
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Ski Beat obviously don't care too much about their customers with young children or they would have come on to defend themselves. Most of those standing up for ski beat appear to be male. Therefore maybe they are a good company for a group of lads going skiing.

If I were looking for a ski holiday with young children with a TO I'd look at ski famille or family ski I think.
snow report
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
It is far too easy to hide behind a keyboard so you will always find a wide range of posts on forums. From my experience on other forums I have seen new members become experienced members and their posts become more critical and at times down right rude. Unfortunatley forums are a regualr stomping ground for trolls. Hopefully SH just has a few less of them. Most of the threads I read are good natured.
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pandora, any response so far with a formal complaint to the management of SB in the UK?
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Boredsurfing wrote:
PJSki,
Quote:

Or maybe someone has received a solicitor's letter

Do you think a big company like Ski Beat would do that rather then come on here like Neilsons did and explain/apologise/reassure?


SB aren't here and the OP has been edited by a snowHeads official rather than the OP herself. So something has clearly happened. Could it be that the OP went OTT with the OP and the MO of SB sent an SL to the CEO of SH.C on the QT?


Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Wed 27-01-10 17:43; edited 2 times in total
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You'll need to Register first of course.
Quote:

It is far too easy to hide behind a keyboard so you will always find a wide range of posts on forums. From my experience on other forums I have seen new members become experienced members and their posts become more critical and at times down right rude. Unfortunatley forums are a regualr stomping ground for trolls. Hopefully SH just has a few less of them. Most of the threads I read are good natured.


Mike-H.... you're absolutely bang on the nose with these comments [in my extremely humble opinion offered in no context whatsoever as a relative newbie who knows SFA about anything of course.... thought I'd better qualify my position before going on...]..... most of the threads do indeed start in a good natured manner.... but the mood soon changes when one or more "experienced members" don't hold the same view or opinion as the person who started the thread in which case they break the post down into individual words, take whichever little bit they fancy, rip it to shreds in a holier than thou manner and make the original poster feel as though they wished they'd never ever shared anything in the first place despite the fact that the purpose of the forum is exactly that..,

Quote:

pandora, another well measured post, puts those egos with their petty sniping back biting posts to shame. I actually think many SH are probably quite embarrased about this thread, if I had stumbled across this through a Google search then I doubt i'd be rushing to sign up to SH. I also once made a post complaining about a TO and, as in your experience, got many attacks against me...no idea why that is...perhaps we shouldn't be messing with the "old boys club"




Shimmy Alcott, .... well said.... I concur completely with your post (with the same disclaimer as above of course...) wink
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
im with the posters above
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
PJSki, Laughing
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
nick0861, how far above Laughing Confused
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
above up to (bit not including) cabin boy wink
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
nick0861, I thought you meant all of them
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Quote:

nick0861, I thought you meant all of them


all 17 pages worth..... nothing like sitting on the fence eh? wink wink
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Mattgcp, geeo, Shimmy Alcott, SnowGod, nick0861, Can I assure you that snowHeads is a shadow of it's former self over the last 18 months or so. No poster has been banned for attacking another or for issuing death threats aginst another's children. Admin hasn't had to pull a thread and then pm everyone that partook with an explaination and nor have we had threats of getting barristers and solicitors involved to resove issues between posters.
What you see on the site today is as others have eluded to is now pretty standard for an internet forum.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:

What you see on the site today is as others have eluded to is now pretty standard for an internet forum.


.... and possibly a reflection of the society we live in eh?
wink
ski holidays
 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I'm grateful that Pandora described her experience with Ski Beat. I was a very satisfied SB customer in 2009 - we had one of the best chalet holidays ever and I nearly booked again with them for this year - same week and same resort as Pandora. I heard lots of horror stories while in another resort that week. The weekend of 9/10 January was truly chaotic and must have been a nightmare for airlines and tour operators and their staff. I am always interested to hear of other skiers' experiences with tour operators because it helps me decide whom to choose next time. That is one of the benefits of the internet and why I have followed this (unnecessarily) lengthy thread. All I want now is to read what SB have to say about the complaints. Depending on their response, yes I would travel with them again.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Quote:

What you see on the site today is as others have eluded to is now pretty standard for an internet forum

this whole thread is eluding me..... wink
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Wayne wrote:
pandora wrote:
I am frankly astonished at how upset some of you have got that I had the temerity to complain (and yes, I was using the last resort when I started this thread.


IMO most people feel you have the right to complain and will defend this right. No problems what-so-ever with that. It's just that your only possible reason in posting as you did was to cause harm to the tour operator, it stopped being a complaint very quickly and turned into an attack. However you dress it up or try to justify your post, there is simply no other possible explanation.

You may, as many people do, use the adage of "ensuring it doesn't happen to others", or "vent my anger as, after months of correspondence, nothing has happened", or "feel that people should know what really goes on", or... well you get the meaning. You posted on a public forum about what you felt was a problem (or a number of problems). You littered your post with innuendo, used children's discomfort to back up you arguments (which is always a bad mistake), and generally went over the top. You argument were so plainly subjective and littered with (well thought out) emotive adjectives that you lost the main topic of your complaint.

Basically due to snow your transfer was messed up, you didn’t like the reps, your group and the reps had a shouting matching and you feel the coach driver was not driving safely. Please read your own post and see if you really did (with hind sight) extend your argument way above this.

You can't expect to slag off someone or a company and then feel aggrieved when the same thing happens to you. OK, many of the post concerning you may be incorrect, stupid, malicious or just downright silly (that’s the nature of the internet). Maybe it would have been better if you had remained stoical and pursued the matter through the normal channels rather than, in a spat of holier than thou maliciousness sort to wound the TO.
Always remember that "live by the sword, die by the sword", you started this off, so you can’t complain now, when the thread doesn’t just follow blindly along with the tone your original post.


My opinion on this has drifted around a bit as the thread has rumbled on, but now I pretty much agree with you. I think basically this forum has been used as a weapon of revenge rather than an avenue down which to pursue justice.

The calls by some for SB to post in here are really more about certain people wanting to raise the profile/importance of snowHeads and, by association, themselves rather than anything else.
ski holidays
 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Jehu,
Quote:

All I want now is to read what SB have to say about the complaints. Depending on their response, yes I would travel with them
Very well said. Politely and concisely too! wink But, like PJSki, I don't really see why SB should post here if they don't want to do so. It would be nice if the OP could keep us informed of any progress she makes - but I wouldn't blame her if she didn't, considering some of the crap that's been flying about.
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I can't be arsed reading it all through, I did read the OP and a few posts that followed originally and am quite amazed at how this thread seems to have developed.
The OP had good cause for complaint and as this is a free for all forum has every right to air her views. We had a similar diversion and long wait at Munich airport last year but we were all adults so just chilled in the bar. With small children this will have been a total nightmare, I remember one time 25 years back being delayed overnight at Malaga with a wee one. It is not fun.
OP has my sympathy and support but I do hope you have made contact with Ski Beat. I have travelled with them before and don't think they are any better or worse than others although some of their staff did not display much in the way of personel skills, the resort manager in particular.
Can't understand why it appears that some of the posting has got hostile?
We are here for each other afterall, That is what I have grown to like about SH.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Nothings changed in 18 months
It's the usual snowheads drivel, loads of people with self inflated egos thinking they know best
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northantsred wrote:
Can't understand why it appears that some of the posting has got hostile?
Its like a court case where only one side has given evidence. Would you send the other side down based on whats been presented. Probably not.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
pam w wrote:
Quote:

What you see on the site today is as others have eluded to is now pretty standard for an internet forum

this whole thread is eluding me..... wink


Hehe, good spot. Laughing
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Quote:

We had a similar diversion and long wait at Munich airport last year but we were all adults so just chilled in the bar.


northantsred, chilling in the bar in Munich for 48 hours... WOW.... must have been like the Oktoberfest by the time you'd finished drinking wink wink wink Laughing

Quote:

Its like a court case where only one side has given evidence. Would you send the other side down based on whats been presented. Probably not.



BergenBergen, have you looked closely at the British Justice system lately.... I think the answer is "probably would" wink wink wink wink
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
I have just come back from Ruka/Lapland. Went with Inghams but flew Jet2.com. We were all checked in at Kuussamo airport the plane landed from Gatwick, then they announced a delay due to technical fault. They kept this up for a couple of hours, then presented us with letters of apology. Next thing on the board flight cancelled. 10pm by this time. We did'nt know whether to phone Inghams rep but thought may-be their responsibilities had ended once they got us through check in. Within the hour, several coachs came and took us all back to resort and we were all put up in the best hotel in Ruka. Only problem we could not get any food. So we got to have another days holiday. Inghams reps were even helping with check in at hotel. Cant fault Inghams but I would never fly Jet2 again. Their planes are so old and decrepid, never again.
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geeo, SnowGod, nick0861, geeo, northantsred etc - what BergenBergen, said is dead right.

For those who are now indulging in the usual "Isn't snowHeads awful" and "isn't every one taking her words out of context" and "why aren't we just there for her?" stuff above, the answer is that because unless you are a gullible muppet, you don't automatically take things reported to you on trust. Pandora obviously had an awful start to her holiday, and a friend of hers has backed up what she said.

But - without as far as we can tell having explored a complaints procedure on her return to the UK (still waiting on a reply Pandora!) - she has published the names [now removed] of two staff members in a Google searchable forum along with her perspective of the events. It is difficult not to conclude that her original post was a combination of catharsis and revenge. Slightly different from the avoid-chucking-blame-around-whilst you-investigate approach in her own industry too Wink

None of the rest of us actually know exactly went on. It is interesting and valid to hear the perspective from industry insiders like Wayne - and from people who have worked for and travelled with Ski Beat. Some of the contribtuions (TFC wink ) are stirring - and there was the usual DG initiated anonymity-is-bad interlude - but hey - welcome to the internet.

Free speech means you are going to hear opinions that you do not agree with, and be asked questions you might prefer not to answer. So don't expect this or any other internet forum to be dedicated to unambiguously supporting people in an unquestioning fashion. rolling eyes
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