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The Gendarmes are out to get us on the A26

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
So why is it that the law as it pertains to driving is something that seemingly many otherwise "law abiding" folk feel justified in ignoring, because they "don't agree with it", it's "inconvenient" or simply doesn't apply to them because they are endowed with above average driving abilities? I still haven't read any justification for this wilfull misconduct.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Yoda, I can only speak for myself .... but there are a number of issues at play in my brain I suspect
- Old enough to remember when motoring was a great 'freedom' and was treated as such
- The 'macho' boy effect of speed
- A 'belief' that motoring offenses are not that serious ( a misnomer, but otherwise why would I ever speed?)

There are no excuses really as there is no justification and, when caught, no excuse can reasonably be given.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Agenterre, not sure about the first one, as many of the Fiestas etc that blast past me at 90+ are driven by women Toofy Grin

We've even got a trainee driving instructor admitting to it "because he was in a hurry" on another thread Confused

Well I'm sure we'd all like to be instantly beamed to wherever we want to go Laughing
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Yoda, overtaken by a lady driver? Shocked Does that really happen ? ... not in my sexist world ! wink
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I felt pretty safe on the autobahn seeing 248kph on the bike clocks. Made me almost wish I had a fairing Twisted Evil
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Agenterre, It seems life in the part of France where you live is different to where my parents live. It must be perfect there.

You didn't list the other countries in which MacDonalds sell alcohol. I am sure that they are all 1st world non p*ss head countries, but would you care to name them? Just so we can see that they are very similar to France, the UK and most countries we are familiar with.

I've just been to the pub with my FiL. He reminded me of when we went to the village fete a couple of years ago. It was a long drawn out affair involving much free alcohol from the moment everyone got there. Everyone from his village and the surrounding villages was there. After lunch and lots of wine over the meal, most drove away for a siesta and re-appeared 2-3 hours later. The evening was very drunken with dancing on the tables and people falling over. The fete was to raise funds for Les Bombers. They and the local police were all there for both sessions. Afterwards, everyone, including the drunken mayor and the gendarmes, drove home. Perhaps this sort of behaviour is unique to a small area near Chenonceaux, maybe not.

My Fil pointed out something else. Apart from the Parisians and those from Lyons and Marseilles, the French do not drive fast. In fact, they drive slowly. Their cars need an MOT once every two years and pretty much anything passes. Perhaps, he thought, the lack of vehicle safety in their older cars slows them down. "Either that", he said "or they are too p*ssed to see where they are going!"



Yoda, Why do we break laws? Most crims break laws because they think a) the laws weren't written for the circumstances they find themselves in, and/or b) they think there is little chance they will get caught. The more laws we create, the more we seem to be heading for a lawless society.
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
bar shaker, Yawn .... your sarcasm is nearly as bad as your facts ... like the CT you refer to above again anecdotal and full of BS ...


Like the internet, you shouldnt believe everything you hear at home.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
bar shaker wrote:
Agenterre, It seems life in the part of France where you live is different to where my parents live. It must be perfect there.

You didn't list the other countries in which MacDonalds sell alcohol. I am sure that they are all 1st world non p*ss head countries, but would you care to name them? Just so we can see that they are very similar to France, the UK and most countries we are familiar with.

......


Well, it's a few years ago but the McDonalds I used in Vienna certainly serves / served alcohol.

(By the way, I had a valid excuse for being there. I was attending a function where they were only serving fish dishes, which I hate and I needed a quarter pounder (and a lager ) to survive the evening Smile )
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McD in Spain (Malaga) certainly sells beer. Not sure about wine though. (I had no excuse I fancied one Laughing )
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No sarcasm, don't take it personally.

Facts?? well we can only comment on personal experience, even though you may call these experiences BS. But then saying someone's argument is BS normally means you have run out of argument yourself.

As I said, your area seems to be different. Either way, I love the French way of life and love spending time there. Their taxes and employment laws mean I wouldn't want to run a business there so I live in the UK. That's looking less enjoyable by the day though, as we embrace anything that Europe sends out as regulation. If we are talking about ignoring laws we don't like, the French are right up there. We could learn from that.

McDs... not been in one for 15 years, except for a drunken night in Marseilles harbour after the rugby world cup quarter finals. I bought burgers and wine. You got me there.

Back to driving... well Agenterre has established that the French don't drink and drive and they don't speed (OK, a smidge of sarcasm there). All we need to work out now is just how their death rate on the roads is so much higher than the UK's.

In the meantime, keep your eyes peeled on the autoroutes, especially the A26 when heading back to Calais. Perhaps that last 1-2km before the Peage is a real accident blackspot.
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I lived in France for nearly a decade and on average my husband and I would get stopped (French reg car) at a 'roadblock' at least once a year for either breathtest, insurance or car check.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
gold whitesmith, Yes, spot-checks have become increasingly common over recent years. I would guess I see one every day when I drive ( most days). Ostensibly, as you say, they are to check insurance or previously to pull over seat-belt miscreants or, this year, to check hi-vis vests ( and why many French folk sling them over the back of their passenger seats). However 'road-blocks' they are not, nor were they designed to enable 'breath testing every motorist' as our France expert stated. The French consciously decided to enforce road-traffic rules as opposed to their previous attitude that appeared to be to ignore them all.

bar shaker, Anyone can say what they like ... but when they make a series of claimed facts (as opposed to opinion) that are nonsense then I ( or anyone else) can call them as BS.

I haven't run out of argument. In fact you havent even scratched the surface of my meagre knowledge, but as a foreigner my argument will be more limited than real locals and why I tend to qualify most of my opinion/fact with respect to France and French culture -- although being married into a French family with a consequent exposure to 'real' French life possibly helps a bit.

Some other points :-

Spot-Checks and Mobile Speed Traps --- No need to be tipped off. They all seem to be published beforehand in local papers (by law ?????) --- but I dont know anyone who goes looking for them!

McDo -- Many more than France --- Switzerland, Italy, Spain & Austria are others I've seen. Given I hate the place I'm amazed I've seen them. In my experience that makes the UK the exception not the rule in Europe ime?? ... possibly has something to with local licensing laws??? I dont know.

Average Speed - I know I am not alone in finding that we Brits drive much more slowly(cautiously) in the UK than the French in France. As soon as I hit Dover I get irritated by middle-lane hoggers etc -- congestion? Care? -- I have no idea. Speeding motorists are definitely not confined to residents of Paris, Lyon and Marseille.

Why is the French death rate so bad? --- Well I can only add my own conjecture.
- Little doubt that the French 'woke up' to their problem later than other countries. They may have had the laws but they were not enforced. For example, 15-20 years ago it was rare to see a Frenchman wear a seat-belt in my experience. I believed it would take a generation to put that right but the crackdown over the last few years has changed driving behaviour and attitudes faster than I imagined.
- The (better) French press regularly puts it down to the number of different nationalities that drive across/thru French autoroutes to access other countries. Whilst the fact that France as a gateway is OK - whether the accident rates are consequent to that is rather 'debatable'! Interestingly both the Alsace and Alpes Maritime have now reduced their autoroute speed limits to 110 km/h ( the latter by stealth!). It would be no surprise if the A26 went the same way would it?
- As I understand it the French drive more miles per capita than we do. Is it not c. 10,000 miles per annum in the UK and 15,000 km/pa in France? I'm always surprised that I average around 25,000 km a year in France -- I never did that regularly in the UK. My average journey length is probably twice what it was in the UK as well.
- Depends which stats you look at but France has significantly more kms of roads than the UK.
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
The reason that a large proportion of drivers exceed limits on motorways is because they judge that the risks are not significantly increased and the benefits are worth it.
I've never felt any guilt about travelling along UK motorways at 85mph indicated or faster, depending on the conditions.
I do get annoyed with cars hammering along the local 30 limit, not because of the limit, because of the disregard for the potential hazards.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
tomstickland, Wow .. another superior driver rolling eyes Anyone want to admit to driving at the speed limits being taxing ? Shocked No .. I thought not!
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Agenterre, Presumably you always drive at the speed limit. Or maybe you use common sense and drive according to the conditions. The conditions can be good, in which case driving in excess of the posted limit may be safe. Or the conditions may be such that driving at even half the posted limit would be stupid.

Do you believe emergency services vehicles should be allowed to regularly exceed the limit, as they regularly do? [Apart from breaking lots of other rules of the road!] In which case you must agree that for suitable experience/trained drivers the posted limit can be inappropriate.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Having been driven from France to Uk by Agenterre for about a 1000 miles from Grenoble to Durham last year, I can confirm that we were not stopped by any speed traps, or flashed by any cameras. No Uk parking tickets arrived in the post either wink . I arrived home in one piece. I can also confirm that the air was on occasions blue ,mainly caused by lane hoggers on Uk motorways. NO more than I would have expected from julesb though.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
RobW wrote:
Agenterre, Presumably you always drive at the speed limit. Or maybe you use common sense and drive according to the conditions. The conditions can be good, in which case driving in excess of the posted limit may be safe. Or the conditions may be such that driving at even half the posted limit would be stupid.

Do you believe emergency services vehicles should be allowed to regularly exceed the limit, as they regularly do? [Apart from breaking lots of other rules of the road!] In which case you must agree that for suitable experience/trained drivers the posted limit can be inappropriate.


No .. I dont always drive at the speed limit .. and have the endorsements to prove it. I am in the wrong.

My Issue is with tossers who believe they should make 'personal judgements' about what is safe based upon perceived conditions, personal circumstance ( vis-a-vis our 'driving Instructor') and their personal ability (arrogance) and consequently be immune from the law or have the right to question the law based upon that 'knowledge'.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Helen Beaumont wrote:
Having been driven from France to Uk by Agenterre for about a 1000 miles from Grenoble to Durham last year, I can confirm that we were not stopped by any speed traps, or flashed by any cameras. No Uk parking tickets arrived in the post either wink


Which of course is a totally different statement to saying you never broke the speed limit and never parked illegally.
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RobW, I don't think he did say that did he?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
RobW wrote:
Helen Beaumont wrote:
Having been driven from France to Uk by Agenterre for about a 1000 miles from Grenoble to Durham last year, I can confirm that we were not stopped by any speed traps, or flashed by any cameras. No Uk parking tickets arrived in the post either wink


Which of course is a totally different statement to saying you never broke the speed limit and never parked illegally.


As Helen observed ... where did I say that ????
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Agenterre, You didn't say that. You just weren't caught.

Quote:
My Issue is with tossers who believe they should make 'personal judgements' about what is safe based upon perceived conditions, personal circumstance ( vis-a-vis our 'driving Instructor') and their personal ability (arrogance) and consequently be immune from the law or have the right to question the law based upon that 'knowledge'.


Agreed. If you break the law, accept the consequences if you are caught.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
RobW wrote:
Agenterre, You didn't say that. You just weren't caught.


how frigging exact do I have to be ? I wrote ..


Quote:
No .. I dont always drive at the speed limit .. and have the endorsements to prove it. I am in the wrong.


.. anyways, I suspect my argument isn't with you :-

- It's with:-
the France 'Know-Alls' ( and many posters here like Toulousain-Kruisler know better than I). Also VERY illuminating to talk with JulesB ('cos unlike the rest of his clan he readily admits to struggling with the language ... but loves France so HIS VIEWS are something I have learnt from).
- The Arrogant ( I know better)
- The DICKHEADS who believe that the laws are beneath them
- Views like 'The French are after your money" when most evidence suggests that they are (unlike the UK) into prevention rather than cash-collection
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Agenterre wrote:
RobW wrote:
Agenterre, You didn't say that. You just weren't caught.


how frigging exact do I have to be ? I wrote ..

Quote:
No .. I dont always drive at the speed limit .. and have the endorsements to prove it. I am in the wrong.


Which if you look at the time-stamps was about a minute before I submitted my comment. So you shouldn't really be surprised I hadn't seen that reply.

The reply was in response to HB saying you'd not had a ticket. Keep up the good work!
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RobW, Apologies .. I hadn't appreciated that ... my error.
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Quote:
tomstickland, Wow .. another superior driver

Where did I say that I was superior? I just said that most people, like me, disregard the law because they think that they have a decent chance of getting away with it, plus they judge that the risks are not significantly increased.

Quote:
My Issue is with tossers who believe they should make 'personal judgements' about what is safe based upon perceived conditions, personal circumstance ( vis-a-vis our 'driving Instructor') and their personal ability (arrogance) and consequently be immune from the law or have the right to question the law based upon that 'knowledge'.


At what point did anyone claim to be immune to the law? In this case I choose to ignore a law when I think the personal risks are low enough in relation to the benefits offered. What has that got to do with opinion of personal ability?

Your issue with tossers is misguided - everyone should make a personal judgement about what is safe based on perceived conditions. That's the fundamentals of making judgements.

You should stop "being a tosser".
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