 Poster: A snowHead
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hi new to the forum just wandering if anyone knows about e s f les arcs 180 level 4 lessons i have been skiing about15 times so i can take on most pistes well but i am wanting to try some off piste just wandered if the level 4 lessons would do that .i do not rearly want to do private lessons as it works out very expensive when on your own thanks charlie 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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If you can, I'd try and source a qualified British instructor-if there's one in Les Arcs 1800 (haven't been in about 20 years).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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 are british ski instructors better than french e s f instructors arpart from the laungue barrier
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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charlie26, There's a lot of snobbiness about ESF with some horror stories doing the rounds of rude French instructors skiing away from ridiculously over-sized groups etc.
For what it's worth i've had private lessons with them in a number of resorts over the years and have always found them excellent.
Last season we went to Courchevel and were told by the holiday rep to avoid them like the plague because of the over-sized groups. On my advice my mate who was an absolute beginner had lessons with them anyway and ended up in a HUGE group of 3! And was skiing black runs by the end of the week and couldn't stop raving about his instructors.
I can't comment on the Les Arcs one or the particular lessons your looking at but based on my experiences i think they are a decent ski school with decent instructors. No doubt somebody will be along to contradict me soon 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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fastandicy,
That ESF have a lot of very good instructors is something that I agree with, I have had some great lessons with the ESF as well. Unfortunately I don't think that complaints about group size are just from anti ESF snobs. Clearly there are variations in practice from resort to resort but seeing groups of 10-12 and sometimes higher is commonplace.
The stories of them abandoning skiers are rare, but they have been reported by too many people including friends of mine to be dismissed entirely as hearsay.
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T Bar, agreed.
I'm not meaning to say that these incidents have never happened but i tend to go on my own experience of a company and i have always found them excellent. I think for an organisation of that size operating in that enviroment the fact that complaints are rare is a measure of how good they are.
As i said, this opinion is based only on my own experience. As a wise man once said "Opinions are like back bottoms. Everyones got one and they all stink" 
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I have only good things to say about them. Taught me to ski, within my second day of snow I was doing a basic form of parralel turning.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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ESF groups in school holidays (kids groups particularly) routinely have 12 people. That's a fact. However, in quieter times you may well have a much smaller group. All their instructors are excellent technical skiers and many of them will also be good instructors. It's a bit "luck of the draw" but if you are an advanced skier you are much less likely to find yourself in a big group. Telephone the ski school, tell them what you want to do, and ask what they suggest. Bear in mind, though, that if your fellow pupils are French then the instructor will spend most of his/her time speaking French. Fair enough, really. The only time I've had a private off piste lesson with an ESF instructor I think his English was probably marginally better than mine. 
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I think it depends on what type of learner you are and what type of instructor you get. If you are young and fit you'd probably be fine with ESF. I had very good adult group lessons from ESF in Vallandry (half term Feb 0 - they assigned two instructors to the beginner group of about 15 or so people. We stayed together for day one and then split with the instructors deciding on who was in which group. The only problem was that the instructors had absolutely NO idea why anyone might find skiing difficult, because neither of them could remember learning - they were both plonked on skis as soon as they could stand up. This meant they had limited patience with older or less fit learners and one lady was dropped from my group mid week because she couldn't keep up and wouldn't have managed the lesson planned for the next day. At least they didn't just abandon her mid lesson. I have heard of people being left to find their own way home because their group disappeared off without them.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Suspect level 4 won't be very busy, and would be quite interesting. Level 2 in Tignes was busy, but we did some off piste (vallee perdu) etc. Grand ski/level 4 sounded interesting as did L3 (but not for me, I'm a wuss)!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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My wife had a 1-on-1 snowboard lesson with the ESF in Oz en Oisans this year. I watched from a far and was very disappointed. He tried to get her to ride a drag. She fell over about 5 times; the instructor didn't offer any advice, and then finally gave up. She spent the rest of the hour being given minimal input and only being able to use the really basic beginners slope. I achieved far more with her in the same amount of time, and I'm only an intermediate.
My daughter, however, has been with the ESF twice and I have no real complaints.
It seems to be the luck of the draw as to the instructor you get.
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You know it makes sense.
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a friend highly reccomends "Bruno" the trainee instructor at Arc 1800 who will scare the poo-poo out of you off piste!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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bring on Bruno 
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Poster: A snowHead
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charlie26, when are you coming to Les Arcs. If you can ski all pistes then level 4 should be ok for there advanced groups. Like all ski schools, you get good and bad instructors and the group size does depend on what time of season it is. At level 4 there might not be many English speakers in your group but if you ask for an English speaking Instructor and make sure you get one then you should be ok. There are also a number of other ski schools in Arc 1800. See the link on the Snow reports page under the thread Les Arcs 2009 / 2010.
If you prefer to have private lessons PM me and I can give you names of very good english speaking instructors in Arc 1800, some work for ESF. There are a number that we use all the time for off piste trips.
Hope that helps. Depending on when you are out might see you in Arc 1800.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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charlie26, See what ski new generation (in vallandry) are offering for the week you are out. Small school, great instructors. You would struggle to make an 09:15 meeting in Vallandry, but for all their later classes you should be fine. They are flexible enough to set alternative meeting points if that works better for the whole group.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
it will take a few days to get a grip with the powder
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there might not be any powder of course! Other kinds of snow off piste, though.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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this year they will be lots of powder, keep the faith,
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I have skied many times with ESF and they have taught all of my children - in several resorts but mostly Les Arcs recently. I think they have been absolutely fantastic. When we go to France we are quite happy to 'do as the French so' - yes, sometimes this is a little different to the Brit way, but hey, we can get that at home! Sure they have a generally quite focused attitude to skiing and tend to take a no nonsense approach to children who want to spoil it for everyone else - but we've always felt that's what we are paying for.
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velodocuk, quite agree, they taught me when I was young, now they teach my neices, nephews and my friends kids and they are already becoming very good skiers or boarders, it just depends on the attitude you have towards there way of doing things. But you do sometimes get a bad instructor, but that can happen anywhere. If that happens, make a fuss and it should be corrected quickly.
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