 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi,
I've just bought a pair of Scott punishers 172cm to take on my first season. However I'm now very worried that they might be too short. I'm 6ft tall and weigh 185 pounds, I am an intermediate skier at the moment but am sure i'll improve rapidly while im out there. I plan to ski around 60% piste, 20% park and 20% off piste and wanted the punishers as a single quiver ski. I was planning to get the 181cm's but was persuaded that the difference between the 172's and 181's wouldn't be that significant, and the 172's are easier to carry and will be more fun through trees and in general. So i went with the 172's.
I'm worried that these will be slow and pretty useless in the powder, Please tell me i'm wrong! If i'm not what is the best thing to do, the skis are unused but have been traditionally mounted.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Are you seriously thinking that 4 inches on a 6 ft ski will make a huge difference.
I know a lot is written on this topic, but I would go with what you have.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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clearvision, no such thing as a 60% piste ski that's good in the powder.
Seriously: You will be OK at high speeds but the moment you slow down or point them anything much different than straight downhill, they will bog down. Not the ski you want for slower skiing, like in the trees the day after a powder dump.
All is not lost: they should be OK in bumps, in trees 4-5 days after the pow, on icey crust, in dense winddrift, and they should be pretty durn floaty in wet spring or wet maritime slop.
beequin 172cm = 5'7"  Of course, if the OP has big hands...4" extra may not make -that- much of a difference.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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comprex, perhaps I should have said 4 inches off a 6 ft ski. 
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IMHO they will be fine, alot is down to the skier technique more than the ski. I've skied 171cm 1080s in deep snow, and also in and around trees. I'm 5ft 10, 182 pounds and they were fine for me, no 'bogging' down at all.
Remember years ago folk (me included) were skiing very thin skis all mountain, on and off piste....
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Too short... The Punisher is a TT and will ski even shorter.
You might just get away with them if you are taking your first forays into deeper snow but they aren't going to help you much but be more easy to get them around...which isn't what you always want to do, IMV...
I bet you'll trade them up in a few weeks anyway... and so a 172 Punisher could be quite marketable.
Should defo have gotten the 181, IMV so that is a black mark for the guy who sold them to you, IMO.
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Yeah I was convinced at the time but it's slowly been eating away at me.
Realistically what is the best option if i do want to attempt to get a pair of 181's. Do i sell on ebay, how much can i expect them to go for? I've done some searches but not really found much, they are the 08/09 model. Will these be able to help me out http://www.skiexchange.co.uk/ ? I'm pretty annoyed I actually went with them now, but the decision kind of needed to be made there and then.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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clearvision, have you ever used them?
If not you could have a word with the shop that sold them to you, they may do a deal.
I agree though, too short.
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Nope never used them. I thought they wouldn't want to know as they've been drilled and mounted (this was done by them though).
It seems that most skis tend to go at £100 less than their market value, I can't really afford £110 for 4 inches of ski so i might have to just deal with it :-/
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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clearvision, how much would you want for them? I might be able to find you a home for them...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Well i paid £325 for them, I can't really afford to lose anything on them and I'll probably end up buying the 181's for the same price. But I suppose it's inevitable, how much are they worth?
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clearvision, Mosha Marc, has said the right thing in the posting above, as a first point of contact you should take them back to the shop and talk to them about the size issue and that you are unsure about the advise given at the time of purchase.
Did they really say "they would be easier to carry as a selling point"?????
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You know it makes sense.
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clearvision, no idea, let me get back to you..
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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clearvision, Well, the mistake...IMV..is made, so it is a question of what to do next.
Options, as far as I can see are...
like for like trade in the shop and maybe a cash sweetener from you to get this to work...IF necc...but don't offer this up front, IMO
as you'll probably lose money on any other route..I'd think,
or
you can use these in the resort for a few weeks and I don't think they will cost you too much
in skiing terms as you will be finding your feet and improving.. after you have reached the definitive conclusion...which I think you will defo do...you can knock on these skis as played in, I think a 172 Punisher would suit an agreesive tallish woman in resort so you might have market there.
Also, this playing for time will allow you to see where you are in ski terms and what suits you..
You might well be exposed to a whole host of skis that you like the sound of.
If you are fit and active, reasonably sporty AND doing a season, then the skier you start off as and the skier you end up as should be miles apart
and therefore your skis taste will alter accordingly. IMO..
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Poster: A snowHead
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There is alot of 'length' snobbery on snowheads IMHO!
The guy is an intermediate skier, I still think he'll be fine, and I 2nd JT's solution above to take them out there and then/when he becomes an improved skier or thinks the skis are holding him back, look to change.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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kitenski, your experience as described in this thread is based on a high-level skier skiing one of the softest and therefore floatiest skis available at the time, a ski that wasn't exactly renowned for piste performance either.
You are welcome to call our posts 'length snobbery' if we are allowed to call yours 'irrelevant to the OP'
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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comprex, In your earlier post you mentioned the advantages/disadvantages of skiing the short ski. Will there be similar differences if i ski the 181? Or will it be, in general, a much better ski for me?
Thanks for the advice, I think whether i change now depends on a) if the shop cuts me a deal, or b) how much I will lost if i attempt to sell now and buy a new pair. Does anyone know the market value of these? My pair has the Scott S10 Binding mounted in the traditional point.
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comprex, are you really honestly saying an intermediate skier won't be fine on a 172cm ski?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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clearvision, the 181 will be
more speed-capable on piste,
easier for you to keep front to-back balance on in powder, random chunky snow, and piled slushy strewth,
less prone to tip dive or lawn darting into the snow
slower to steer using foot rotation
lumpier and slower in moguls
-slightly- slower to engage on real hardpack
than the 172. All IMHO, of course.
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kitenski, I am really honestly saying that an intermediate skier of the OP's size will have a far better chance of being fine on a 181cm Punisher than a 172cm Punisher.
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| comprex wrote: |
| kitenski, I am really honestly saying that an intermediate skier of the OP's size will have a far better chance of being fine on a 181cm Punisher than a 172cm Punisher. |
Ok, I do concur in a 'just about to buy' scenario, but given the guy has already paid for and has a pair of 172s, unless he can swop them or sell them on for little loss, then I think he should start off on them and get a good few weeks out of them.
Regards,
greg
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comprex, not sure I agree that they'll immediately bog down at slow speeds in powder/trees. I skied some short fujatives through the trees a couple of seasons ago and they were fine (actually surprisingly good). I'll agree that longer would be better, but in OP's position I'd take them to resort and spend some time figuring out what kind of ski I like best...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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In the early days in the season you'll find the 172 easier to work with and you'll progress faster. Then you could try to sell it and buy a more suitable ski for the remainder of the season. That's probably the best option - but that's likely to cost more. (though you may well want to buy a used ski).
If that's not an option, and if you could still get the 181 now for only a little extra cash, then I would go for that. A little harder to improve in the early days but a lot more payout after the first weeks.
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clearvision,
IF...you are going to improve in short space of time and maybe dramatically, then no-one can put you on the correct pair of skis for the whole duration of your season.... IMV.
Thinking about it... take the skis you have and ski them for a few weeks and when you 'outgrow' them, then that is the time to think about changing them. As long as you look after those skis, they'll have a resale value in resort -hopefully- so knock them on...and you might just be lucky to find someone who is in the same position with a pr of skis that you like..can demo and the price is a right...
I don't know about resort resale prices, but I would think that skis could change hands for reasonable money around £200-ish..just a guess tho..and that would be my plan.
As I said before, hopefully you will be a much differnet skier in 8 weeks skiing time and your opinions will differ a lot.. and other 'seasonaires' may have the same sort of problem and be trading...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| ChrisWo wrote: |
| comprex, not sure I agree that they'll immediately bog down at slow speeds in powder/trees. I skied some short fujatives through the trees a couple of seasons ago and they were fine (actually surprisingly good). I'll agree that longer would be better, but in OP's position I'd take them to resort and spend some time figuring out what kind of ski I like best... |
ChrisWo, the Fujative is another of the super-soft exceptions that proof the floaty sizing rules.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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comprex, fair enough - I thought you might cite softness. They would've been softer than the Punishers will be, but with a 185 bloke on them I'm sure the Punishers will bend a fair bit 
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Attempting that exchange is tempting, but I kind of want the punishers as the reviews I have read have been overwhelmingly positive...
Well I'm going to phone the shop today, and ask for an exchange. If this isn't possible I'll ask if they'll sell me a second pair at a cut price then I'll flog the ones I have and buy the new ones at a small loss. I'm not willing to lose more than £50-£60 at the moment. So if I can't get a deal where I lose that much I'll take them to resort, ski them for a few weeks etc as has been suggested.
So all i need to know now is how much I can get for these unskiied, exactly as I had them when I left the shop. Any ideas? JT guessed at £200, but this is after I have skiied them. I'd hope I can get £270ish but i don't know how much skis depreciate once they're drilled!
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Poster: A snowHead
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clearvision, Personally I don't think you're ever likely to get much more than 50 - 60% of RRP for a set of skis that have been drilled, unless you get really lucky and finds someone who wants that exact ski, with a boot sole length pretty much the same as yours. What's the RRP of these skis? Did you get a deal when you bought them? I've sold quite a few sets of skis on ebay and whilst it can be a good place to sell, you may get a better deal if you take them out to resort with you
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'd second the train of thought about taking them out and giving them a go. At the beginning of last season I bought some Rossignol Scratch Bling twintips and remember agonising over whether to go for the 170 or 176 - only 6cm in it for goodness sake! I'm a little shorter and lighter at 5ft 10, and 178 pounds, and was an intermediate skiier. Ended up with the 170s, and they have been spot on - are taking me above and beyond the intermediate plateau. Piste, off-piste, powder, jumps - they seem to be happy whatever I use them for. I have yet to find their speed limit (and I have taken them at quite a speed), and even though they are a midfat twintip (86mm underfoot) I much prefer them on the piste to my previous skis, 180cm Salomon Crossmax (that were a bit too long for me).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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clearvision, whoever buys then will have to have bindings on them and unless yours are stinkers then I can't see them making any difference. It isn't as though putting bindings on them has spoilt them...just limted their choice of which ones. I doubt anyone makes useless bindings anyway..but some people have preferences so if they want to be picky then so be it.
If you do end up taking them to the resort, then you may well get in with a lot of pople who will be willing to trade and deal, so even if you sell cheap out there -likely- you'll be buying cheap, in all probability, so it is all reletive.
This last plan isn't the worse you can do, anyway, as the likelyhood is that you will need to change skis anyway...
Don't worry, the Punisher is a decent ski and one that is tradeable, I think....
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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They are last seasons model, the new ones are going for £450 with binding undrilled. Some places are selling the model I have for £240 undrilled without bindings and I bought them for £325 inc bindings.
I suppose i could just aim to lose 1.5 stone.
I'm so frustrated/confused that I managed to buy the ski in the first place, considering I was already planning on the 181. I thought it looked big, but I should have just been told 'it's fine, this is the better ski for you!'
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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clearvision, phone the shop and see what they say.........
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Spoke to the shop. A different member of staff, they said for my needs the 172 will be fine. The 181 will not perform as well on piste, but would be much better in the back country. And finally that I'd have more fun whizzing around on the shorter ski, easier to turn/jump/spin. Which is almost consistent with what's been said here...
So i guess I'll stick with it. If it's pants or I want something for the backcountry (like most of you are saying I will do), I can upgrade to the 181 (or another similar ski)/buy something massive in resort. No point in spending money now trying to change them when I haven't ski'd them and I'm not at a level where I'm certain I'd be able to tell the difference!
Thanks for the help all.
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clearvision, good for you mate.
There is a lot of toss talked about ski lengths etc. If you only want to do 20% off piste - improve on these and try some mates' skis during the season. Then find a short-arse who is struggling on long skis and swap
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FAQ
