 Poster: A snowHead
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hmmmm i wonder if he will do skiboards 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Just read the whole TGR thread - obviously not expecting reviews yet - but equally I cannot see any mention of anyone having received their orders yet. Probably missed it.
If this does work out - I'm in.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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rungsp, I'm in.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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This is a great Forum!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 
Wish I could join you but am saving for my GS skis. expecting full reports back!
Maybe I could throw my 10 pence in and suggest avoiding any on-piste skis as contrary to a lot of the posts above the R&D departments have certainly not been asleep for the past 50 years, a good piste ski is not simply a piece of wood and UHMWPE... (just a moment for the greatness that was the K2 merlins flashing light)
other than that DO IT home made skis ROCK!!!!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You're all just the Imelda Marcos-es of skiing hardware! 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Just supporting our industry through these troubled times 
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dulcamara, 
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Equipment section JONG's
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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please help me, I am not cool i don't know what JONG means?
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My good lady has just mentioned that this could be a birthday present.
I'M IN!!!!! 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I have my own opinion about such things, and it's far from positive. If it's about design, then sure go for it. You will never find better option. But if graphic design of ski is last thing you care about, I would advise anyone to stay away from this. Even though skis might look like a bit bend piece of wood with some ptex on bottom, they are really a lot more then that. Big companies spend millions to develop something better and faster, with all support from racers, with support of computer programs which far beyond programs that normal people have or even heard of. And then on the other side you have someone doing this in home garage, without any support, without any real knowledge and experience. Do you really think results are anywhere near?
Actually, big ski companies spend millions of dollars on ski racers in tights. The rest of the time they are scouring the internet looking for ideas they can steel. After that, they spend a second million on a brochure with liquid metal and springs. And then they hire some posers for a cool couple of thousand and call it a day.
The big companies use core stock that was developed in the snow board industry 20 years ago. They will come around to horizontal laminated core stock in good time. But, give them at least 3 more years. As for graphics, wow, they do make those big company skis "look" real good.
As for the computer programs that they use, "that normal people have not even heard of," so what. The geeks that punch the numbers in have no idea how to build a ski.
Garage, what? 333 is a new bread of company. Small carbon footprint, solar driven, with innovations that are far ahead of the big companies. And you park it in a garage.
"Something better and faster". Faster? what for? I go plenty fast. Oh you mean those guys and gals in tights? Ok, they get down the hill a couple of mils faster, but thats because of the tights. I poo-poo you not.
Experience. Ha Ha. I was key in designing the vertical laminated poplar/spruce snow board core, 20 years back. Ski companies adopted this core as there standard in most every ski they have built in China. But the horizontal core that I am now using is much better torsionally.
I designed the first round of bladder presses that are standard to the snowboard and ski industry way back in the day. I pioneered a good deal of carving technology and design in both industries. And, I figured out how to, build a ski from numbers, to finish using high end industry standard material in less than 2 hours 20 minutes using the sun. But I do not wear tights when I ski. But they sure look good.
I know better than to sound like I drink to much. Learned this from the TGR thread. But shucks, its fun. I hope that I have not offended and my spelling is Ok.
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You know it makes sense.
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333skis, welcome to snowheads mate and respect to ya.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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333skis, Welcome to the British madhouse that is snowHeads - and what kiwi1 said.
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Poster: A snowHead
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333skis, hi. Wouldn't worry about defending yourself all over again, the TGR thread states your case well and I'm sure having to argue why you're good at what you do on every forum on the net is frustrating.
On an actual ski related note, is it possible to have a stable, stiff charger that also has a lot of rebound and pop? Basically, can you do what DPS do (and charge $1300~ for) with their carbon skis in wood?
If not, how would you make a ski like a Line Prophet 90 (dims at 186cm: 125/90/113mm, 19.5m radius) with two sheets of metal in it feel less heavy/planky but maintain it charging well?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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primoz,I don't share your conviction about the big companies' ability to design and manufacture a better product. Many times, in my experience, it's just group think and doing a "good enough" job, then size, production capacity, marketing and shelf space keep them going.
There are exceptions of course, but I would not trust a large company to do a good job without thoroughly checking, and they do produce good gear, but not always, and certainly innovation and quality are not their main concerns. Many times, a talented individual can do better, on his own, critical word being "talented", as in well above average
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I am 100% convinced about the ability of small company skis on powder, I was all set to make some myself last year but ran out of funds (as I was a lowly bar tender). My question would be regarding Ice grip etc? Are skis like this prone to harmonics and chatter?
also is spyderjon mocking me? and are you the bloke who runs the little tuning shop in Nottingham?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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333skis, good to see you over here. Welcome to snowHeads. 
You will see that a lot of us are interested in getting your skis. I love the order form. I share your disappointment that US branded mass market skis are now made elsewhere.
A couple of questions
1) Any experience on exporting them to the UK? (we are a chifely UK/europe based web community)
2) I couldn't see any mention on TGR of people having received their ordered skis? How's it going?
Lastly - your post doesn't make it totally clear that the first paragraph is a quote from another poster to which you are responding... This forums software is a bit sucky. You can edit it to change it to italics or box it as a quote though...
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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If you read the 333 www site or TGR forum he hope to starts production end of this month.
Up until now he has only been setting the work shop up and fine tuning the techniques.
The idea of making custom skis for $333 is a great one. Construct them in a portable solar powered recycled trailer and the whole concept becomes simply jaw dropping.
Assuming they can actually deliver, and it sounds like they can, then 333 skis will be busier beyond their wildest dreams.
(from what I have read I don't think he originally planned to sell online!)
110% respect to someone for sticking that close to their core principals - and making a small stand against the corporate machine.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Thanks for coming over 333skis and welcome to the board.
As stoatsbrother says, if you can dig out some UK shipping prices then I think you might have some willing customers
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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primoz's attitude is fairly typical of big players in almost any sport/industry. They have to justify their size and budgets in effect.
Truth is most snow/surf/extreme sports need little manufacturers, led by enthusiasts and pioneers, to drive them forward. Each and everyone has its place.
Same directly applies e.g. to surf and windsurf where people have always made custom boards/sails and thus experimented with new concepts. Big players then take on, refine and develop the stuff for mass market, making the sport accessible to the masses which is often a good thing.
Good on 333ski for trying to develop a new way to do things. He isn't the first "insider" trying to start something new. Without him and others things would quickly stagnate..
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I'd be in for getting a pair and cutting shipping costs down
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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david@mediacopy, I'm probably interested in group ship too.
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I'd be interested in a group ship as well
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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actually make that 2 pairs
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Poster: A snowHead
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I just called and had a very interesting chat.
I am very reassured by what I heard, his knowledge, enthusiasm and honesty shone through.
Michael would prefer to do a group shipment and is getting shipping prices defined, will be on his website in a couple of weeks.
I'min for at least 2 pairs, maybe more!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hey all. When you bring your skis in I've always used PanalPina air freight. They've been the cheapest I've found in the past. Don't forget your 15%VAT and 3% duty. Let me know if you need any help. Always keen to support the small companies.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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kiwi1, Handling charges? I've been stiffed in the past on stuff from the states.
Hope to be in the US sometime next winter - maybe I'll wait till then?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Big ski companies have marketing budgets, small ski companies have reputations.
Not being a racer i know which type i'd rather go with every time.
F4S owner of 2 handmade pairs of skis
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I don't feel like arguing about this, but will still write few things and then really let it go. Afterall, it's not my problem. My first post in this thread was just my personal opinion about this kind of stuff, and on the end it ended with personal attacks, calling me idiot and some more.
| 333skis wrote: |
| As for the computer programs that they use, "that normal people have not even heard of," so what. The geeks that punch the numbers in have no idea how to build a ski. |
Actually things are "a bit" different in real world. I have been in skiing for years. First as racer (yeah one of those guys in tights), then I was serviceman for our World Cup team (now I'm just photographer, but I still get few info considering my really good friends and ice hockey teammates, are some of best servicemen and coaches on WC tour), so I actually know few things more about skis, then average skiers do. I was inside of those bad and ugly companies, and I actually saw how they put skis together and what they put inside of each ski. That's why I wrote on beginning that skis are more then just piece of woody with p-tex on bottom and fiberglass on top. I actually saw those "geeks who punch numbers", but I also saw ex-World Cup and Olympics winners designing skis for those bad and ugly companies, with current WC racers doing testing and suggesting improvements. But yeah I agree... what should they know about skis and skiing.... afterall they were or still are wearing tights, which makes them less of a skier.
But I actually partially agree about marketing hype. But then again, what is all this "proudly made in USA" different from marketing hype?
| 333skis wrote: |
| Garage, what? 333 is a new bread of company. Small carbon footprint, solar driven, with innovations that are far ahead of the big companies. And you park it in a garage. |
As long as you will be driving around with truck which has 8L machine and average of 10mpg, please give me a break about ecology.
And one last thing I'm going to write in this thread. Last page in this thread shows all the knowledge some of you guys have about skis. Noone of you ever saw these skis. Noone ever tried them, noone knows anyone who tried them. You have no idea if this ski can even survive till end of course, onlything you saw was one video, yet you are collecting orders for 15 or 20 pairs already. This tells just one thing... anything will do for your ski, as long as it sounds and looks cool. Personally I pick my skis differently, and I prefer to ski them first before I choose them. I prefer to pick length and stiffness which fits my skiing with trying different skis not via questions and answers like "my knees are so so". And most of all, I somehow don't trust any product will be great, just because video is cool.
But now I'm really staying out of this. Anyone does with his or her own money whatever they want, and anyone ski on skis which they want. I'm staying with bad and ugly big companies, some of you guys will obviously be happy with this skis. It's fine with me, and I hope it's fine with you. 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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It costs $333. It's "fully custom*. You really are totally missing the mark.
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| stoatsbrother wrote: |
kiwi1, Handling charges? I've been stiffed in the past on stuff from the states.
Hope to be in the US sometime next winter - maybe I'll wait till then? |
I think you guys have the correct idea though with a group buy. Handling charge is around £35 so with a group buy you pay it just the once. You'd just need to nomiate someone in the UK where the skis could be delivered and make sure that person has enough money to cover the VAT and duty on the whole shipment so when you get a call from the forwarder it can be paid before they deliver.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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First off I do agree with pretty much all primoz points (if a little militantly phrased). While I fully recognise [b/] 333skis [b] certainly knows more than me, I can't help think a company loaded with people who have dedicated their lives to this sport will be producing rubbish for the sake of it after decades of industry competition. As for the gimmicks i like a general rule that if it goes onto the top Race skis it probably makes a good difference, also if it doesnt it could always be a lead onto something that does... Heads intellegent system or atomics D-2 thingy for example.
I reckon we can argue all month about whether the skis will be better than a big companies, BUT i think that may be missing the point, apart from the fact we are mostly talking powder skis which are rarely covered in gimmics.... its not a massive amount of money and if it were me i would treat it like a little adventure. This may be your one chance to design your own skis, I definitely think those who are interested should go for it...
IF THEY MAKE YOU SMILE, THEN AT THE END OF THE DAY THAT'S ALL THAT MATTERS, SKIING IS A SPORT AND A FUN ONE AT THAT!!
peace
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also hey spyderjon, point in question
| Quote: |
Equipment section JONG's
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Internet forums confuse me... nevermind!!
I do remember you though, think got a fair few emails from you when I was captain of the uni team. Actually while we're on the point I may be on your case for some servicing kit in the near future.
Anyways, excuse that people.... back to all Becoming Ski Designers
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FAQ
you asked what JONG meant & I told you it is a TGR term. Why is that mocking you 