 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi there,
I'm currently a university student who tries to make it out twice a year for a weeks skiing. I would say that I ski at at least advanced level, but it's only now that I'm actually beginning to concentrate on what I ski on!
About 3 years I bought my first skis, some Atomic Metron M9s, which have done the job well, but are now just beginning to show their limitations.
I love skiing off-piste in powder, when there's been fresh snow. However, I also love going really rather fast on groomed runs too!
As I've always wanted a pair of Twin-Tips, I'm looking for a pair of these that can handle both of those requirements (preferably ones that can handle crud as well, so I at least have the option of going off-piste when all my friends have wandered OP!).
TBH, I don't really venture into the park very often (if at all), but it might be nice to have a pair that could at least handle some jumps if the mood takes me!
I realise that's asking a lot, but was wondering what people would recommend.
I've just come back from a week in Val Thorens. We had a fresh dump on one day, and luckily I was able to borrow a pair of week-old Rossignol S5 skis. These felt absolutely great (at least in comparison to my M9s) in both the powder and also on the groomed runs. I don't know whether I should get these, or possibly go for something else like the S6s, S7s, K2 Obsethed, or Line Bacons (to name but a few!)?
Luckily I have a friend in the US at the moment, who is able to buy whichever pair I choose. Cost isn't really too much of an issue, as I'm fairly frugal with most other purchases, and I have a fairly good job. However, that's not to say I would pay silly money for something which doesn't herald that much improvement!
I'm sorry that this thread has turned out so long, but I really would appreciate any help with these choices!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Ok im not gonna get fancy but sounds like youve done your research. Ill just list some skis i think are worth a look.
Armada ARV.
Line Blend.
Line Prophet 100.
K2 Obsethed.
Armada ANT?
Armada JJ. (115 and ive never skied but sound awesome)
Volkl Gotama.
I took some Obsethed cat skiing and were super fun. But not a ski for going "super fast on groomed runs", kinda noodly. Like the Bacon.
Good luck!
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Tue 31-03-09 0:28; edited 2 times in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Thanks very much Freeskier, I'll look into all of those a little more. This is the first time I've really wanted to buy a ski for a particular purpose and it's truly horrible when you've got to take the plunge without having tried the vast majority!
P.S. I've been reading fairly good reviews of the Line Sir Francis Bacon Skis - are these not worth a look as well do you think?
Comments positive or negative about them are very welcome!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| FatalSaviour wrote: |
P.S. I've been reading fairly good reviews of the Line Sir Francis Bacon Skis - are these not worth a look as well do you think?
Comments positive or negative about them are very welcome! |
Err, you do realise the irony here?
http://www.sirbacon.org/links/4idols.htm
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You're looking at some weird skis for railing groomers and busting crud as well as pow... stiffer and damper is your friend here not soft and pow orientated... does it have to be a full twin? If you're busying from the US and don't mind paying for the latest and greatest, PM Gear's Lhasa Pow is pretty much the one to beat for me. The 186 carbon sounds perfect for you.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| DaveC wrote: |
| You're looking at some weird skis for railing groomers and busting crud as well as pow... stiffer and damper is your friend here not soft and pow orientated... does it have to be a full twin? If you're busying from the US and don't mind paying for the latest and greatest, PM Gear's Lhasa Pow is pretty much the one to beat for me. The 186 carbon sounds perfect for you. |
DaveC is right. Bacons are super noodly.
You need stiffness to bash through the crud. Prophet 100s are pretty good as are the ANTs and ^^ the BROs.
A full twin does kinda limit the options especially when you're not hitting the park.
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Pity you weren't about last week, there were some good deals on High Society skis about.
Those Lhasa Pows that DaveC mentioned are a similar stiffness, and one lucky little boy I know (who's just tried his pair out) says they ski well too - if you don't mind the shovel flapping about on the groomed stuff. Sadly, the exchange rate is not your friend at the moment.
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Still got 2 pairs of 179 High Society FRs left (new 08 season stock)
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The Scott Crusades and Neos will do what you want. Awesome on the groomed stuff: fast amazing edge hold and very good edge to edge. The stiffness and the wide nose devours crud. The neo is a semi twin its the narrower of the two the crusade is wider cant remember if its a twin. They are both stiff skis. I own the neo and it is good in powder too I imagine the crusade would be even better. They do ski short on piste, im 5'11'' 85kg ski 176 neo its perfect for me. I tried the 168cm it was too short.
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What about next years Monster replacements in the fatter sizes...not fully TT but should cover all you bases, or somethign from movement.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Have a look at the Black Crow range eg Navis. I prefer the Nordica Enforcers myself though. A true do anything ski.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Mosha Marc wrote: |
Pity you weren't about last week, there were some good deals on High Society skis about.
Those Lhasa Pows that DaveC mentioned are a similar stiffness, and one lucky little boy I know (who's just tried his pair out) says they ski well too - if you don't mind the shovel flapping about on the groomed stuff. Sadly, the exchange rate is not your friend at the moment. |
I'd forgotten about the groomer tip flap, I keep skiing them with headphones in and can't hear the slapping. Really odd how you don't feel it!
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| DaveC wrote: |
| Mosha Marc wrote: |
Pity you weren't about last week, there were some good deals on High Society skis about.
Those Lhasa Pows that DaveC mentioned are a similar stiffness, and one lucky little boy I know (who's just tried his pair out) says they ski well too - if you don't mind the shovel flapping about on the groomed stuff. Sadly, the exchange rate is not your friend at the moment. |
I'd forgotten about the groomer tip flap, I keep skiing them with headphones in and can't hear the slapping. Really odd how you don't feel it! |
I never heard a noise from the tips (maybe I wasn't going fast enough) but it was a bit strange at first seeing them flap around. Amazingly there's no feel of this at all & they feel super secure underfoot, mind you the mid section of the ski is very stiff. Also amazing is how the rocker just rides over anything in it's path.
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You know it makes sense.
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| kiwi1 wrote: |
| Still got 2 pairs of 179 High Society FRs left (new 08 season stock) |
And I've got I pair of brand new 07/08 187cm HSFR's left 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thanks for all your replies guys - it's so great to be helped out by such knowledgeable people.
The Lhasa Pow's look really nice, but unless I'm missing something, I can't find them for sale in many places (even in the US), and they are significantly more expensive than some of the other offerings?
As a one ski quiver, I'm currently leaning towards the Line Prophet 100s, but will quite readily admit to not knowing enough that I am still easily swayed by many of the others suggested! The High Society FRs look cool, and the K2 Obsethed and Rossi S6/S7 still intrigue me too much to discount them completely!
OK, for the hard choices, I'm 6'1", and weigh (at the moment), about 12.5 stone (80kgs/175lbs) (however, this varies depending on how much I'm eating and weight training, so can be anywhere between 170 and 180).
Given this, what size ski should I be looking for, and what bindings would you recommend?
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Poster: A snowHead
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| FatalSaviour wrote: |
Thanks for all your replies guys - it's so great to be helped out by such knowledgeable people.
The Lhasa Pow's look really nice, but unless I'm missing something, I can't find them for sale in many places (even in the US), and they are significantly more expensive than some of the other offerings?
As a one ski quiver, I'm currently leaning towards the Line Prophet 100s, but will quite readily admit to not knowing enough that I am still easily swayed by many of the others suggested! The High Society FRs look cool, and the K2 Obsethed and Rossi S6/S7 still intrigue me too much to discount them completely!
OK, for the hard choices, I'm 6'1", and weigh (at the moment), about 12.5 stone (80kgs/175lbs) (however, this varies depending on how much I'm eating and weight training, so can be anywhere between 170 and 180).
Given this, what size ski should I be looking for, and what bindings would you recommend? |
185ish imo.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'll sell you my 186 Line Prophet 90s if you're interested? May as well save money to add more skis to the quiver or whatever  I prefered them to the 100s as an all mountain ski as they cope with nastier conditions better and rail groomers. Won't give you a sales pitch but there're plenty of reviews around - I've decided to go balls out for my CSIA3 next season, which means skiing the same slalom ski in all conditions.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Oh, and the Lhasa's are available from pmgear.com, and are very expensive. No getting around that. I personally think they're worth the cost if you can afford it. I don't think S6's (quite jibby, centred mount, not great all mtn) or S7s (way too specific for a non-seasonaire) are a great idea. Prophets are more stable and better for a stronger skier, Obsethed are a bit floppy and more pow orientated but will be surfier, and from the little I've read, HS FRs sound good too.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| DaveC wrote: |
| I'll sell you my 186 Line Prophet 90s if you're interested? May as well save money to add more skis to the quiver or whatever I prefered them to the 100s as an all mountain ski as they cope with nastier conditions better and rail groomers. Won't give you a sales pitch but there're plenty of reviews around - I've decided to go balls out for my CSIA3 next season, which means skiing the same slalom ski in all conditions. |
Hi Dave,
Thanks very much for the offer - I'd certainly be interested, but could I just check firstly where you're based (a quick google would suggest Canada?). If so, how much do you think shipping would be to Georgia? Obviously I'd want to give you a fair price, but I'm not sure how much of this might be wiped out by freight etc!
Best Regards
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Georgia, USA? $40 with insurance and tracking - I shipped some skis to Utah a couple of weeks ago 
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Hi Dave,
Thanks your quick replies. I've found the High Society FRs in a 187 for $351.97 new (http://www.backcountryoutlet.com/outlet/HSC0001/High-Society-FR-Twin-Tip-Ski.html) - is this a good price?
First off, how much would you be willing to part with your LP90s?
Thirdly, (this is geared more towards everyone), would the HS FRs be suitable as a 1 ski quiver (given the European propensity for hard groomers and the odd day of powder)? Also, I know that it's billed as a semi twin-tip. Given that I probably won't be venturing into the park too much, but that I have taken to skiing at least up to every blue groomer switch these days, would these suffice?
And lastly, what binding would you guys recommend on either of these skis?
Sorry for all the questions guys!
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I think that's probably a good price, yeah. My Prophets are in good shape, few topsheet dings but bases are in great shape - no core shots or edge damage at all. They're mounted with Look P14s at 335mm, and will adjust to 320-340mm~. $400 with bindings feels like a reasonable price - the bindings go for $150 on TGR used. $440 shipped?
re: bindings -they're pretty universal - if you don't have a personal preference, pretty much any will do. Personally, I'm a big fan of the Look/Rossi P14/FKS/P18 series that're discontinued - all metal, pretty light, smooth release but lots of elasticity in the heel so they give you a chance to recover. I also like Salomon STH916s and plain 916s, but these're probably a bit OTT for you. Only bindings I'd warn you off are Salomon STH/Z12 (same thing - not very durable, toes apparently explode) and Marker "biometric toe" bindings - they lean towards releasing as soon as possible rather than when required. Jesters/Griffons don't have bio toes, fwiw.
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Line Prophets are a really nice ski. I've got the 100s for powder and they certainly do the business in the soft stuff. Rock stable at speed, loads of float and surprisingly light and nimble for a big ski. But I'd agree with DaveC about the 90s being a better choice for groomers. I revert to my Head iM82s when there's no fresh snow around. Luckily today was a fresh powder day and the Prophets were in their element
I'm 6'1" 86ish kg and went for the 186 cm. Remember they're a proper twin tip and ski a bit shorter, more like 183 cm. I've got Marker Griffon bindings on them, which have been fine and keep the weight and cost down. They look a bit plasticky, but they seem tough enough.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Hmmm...decisions decisions...
I only noticed after I posted the link for the HS FRs that they're the 07/08...I'm not sure whether this matters at all (apart from cosmetically - apparently the 07/08s don't carry the girlfriend rating  ). They do stock the 08/09s for $450 though, so if these are indeed a good ski, I'm still more than happy to stump up the money for them.
As for the Line Prophets - my current SM10 boots are 315mm...so I'm not sure your skis with the bindings would be suitable Dave? (That's more of a question than a statement!).
Sooooo I'm trying to find a pair of Line Prophet 90s or 100s, in my size, but a friend is also pushing me to get the Rossi S5s still. I must confess that I did really like them when I tried them in resort, but then, it's been my first pair of twin tips, so it may be just that.
Still at the price that backcountryoutlet is charging ($384.97 (down from the RRP of $1,000.00)) I must say it's tempting  !
I also noticed pairs of Scott Punisher TTs there for $255. Now I know they're probably not so good at powder and this is moving the goalposts somewhat, but I'm tempted to just get these for now and hold out for next season? Not just wanting to waste money though, would the 191cm length be too long, and be, well...a waste of money?
http://www.backcountryoutlet.com/outlet/SCO0074/Scott-Punisher-Alpine-Ski.html
Please feel free to criticise my ideas as much as you like. I'm here to get as many different points of view as possible, and will confess to knowing very little in comparison to you seasoned folk (despite learning more every day)!
So to summarise my ramblings:
1. Are the HSFR's for $450 a good buy? Or if they haven't changed at all, would you recommend saving $100 and buying last seasons?
2. Is there anywhere that you know (either in the UK or the US - as I can buy from either) that stocks the LP90s?
3. I'm sorry to be so annoying with so many questions!
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Fri 3-04-09 19:18; edited 1 time in total
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FatalSaviour, I'd go for the older HSFR's. They are the same ski, but look better.
There again, I've never skiied the other ones you're looking at.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Mosha Marc wrote: |
FatalSaviour, I'd go for the older HSFR's. They are the same ski, but look better.
There again, I've never skiied the other ones you're looking at. |
Aesthetic comments are welcome of course too though. Personally, I'm split between which season's look nicer, so I'm being bullied by the girlfriend. Then again, although she doesn't own any skis right now, I know that when the time does come, the choice will be based on which ski has the most flowers on it...
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Fri 3-04-09 23:23; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I had noticed you still have a pair offered on your site Jon, and thought I might e-mail you before taking the plunge!
I'm a bit confused by backcountryoutlet.com's 'Unconditional 100% Guarantee'. (We guarantee complete satisfaction and an unlimited lifetime warranty. If at any time -- now, next month, in 30 years -- you're not 100% satisfied, send your gear back for a full refund. No questions asked.)
I queried this today asking if the ski delammed completely for instance, would it be covered, to which they stated it would. Obviously, I wouldn't expect anything like this from yourself or any other retailer, but it is something I need to consider (as shipping them to and from to the US is free for me fortunately).
What would be really helpful if you wouldn't mind is letting me know how much the skis would be as a complete package, with the bindings (+brakes) included, if you wouldn't mind giving me a quote for that please?
Best Regards
Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much  on Fri 3-04-09 21:48; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
The 07/08 & the 08/09 FR's are the same ski, just different graphics. 07/08 FR = cool understated very durable matt finish with black bases. |
Wasn't it you that had the misfortune of having one of these delammed in a Courcheval lift queue first day out?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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FatalSaviour, yep, that was me. Not a delam but a split/chunk out when some little french $hit hooned in to the back of me in the queue  I don't have much luck when on maiden trips on FR's as at last year's EoSB I took kiwi1's brand new demo 187's out on a guided day & ripped a large chunk out of the base out on a rock.
I'll PM you a price including bindings.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
at last year's EoSB I took kiwi1's brand new demo 187's out on a guided day & ripped a large chunk out of the base out on a rock.
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spyderjon, I seem to remember you passed them on to casino to use then and it was he who had to return them to kiwi1 in said condition  . He must have liked them though as he bought a pair last week.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| spyderjon wrote: |
FatalSaviour,
I have the last pair of brand new 07/08 187cm FR's in the country going for only £250 if you want to support the hard struck UK economy instead of spending your cash in the US! I can also do you a package price with them mounted with all metal Vist Free bindings in either 4-12 or 8-16DIN.
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I prefer the idea of supporting the hard struck UK ski instructor making $10/hr
My Prophets will definitely fit your boots without a re-mount - my buddy's BSL is 315mm and he adjusted them to his boots without a problem.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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OK, Now that I think that I've focussed my decision on either the 07/08 HSFRs, or the 08/09LP90s, I'm looking at bindings, which may or may not be necessary, depending on where I buy from and whether they're second-hand
I saw the Rossignol SAS2 Ti 140's for $168 and the SAS2 150s for $150, which I was tempted by... assuming I can bend the 100m brakes to just over the 104mm waist of the HSFRs for instance?
I wasn't sure how these would stack up to something like the Vist Free's though? I know the latter is all metal, and perhaps more durable, but as I really can't find the costings for the Vists for whatever reason, I don't know whether the $168 for the SAS 140 Ti or $150 for the SAS 150 bindings is a good deal?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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FatalSaviour, go on to the forum at www.tetongravity.com. Put any of the bindings you are interested in into their search engine ..a lot of very clued up guys on there..you should get as much info as you need to make a decision
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My husband's just bought the Rossingol S6s but haven't had them on the snow yet (bought them when we got back from Canada). He's also just bought a set of Rossignol Phantom SC80's. The SC80's aren't a twin tip but are up enough at the back that you can do 360's and ski backwards. The SC80's are super fast and great on crud, ice and in fresh powder. He hasn't tried them in really deep powder, maybe a 20cm dump overnight, but them were great.
I actually bought the ladies version, the Rossignol VooDoo SC80's and they are awesome as well. I was suprised at how well they coped with changing conditions and all on one run.
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FAQ
. You need to get that sorted straight away 
