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Helmets facts and fiction or Myths? (Now including Ski Club 'facts')

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
achilles,
Quote:

Dr Langran is a teensy bit more qualified than you to say how effective helmets are.


So why does he wear one himself. He talks only of how effective they are in high-speed collisions generally making the point that heads rarely make a direct impact on objects in such situations. On the occasions heads and other objects do collide, they are effective.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
achilles, perhaps you should widen you review of research to include more than one physician's opinion.

Have a look at this article which sites several other studies. the first half is about helmet standards but if you scroll down you will find some interesting debate about 2 Myths that have been discussed in this thread

http://www.telemarktips.com/Helmets.html
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
anyone want to talk about global warming?

or the miners' strike?

Madeye-Smiley


Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Wed 25-03-09 15:00; edited 1 time in total
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 You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
Two studies finding that Helmet wearing DOES NOT lead to riskier behavior...

Yet in a landmark ski helmet study published in 2004, Brent Hagel, an assistant professor of epidemiology at the University of Calgary, found that helmet use did not lead to riskier behavior or increase the risk of severe injury while skiing and snowboarding. In fact, Hagel discovered that wearing a helmet out on the slopes may reduce the risk of head injury by as much as 29 to 56%. Hagel's study didn't include those who fell and hit their heads but did not sustain an injury because they were wearing a helmet. Including those individuals would have increased the documented protective effect of helmets even more.

Further, in 2005, Dr. Michael Scott of the California State University at Chico, along with several others, published a report entitled "Testing the Risk Compensation Hypothesis for Safety Helmets in Alpine Skiing and Snowboarding. Dr. Scott and his group recorded face-to-face interviews with 1,779 adult skiers and snowboarders at 31 ski areas in Western North America during January-March 2003. Respondents were asked two questions assessing risk compensation: do they (a) ski/snowboard faster, slower or about the same speed, and (b) challenge themselves more, less or about the same. Helmet wearers compared current behavior to when they did not wear a helmet; non-wearers, to previous seasons. The result: helmet use was significantly associated with less risky skiing/snowboarding, and the study's authors concluded that increasing helmet use does not appear to motivate more risk taking. Helmet wearers were said to engage in "less risk behavior than non-wearers, suggesting that decisions to adopt helmets are motivated by safety concerns."
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
beequin, Dr Langran has said quite clearly that he thinks helmets give some protection against minor injury - the most obvious being cuts and abrasions, I guess. Considering the mess a head cut makes, you could say that is a good enough reason for him.

skimottaret, my preference is to take the view of and active physician who practices in a ski resort, and who has obviously done considerable research. If your belief system prefers to take the reaction of an industry which needed to be seen to be Doing Something, that's up to you.

I think we are treading well-worn tracks here. I shall leave this discussion - until the next helmet thread. rolling eyes
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 You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
achilles wrote:
skimottaret, my preference is to take the view of and active physician who practices in a ski resort, and who has obviously done considerable research.

Is he the only independent researcher who looks at this from a medical point of view?
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
achilles, My belief system is to look at as many sources of information as i can and try to make an informed choice...

did you actually look at the research done by the University professors i sited? I guess one GP in Aviemore is the only person's views worth considering rolling eyes

Rob@rar of course any researcher that publishes a contrary view to what you believe in must in the pocket of big corporates wink Easy to trot that arguement out isnt it
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
skimottaret,
Quote:

any researcher that publishes a contrary view to what you believe in must in the pocket of big corporates

so, helmets cause global warming, I knew there must be something...........Twisted Evil
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Interesting stuff.

Maybe we should have some references.

Dr Mike Langran is the UK Secretary of the ISSS: International Society for Skiing Safety.
The ISSS have international congresses every other year.
The last one was in 2007 in Aviemore, organised by Mike Langran.
Proceedings of that meeting here.
Well worth reading.
The next meeting is in Garmisch-Partenkirchen April 26 - May 2, 2009.

Mike Langran runs ski-injury.com
His take on the helmet debate is here.

Also worth reading is the National Ski Areas Association site.
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 Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Jonpim, the nsaa link makes sense. I think that experience leads to less risky behaviour through increased awareness of danger and more honed tecniques to avoid it. When I'm riding downhill on rocky, rooty singletrack trying to stay attached to my mountain bike, I do everything I can to avoid colliding with a tree or going over the handlebars. After some major wipeouts early on, the fear of pain became the biggest incentive to stay on the bike and on the path. The fact that I am wearing a flimsy polystyrene cycle helmet has never in fact averted the pain of a crash but I am much less likely to crash now than when I started out. Also, on the mountain bike, the least likely appendage to get hurt was the one on the end of my neck.

For skiing and boarding, wearing a helmet obviously does nothing to prevent ACL injuries or broken wrists, two of the commonest injuries amongst new spowsporters. Have these types of injuries increased amongst a new generation of cocksure skiers and boarders now that they have that protective CE marked force field extending from their heads downwards ? Probably not. Do a few percent of that same new generation inadvertently take more risks earlier in their snow sport learning curve because the new generation of kit they use allows them to go faster sooner ? Probably.

One observation though is that there seems to be a general obsession with speed amongst people in their first say 6 weeks of skiing and boarding as if that were the ultimate goal rather than the joy of control. These are also the same few percent of people who will likely get the biggest thrill hooning down a motorway piste without acknowledging that they're not fully in control.
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Serious head injuries represent 1.8% of all accidents
You are most likely to get injured in February in France
You have a 0.25% risk of getting injured on any day you ski
You have a 0.0001% chance of having a life threatening injury when skiing on any one day
Children have a far greater risk of head injury compared to adults
Collisions between piste users are increasing

===

The ski club is probably right to suggest kids always wear a helmet.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Here's today 's helmet wearing troll Laughing

Some 'Safety facts' from the SCGB website
original here

The number of ski injuries has actually been decreasing since the late 1970’s.

The chance of needing hospital treatment following a Snowsports holiday is between 2 – 3%, which is a much lower figure than other sporting holidays.

25% of accidents are due to collision, either with another person or with a static object such as a tree or safety gates.

Wearing a helmet reduces incidence of less serious head injuries by between 30 – 50%. And reduces severity of all head injuries in 50% of cases.

Helmets are more likely to be worn by expert skiers (45% of those who wear helmets) than by entry-level skiers (19%).

On average 33.2% of the recreational skiers and snowboarders wear helmets whilst riding. The highest percentage of those who wear helmets are children under 9years and adults over 65years.

Skilled off piste/backcountry professionals have a surprisingly low fatality rate compared to recreational skiers who venture off piste. Less than 1% of avalanche fatalities and serious injuries involve professionals.

The club gives no source for any of the above claims.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Boredsurfing, That last 'fact' is very interesting.....and offers a whole new slant on other debates wink Twisted Evil
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Guvnor, I'm researching tomorrows helmet troll at the mo Toofy Grin wink
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I wish everyone would stop going on and on and on and on about helmets.

It's doing my head in.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
ccl, pure, unalloyed GOLD! Laughing Laughing Laughing
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
http://www.bclocalnews.com/greater_vancouver/northshoreoutlook/opinion/41853612.html

Liberal MP Hedy Fry that would stiffen regulations for snow-sport helmets. As it now stands, he explains snow helmets offer little protection to skiers and snowboarders.

“A report by Ski Canada tells us that some ski and snowboard helmets for sale in Canada offer no more protection than putting a bag of milk over your head,” Kinar said in a press released issued by Fry, a doctor, in February.


No wonder these Canadians can't get their helmet designs right when they put milk in bags. Would that be gold top milk in a paper bag then ? Toofy Grin
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Quote:

Less than 1% of avalanche fatalities and serious injuries involve professionals


Really? Every guide I've skkied with has always said the guide is much more likely to be buried than his clients...
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