 Poster: A snowHead
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We're just back from a week skiing with the kids. They had both had a go last year and had four snowcubs sessions at MK before we went. I am amazed at how far they progressed in a week. 3 year old was happy snowplough turning at high speed down green and blues. 5 year old was skiing down in a racing tuck most of the time cos he'd seen it on Ski Sunday  He was bringing his ski's parallel after his turn to traverse across the slope. Neither of them went to ski school but we did have hubby's cousin with us who is an ex ski instructor.
We won't be going to the Alps until next March but planning ahead what do we do with them next. They are both adament they don't want to go to ski school (may have changed their minds by next year). Will they be old enough to get much out of ski school or better off skiing with us again and having fun? (They won't be seperated so have to go with the younger ones needs) When we were at snocubs the instructor said they would be ready for Snobears when they got back. Looking at the website it says its for kids who can snowplough in a straight line - they are both beyond this and I don't want to waste my money.
Any tips on the next step would be greatly appreciated.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Get them to go to ski school. The school will put them in the correct group, you get to have a decent ski and they'll come on even more.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Skimummy, tricky. I'm a big fan of good ski schools for kids, but a 4 year old might find it tedious. It depends on the school and the kid; if s/he enjoys arsing around with other kids, fine, but if s/he is not yet that socialised, s/he might not enjoy it. Probably the only thing to do is try it (or invite your old man's cousin again). The 6 yo should be fine in ski school, I'd have thought. The school should find the right group for him/her. You'll probably find that by next year being seperated is no longer an issue (if it is, it might be an opportunity to address it).
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
| What next for 3 & 5 year olds? |
4 and 6 maybe? 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Skimummy, definitely ski school, good for both their skiing (it should be all about having fun, playing games etc, the skiing will just come and they will improve rapidly), and their social development. i'd have thought they'd have much more fun with children their own age than with their parents!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I am in the same position as Skimummy. My eldest son is 6 and started skiing in Jan. In total he has skied for 12 days this year with 7 days of instruction and after our last trip to Hemsedal he skied the red runs with me in a safe and confident manner. He is keen to do jumps and other 'trick' stuff. I believe he needs to improve his basic technique as he does stick his bottom out a bit and lets his parallel turns degrade to a 'lazy' parallel turn or even a snow plough at times.
How do I persuade him that lessons will help? My son has a strong independent streak. At ski-camp the instructor told me that my son doesn't always appear to be listening.
My three year old has had three days on skis and was performing good snow plough turns on the greens and easy blues at Hemsedal. He has seen his brother and wants to be like him, rather too soon for my taste.
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Guys we are talking about 3, 5 and 6 year olds dictating to parents that they do not want to go to ski school. Sorry have I heard right? Since when did ones so young make the decisions? We know who calls the shots in these households!
Do some parents need lessons in how to influence young children? Come on guys they are 3, 5 and 6 and if you can't influence them to take ski lessons what hope do we have for the future generation? Get a grip.......
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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AndrewBailey, welcome to 
(Good) lessons for kids your sons age should be all about having fun, learning good technique will come pretty much by doing and copying -kids lessons are very different to any you may have had.
So I'd focus on how much fun he'd find it to join in with group lessons with other children his own age etc.
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Skimummy, AndrewBailey, My daughter started at three. We put her in ski school in the morning and then had the afternoon with us, best of both worlds. They learn to ski safely and properly and they get rewarded with the afternoons en famile. My daughter, now 8, still goes to ski school in the morning, she'd prefer to be with us all day but I don't think we're good enough skiiers to teach her well. She knows that and is pleased when she gets her badges at the end of the week.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Ski School.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Ski school - all day with lunch at the school included.
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I also had no choice about going to ski school, went from the age of about 3 till 13 / 14. It was just what we did on ski holidays!
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You know it makes sense.
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My 9 and 6 year old were in their 3rd (?) year of ski school. The instructors should make it fun, they were doing little jumps with my kids, the oldest went 'off piste' and skied over the roof of a chalet last year which she loved.
My answer to "we don't want to go in ski school", is that unless you do, you ain't skiing with Mum and Dad in the afternoon!
Cheers,
Greg
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Boredsurfing, That's what we did for the 1st two years and ours started at 5+7 2hrs skiing in morning and afternoon and play the rest of the time. We must have been horrible parents. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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gsb, and now they ski better than their parents 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Oh, I can make my eldest son have lessons alright. Not the same as getting benefit from them though....
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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AndrewBailey, bribe him!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Boredsurfing, They have been doing that for years after much instruction. No money left to spend on mine and OH skiing.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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As per other posts, Ski School
It's all about the quality of the school that makes it fun , or not.
I was fortunate this year to have 2 ski weeks. Both with a 6 and 9 year old. In Switzerland both were bored, in Val Thorens with ProsNeige, the feedback was really positive. Both have improved markedly in the Val Thorens week.
As kittenski says.
| Quote: |
| My answer to "we don't want to go in ski school", is that unless you do, you ain't skiing with Mum and Dad in the afternoon! |
I'm surprised that any parent would consider allowing children of that age to choose. If they dont like it, they can stay at home!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
My answer to "we don't want to go in ski school", is that unless you do, you ain't skiing with Mum and Dad in the afternoon!
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Absolutely !! Exactly what we did with our two. Youngest was not keen on it, but as we learnt to ski at the same time as they did, skiing with us was not an option for the first couple of years, as we didn't feel safe enough to be in charge of two kids on the pistes. On our third holiday, we arranged morning ski school, picked them up for lunch and skied in the afternoon. That became the pattern for our ski holidays until they were about 12, and we started to take more holidays.
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BMF_Skier,
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in Val Thorens with ProsNeige, the feedback was really positive. Both have improved markedly in the Val Thorens week.
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The excellence of Prosneige with children was one reason we went to Val Thorens in 3 consecutive years at the time, 5/8 years ago we couldn't praise the team there highly enough. I'm glad to hear that their excellent tuition has remained so. 
Details here http://www.prosneige.fr/en/ski-school/ski-child-group-lesson.php
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What next for 3 & 5 year olds?
Compulsory sex lessons from a fat lesbian with a chip on her shoulder and a homosexualist agenda, apparently.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Latchigo, you lookin' for a job?
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Put them in ski-school - they learn correct technique and it's much safer. First skiing trip for our 3 this year (7, 8 and 10) and they went with ESF every morning and we skiied together in the afternoon as a family. They enjoyed their lessons and wanted to show off what they learnt - occasionally they didn't want to go (a bit of tiredness creeping in) but with suitable encouragement they were fine.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I've spent the last season teaching kids of different levels, so it's really interesting to see parents point of views!
Here's the big thing for me - my lessons prioritise safety, fun, then improvement - for the whole group. The plan is to try and combine the three as best as possible. The bigger the group, the more I have to focus on safety. So from that, if you want the best progress for your kids, ideally you want them in smaller groups.
A big problem I have, and it's often from British parents, is parents expect the earth from both their kid, and the lesson (not a slight, just that Brits are usually their week's holiday and understandably want to get the most out of it as they can). There's only so much you can push a 3-4 year old, from simple physical development to attention span. This still applies to lesser degrees the older they get. Challenging them with terrain but keeping them safe is nerve-wracking, getting a 4 year old to do drills for the sake of skiing better is nigh on impossible so it generally comes down to letting them mirror you, and being inventive with games that a) address their skill deficiency and b) engage them enough for them to actually do it...
It's a bit odd to hear kids that young "don't want" to be in ski school - is that seperation anxiety or they're not enjoying it? I'd suggest if they're not enjoying it, you need to look for a new ski school.
The big big thing about putting your kids in ski school is not to expect miracles. They're kids. The mountain is twice as big to someone half your size. You're trying to help them build a lifelong love for skiing, not make them WC racers. If you want to get your kids to get to be really good skiers, then following the lead of my favourite family all year's lead is a great idea. They'd spend days skiing with their kids, to the extent that when their 2 year old got to ski school age, within 3 weeks he was ripping down (equiv.) Euro blues. I put that all down to the family spending time with him having fun, rather than my teaching. I taught their 4 year old daughter all year, and by the end she tore down Fernie blues like Bear, which IMO is comparable or harder to a lot of Euro blacks. I loved teaching that family's kids, and their older two were stars for friends of mine in ski school too. On the flip side, I had an absolutely unbearable (English) family follow one of my 3 day camp groups around demanding that their daughter be moved up, because 2 of the kids in the class were holding her up. The parents were so overbearing and rude it was ridiculous, and their kids looked uncomfortable. Ugh.
| AndrewBailey wrote: |
| He is keen to do jumps and other 'trick' stuff. I believe he needs to improve his basic technique as he does stick his bottom out a bit and lets his parallel turns degrade to a 'lazy' parallel turn or even a snow plough at times. |
This will pretty much "iron out" over time - I tend to combine kids desires to do "big jumps" (it's rare they actually leave the ground, but they love it!) with teaching stance - jumps and similar can easily be used to promote fore/aft balance, etc.
Skimummy - As for 4 and 6 year olds skiing together - the difference between 3 and 4 is immense, nevermind 4 to 6. Their development is ridiculous, and there's such a void that I personally wouldn't fancy teaching them together if it was a larger group lesson.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Our two learnt at the same age (they are now 11 and 14) and we put them into ski school in the morning and they skiied with us in the afternoons, worked like a dream for us, but then there wasn't any other option, they wanted to ski and we told them that's how it would be. Ours also have the same age gap as yours and we left it to the ski school to put them in the appropriate levels. They weren't in the same classes for years as the difference is immense at a younger age(DaveC's comments are spot on). They then moved on to private lessons together and eight years on we still get instruction for them whenever we can. But more than anything we've only ever presented skiing as a fun thing to do with family and friends. Our kids skiied with over 60 different people this year ranging in age from 5 to 55 and enjoyed every run. Put them into a good ski school it will be worth it.
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DaveC, There is actually only 14 months between them. They will be in the same class at school from September. Although the older one certainly had more stamina this year, the younger one was more willing to listen and follow instructions. They are very close and often get mistaken for twins. Personally I don't think teaching them together would be a problem but then I'm not the teacher!
They are slowly coming round to the idea of ski school. It's not a case of them dictating to me - more a case of me not wanting them to be put off skiing by being forced to do something they are unhappy with. The older one in particular does struggle with seperation anxiety. I had to shove him through the door at MK!
They spent this year happily skiing most of the day with us. It obviously compromised our skiing but we all enjoyed it. At the end of the day it is our 'family' holiday and we spent it as a family. I do want them to go to ski school though - maybe they can then teach me a thing or two
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You know it makes sense.
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Yeah, 14 months is a bit different to 24 months and kids definitely develop at different rates - to be fair, I don't usually ask their ages when I meet kids for the first time, usually better to talk to them and see what they're like since I've had 5 year olds totally outshine 8+ sometimes in maturity!
It's tough trying to find time to ski with your kids as well as enjoy yourself, didn't mean to put such a hard line on it - the example I gave was a family out all season on a career break so it's very different for them, but it was amazing to see how much those kids progressed with instruction as well as family help. Nothing wrong with putting kids in ski school for the week, but the main thing I'd reinforce for parents is to just make sure they're having fun 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Would it help if I got the minimum's to post something about how much fun they had at Ski school this year? They are 9 and 6 respectively.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Megamum, Would be good to read a childs view of it all. I didn't learn to ski until I was 13 and on school trip with all my friends. And the instructor was English. Very different to being 4 with strangers that possibly speak a different language.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Skimummy, our grand-daughter joined ESF as a complete beginner in Les Gets this Christmas for about 12 days - knew no-one but loved it - the instructor, and her assistant were both French, and as our grand-daughter said 'four of the other children spoke English - but I was the only one who spoke American'. She has been at daycare and now nursery school in the States for what seems like years and just took going into ski school in her stride.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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DaveC, Excellent advice. My 6 year old son spent a week at 'ski camp' virtually on his own even staying in a different hotel. He hated it as the other boys made fun of him. Given that this ski camp was in his second language and the other kids were not bi-lingual I put this down to jealousy on their part especially as my son was moved up to the top skill group and they were not.
As for the leaving the ground part watch this.... Fortunately when it came to proper ramped jumps he doesn't maintain enough momentum to go very high...
http://uk.video.yahoo.com/watch/4957527/13198415
Your point about showing rather than telling rings true. My youngest was not keen to turns until I stayed in front and made 'railway' tracks for him to follow. I wasted ages trying to tell him what to do, once we relaxed and had fun as a family it all came together.
Skimummy, It is the same for me. I can dictate but why put them off something useful for no reason other than parental control? I will work on them gently over the year.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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AndrewBailey, 6 does sound very young to be staying in a different hotel! Though the daytime activities sound good.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Skimummy, pick a resort with a ski school with a good reputation with kids and ask for (demand!) a class with lots of kids of similar age. Then, leave it to the instructors - they know how to entertain and teach these difficult customers!
My kids took lessons annually from about 3 or 4 and stuck with them till about 11 or 12. My daughter won a couple of minor national competitions so it definitely pays off!
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My son (who is 6) went to ESF in Les Gets in '08 and '09,and had it has been fantastic. He has loved every minute. We skied for 2 weeks this year and he has progressed amazingly well. He also loves the fact that he gets a badge at the end as they do a mini test. I would strongly advice a ski school as they will teach them the right technique. We will definitely be putting our 3 year daughter in next year.
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SnowSnow, welcome to s!
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