 Poster: A snowHead
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I had a day on these skis -178s incidentally- at Tignes in October and was trying them against the Head Monsters. I ws a bit biased towards the Heads as I have skidded about on C140s, which were the first pair of skis I owned and have served me very well. I did, however want to upgrade in the hope that I could get a bit more adventurous in soft snow and also improve my carving technique.
After a day on each of the Monsters and the Missions, I came down on the side of the Missions. They seemed a little more agile on piste and felt very secure in soft snow. I started skiing at the Tamworth Snowdome (age 47) on more or less pure ice, so I am fine with that. It is snow I worry about! A week of lessons and off-piste powder at Saalbach Easter 08 had done a lot for my confidence, but I was a little worried about the length and weight of the Missions. 178 seems a big ski, but they "ski short" I am told.
Well, I went for it and they duly arrived on my birthday (59th!) so off son Jon (19) and I went to MK to try them out. His first retort, having not skied for 10 months was "Bloody Hell. I can't ski and he can!" (A total reversal you understand!)
What I had not allowed for was the difference the bindings made. The ones I had worried about the weight of at Tignes had hire bindings and my own had light and effective S12s.
Since then, I have had three days on them at La Plagne and six in the Dolomites. I have so much confidence in them and even my most severe critic (you all know her!) says my skiing has improved. Comparing the bases of my old skis and the Missions, I can see that all the scratches on the Missions are front-to-back. On the Heads there are many diagonal scratches which prove how much I used to skid out of turns. I love to get the Missions on to their edges and feel like I can carve for the first time.
The point of all this is to encourage the older and even portlier skier to try what I thought of as a demanding ski. Even at my advanced age and excessive weight, I can feel the benefits and take much less out of myself in a day's skiing. The other point is the difference made by the bindings. You can't always get the true feel of a ski from a binding with a long and heavy adjustable rack on it. I guess it might also affect the way you can bend a ski. You certainly feel the difference if you work The Missions hard. They feed back to you and are as agile as any ski on piste. In softer snow, they are rock-steady and iron out uneven snow. The Mission is a great all-round ski.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Chris Bish, I love mine too , in a 183 - I'm 6'1", 90Kg, and in my early 40's ! I have skied a few different skis recently, including the Pure and the Crusade, Black Crow Navis, Apache Recons, Monster IM88s, Mantras... my favorite "everyday" skis are the missions and the Mantras
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I've some scott punishers, twin tip version of mission. Being under 40 (for most of this season at least) I still qualify for twins 
I'm not quite having the same loving relationship with the scotts as you guys.
Refer you to a thread I started.
http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=49954
Don't get me wrong great all round ski, but just not quite out-performing a trashed, old, very used pair of pocket rockets that I got as ex-rental for 125€ some years ago.
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waynos,
Lighter skiers (such as meself) tend to like pocket rockets - very easy in the powder but not stable at speed for heavier skiers. Are you light? You might like the Head mojo 94.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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DB, 85 - 90kg, so on the heavier end. For sure they are a little exciting (unstable) at higher speeds but managable. I think the pockets better suit the terrain i ski most at the moment, ski amade based, so off piste tends to be tree lined, not large open powder fields.
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| Quote: |
I love mine too , in a 183 - I'm 6'1", 90Kg, and in my early 40's
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I'm a similar size to you - what length Missions do you have?
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I ski 178s @ 86-88KG. They do ski a lot shorter. There is quite a bit of ski at the front and the back that doesn't come into contact when skiing on piste.
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So if I would use a 176 Rossi Bandit or Rossi Zenith, then they would feel even shorter than these in the 178 length? I would imagine they would feel like snow blades on piste but very controllable in the deep stuff - but the OP said they carve well.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The way the skis feel is greatly influenced by the binding position. There's a marked 7cm range for the bindings. If set forward, freestyle, then they will feel good for short turns on piste, shite in soft stuff, and good if you want switch and big air. Further back, more standard, then better off piste, less centered for air and switch. The scott site has a description somewhere of the different binding positions.
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I love mine too!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Paul-B, 183
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Patch, Doh! 
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I love mine as well, but at high speeds on hard packed and icy snow they don't hold an edge as well as something narrower underfoot. Also in very deep snow, they're a little too quick to turn.
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You know it makes sense.
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Kramer, yep..need something around 25 mtrs, IMV..........and waaaaaaayy too turney.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Kramer, yes I agree, I have the Rosas, the women's equivalent ski and I found mine to be the same on hard pack and icy snow compared to my narrower piste skis. Love them in all off piste snow though, deep or otherwise, I quite like the tight radius on them.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Kramer wrote: |
| I love mine as well, but at high speeds on hard packed and icy snow they don't hold an edge as well as something narrower underfoot. Also in very deep snow, they're a little too quick to turn. |
I'd love to know how a ski can turn too quick....surely a ski will go straight down the fall line unless the rider 'does' something.....
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| kitenski wrote: |
| Kramer wrote: |
| I love mine as well, but at high speeds on hard packed and icy snow they don't hold an edge as well as something narrower underfoot. Also in very deep snow, they're a little too quick to turn. |
I'd love to know how a ski can turn too quick....surely a ski will go straight down the fall line unless the rider 'does' something..... |
If a ski has a tight turn radius an average amount of pressure and an average amount of edge angle will produce a relatively tight turn shape. This might be a bit tighter than you want, the ski feels as if it's 'hooking' into the turn more than you want. So for me if I'm looking to do long radius turns in deep snow I find it difficult to 'back off' the ski so it doesn't take me around a relatively tight arc.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| kitenski wrote: |
| Kramer wrote: |
| I love mine as well, but at high speeds on hard packed and icy snow they don't hold an edge as well as something narrower underfoot. Also in very deep snow, they're a little too quick to turn. |
I'd love to know how a ski can turn too quick....surely a ski will go straight down the fall line unless the rider 'does' something..... |
If a ski has a tight turn radius an average amount of pressure and an average amount of edge angle will produce a relatively tight turn shape. This might be a bit tighter than you want, the ski feels as if it's 'hooking' into the turn more than you want. So for me if I'm looking to do long radius turns in deep snow I find it difficult to 'back off' the ski so it doesn't take me around a relatively tight arc. |
but surely less pressure, less edge = shallower turn?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| kitenski wrote: |
| but surely less pressure, less edge = shallower turn? |
Yes, absolutely. But that's not a straightforward skill in bottomless powder unless you're a fairly accomplished skier. I know I find tricky to change my turn shape at will when the fresh snow is deeper than my knees and I can't get down to a firmer base.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| kitenski wrote: |
| but surely less pressure, less edge = shallower turn? |
Yes, absolutely. But that's not a straightforward skill in bottomless powder unless you're a fairly accomplished skier. I know I find tricky to change my turn shape at will when the fresh snow is deeper than my knees and I can't get down to a firmer base. |
cheers Rob, so I think that is my point, some of us get very hung up on wether a ski does x, y or z, whereas I do believe tecnique has alot more to do with it than the hardware, and as you say deep snow tests us all and is a great fault finder...
regards,
Greg
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Jack of all trades, master of none?
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| Kramer, yes I agree, I have the Rosas, the women's equivalent ski and I found mine to be the same on hard pack and icy snow compared to my narrower piste skis. Love them in all off piste snow though, deep or otherwise, I quite like the tight radius on them. |
I slightly disagree insofar as where I've found my Rosas don't hold an edge on hardpack tend to be situations where nobody is holding edge, regardless of what type of ski they're on. Personally I also like the tight radius as it helps me feel more in control in powder because I still don't have the confidence to be comfortable with the acceleration longer turns can generate - or that may just be a factor of my (albeit reducing) ineptitude
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| kitenski wrote: |
| ... I do believe tecnique has alot more to do with it than the hardware ... |
Couldn't agree more.
All skis are compromises, it just depends on what you want to compromise the least 
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| eng_ch wrote: |
| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| Kramer, yes I agree, I have the Rosas, the women's equivalent ski and I found mine to be the same on hard pack and icy snow compared to my narrower piste skis. Love them in all off piste snow though, deep or otherwise, I quite like the tight radius on them. |
I slightly disagree insofar as where I've found my Rosas don't hold an edge on hardpack tend to be situations where nobody is holding edge, regardless of what type of ski they're on. Personally I also like the tight radius as it helps me feel more in control in powder because I still don't have the confidence to be comfortable with the acceleration longer turns can generate - or that may just be a factor of my (albeit reducing) ineptitude |
Yes I agree with you there-I hadn't really noticed a big difference between them and my piste skis previously (on a piste I mean, especially hard pack), only a little bit, until a recent week in January when the pistes were very very hard and scraped with no fresh snow for a couple of weeks or more, and my piste skis were easier to use on that admittedly for me, but at the same time you are right, everyone else was finding it a bit more hard going that week too regardless of what ski they had on, it was just tricky conditions full stop. I like the short radius in off piste/deep snow too because having only recently got to grips with deep snow without face planting all the time, at the moment I don't like to go too fast for my liking in the deep snow until my confidence improves some more. 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Kramer, Agreed - If I'm sure I'm going to be on piste all day, maybe Volkl Racetigers. For longer, faster turns off-piste, I find the Black Crows a lot of fun. Most days, it's about 50% on-piste, 50% off, and I find the the Missions or Mantras perfect for that.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Paul-B wrote: |
| Patch, Doh! |
Yours are shorter?
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Patch,
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Yours are shorter?
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No - I was just doh!'ing 'cos my question was already answered in the text I quoted from you  . I haven't got any skis but they look like the kind of thing I'd like, trouble is they won't go with my new red and white boots....
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You know it makes sense.
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Paul-B, If that's the sort of ski you're looking for, I'd recommend skiing them along with the Mantras and maybe a few others on the same day. My personal experience is that I don't end up buying the ski that I thought I would, after testing a few.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Kramer wrote: |
| I love mine as well, but at high speeds on hard packed and icy snow they don't hold an edge as well as something narrower underfoot. Also in very deep snow, they're a little too quick to turn. |
Isn't that because you keep changing the angles?
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Poster: A snowHead
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For a skier of my ability (almost zero) the main factor is confidence. Success comes from between the ears in most sports, and what I love about the Missions is the confidence they give me. Almost certainly, a better skier than me would find their limitations. And Frosty the Snowman's, point is valid too, but they certainly suit me right now and encourage me to go places I would not otherwise.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Another Missions fan.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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How would they be for a rather light skier? I'm 5'11" and 65kg (10st 2lb). I'm wondering about hiring some for venturing off-piste a little more. I would rate as 'Advanced On Piste' according the Ski Club of GB ratings (http://www.skiclub.co.uk/skiclub/skifreshtracks/myskistandard.aspx) but no more than Aspirer off piste - looking to improve on that.
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J2R, Something with less sidecut will be less hooky.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Patch wrote: |
| Paul-B, If that's the sort of ski you're looking for, I'd recommend skiing them along with the Mantras and maybe a few others on the same day. My personal experience is that I don't end up buying the ski that I thought I would, after testing a few. |
Spot on... I loved the Navis, hated the Mantras, but got totally blown away by the Nordica Enforcers. Everyone loads a ski with a different combination of factors... it can often be surprising what works for you.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
| J2R, Something with less sidecut will be less hooky. |
I'm not too bothered about 'hookiness', but I'm not sure about the stiffness of the ski, whether it might require more weight than mine to bend effectively.
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J2R, I'm 74 kg and didn't have any problems with most of the skis I tested. You can always wear a pack and carry water and avi gear 
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They're only a medium flex with a big sweet spot (a modern day B2). If you're an advanced piste skier you'll soon find the speed limit on anything shorter than the 178.
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FAQ
