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Skiing vs Snowboarding and riding with Skiiers

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
skidd1 wrote:

As for one group being more considerate than the other well ive seen good and bad from both. I dont see the big divide..


As above.

I think the temptation is to think...

I'm a skier.
If a skier cuts me up, stands in the wrong place, is rude etc, it's because he's a knob.
If a boarder cuts me up, sits in the wrong place, is rude etc, it's because he's a boarder
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Higs wrote:
skidd1 wrote:

As for one group being more considerate than the other well ive seen good and bad from both. I dont see the big divide..


As above.

I think the temptation is to think...

I'm a skier.
If a skier cuts me up, stands in the wrong place, is rude etc, it's because he's a knob.
If a boarder cuts me up, sits in the wrong place, is rude etc, it's because he's a boarder


Short and to the point. Eloquently put that man (?) well said. Cool
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
foxtrot_mike, You enjoy boarding so board! You dont have to choose what you do with your life to please others, if someone has a problem its a reflection on them not on you, as mentioned above if you were skiing theyd look for and find something else to moan about. I hate the whole skiers V's boarders bull****. The speed of the members in our mixed groups is generally not based on whether they board or ski but on the individual and their abilities. As you also have skied before for a number of years the choice is yours what you do any given day. Dont forget whichever you do enjoy it.

Nice one Higs you nailed the issue a knob is a knob based on how they ride not what they ride.
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Are pistes essentially traffic routes?

Do people move fast?

Do many take lessons to use them?

Is the perception of danger for some sufficient enough to regard it as essential to wear a helmet?

Do the resorts even ban individuals for recklessness on pistes?

How many would regard it as wise if walkers rested sitting down on town cycleways/routes?

Who would regard it as sensible if ramblers were found picnicing in the middle of bridleways?

n'est-ce pas?
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
gonwitdeewind wrote:
Are pistes essentially traffic routes?

Is the perception of danger for some sufficient enough to regard it as essential to wear a helmet?

Do the seagulls follow the trawlers?

How many would regard it as wise if walkers rested sitting down on town cycleways/routes?

Who would regard it as sensible if ramblers were found picnicing in the middle of bridleways?

n'est-ce pas?


Are you Eric Cantona in disguise?
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gonwitdeewind, seriously, give it up, your anti-boarder sentiments are a bit embarrasing. Don't get me wrong, as a skier I love indulging in a bit of banter towards my tray-wielding holiday companions, but you seem to have quite the grasp on over-exageration. 20 boarders sat down all the way across on a piste?! Please.

But to answer your questions:

Are pistes essentially traffic routes?
No. They are pistes. Ski runs. Some people go fast, some slow, some stop at some point. The overrding rule is that of safety, and that you avoid the people who are downhill of you as you go past them.

Do people move fast?
Some do, some don't. Its not a race.

Do many take lessons to use them?
yes....

Is the perception of danger for some sufficient enough to regard it as essential to wear a helmet?
Good God, not this argument again...

Do the resorts even ban individuals for recklessness on pistes?
Yes, and its generally for those going too fast and/or out of control, thus endangering others.

How many would regard it as wise if walkers rested sitting down on town cycleways/routes?
You seem to think this is the norm; it isn't, its obviously an exception. Its not the right thing to do of course, but lets not carried away here. And has been rightly pointed out before, I've seen plenty of times when groupd of skiers stand around blocking parts of the piste, so lets not pigeon-hole boarders as the sole sourse of blame.

Who would regard it as sensible if ramblers were found picnicing in the middle of bridleways?
And who would regard its as sensible if, should such a thing happen, other users of the bridleway chose to walk over the ramblers instead of just simply picking their way around them?

n'est-ce pas?
I think you need to learn to be a bit more tolerant of others around you in a ski resort. We'd all love to have our own mountain to play around on, but in the absense of that most of us have learnt to live and let live. Maybe you should do the same.


Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Mon 16-02-09 20:30; edited 1 time in total
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Higs, you're right. It's boardism. Dav, you're right too. Should we bother with him? Probably not. Twisted Evil
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
blihmie, a cense urve umore.

now about the rugby...
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 You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
gonwitdeewind, ah, now I get you. The skill in trolling lies with not going OTT too early. You blew it.
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I was with a full-time boarder and two part-time boarders and know others very well, and am interested myself - so, that probably counts me out as being hysterically ant-boarder.

The description of my experience is niether exaggerated, but principally based on safety plus courtesy. 20 abreast across a piste sounds extraordinary I agree but is a fact. We had to excuse our way past them as I counted them. In fact because it was so remarkable I stopped counting at 20 after we got through. Too often it was 6-8 boarders wide but why, when the board is so long and something like 8 inches high, must they sit side by side facing down a mountain and when someone complains do they get so rude? To put it bluntly, it seems selflessly ignorant.

Please appreciate that I was always in control and never in a position of hitting them myself, but some of our group are not as experienced and got abuse when passing closer than a boards length from them. To put it plainly, this attitude is intollerable and breeds the contempt boarders are unsurprisingly getting.

I dont wear a helmet skiing which is my decision and respect others who decide either way without comment. But hypocritcally some seem to have a firm opinion of helmet wearers. Why? 'spose they would also like speed limits lifted? However, I do wear a helmet mountain biking, but dont ask me to explain the difference, its that I always have done and feel vulnerable without it.

Some seem to need matters spelling out in large letters.... as for recklessness and endangerment on the piste; is sitting across the piste beside your mates having a chat with your vital organs the only thing facing uphill the smart thing to do? No!

Might such a position and pinching the viable width of a piste increase the chances of an accident? Yes!

... as for: [And who would regard its as sensible if, should such a thing happen, other users of the bridleway chose to walk over the ramblers instead of just simply picking their way around them?] Its assumed there's always time to make a choice. But people lose control for all sorts of reasons including obstacles and in response to the actions of others. Therefore, your opinion is that; boarders sitting across a piste facing downhill improve a resorts safety by a factor of what???

Tolerance I understand. Defending utter stupidity seems bizzare.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
carled, seriously, i dont go for that phsycho-babble shiite you label as trolling - just as it is. join in or stay away.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I'm a lot faster off piste than my bparder mates hehehe.... just cause I've more experience. I'm sure they'll be catching up.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Higs wrote:
skidd1 wrote:

As for one group being more considerate than the other well ive seen good and bad from both. I dont see the big divide..


As above.

I think the temptation is to think...

I'm a skier.
If a skier cuts me up, stands in the wrong place, is rude etc, it's because he's a knob.
If a boarder cuts me up, sits in the wrong place, is rude etc, it's because he's a boarder


I think unfortunately Snowboarders, probably due to the culture do get the rougher deal

I was cut up by a skiier at Les Arcs this year and it was all my fault apprenty becasue I was a Snowboarder, he was very rude?
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
gonwitdeewind wrote:
carled, seriously, i dont go for that phsycho-babble shiite you label as trolling - just as it is. join in or stay away.


Where's my "do not feed the troll" picture gone...? wink

Busted mate, well busted.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
gonwitdeewind,

read back on your posts in about a week or so and then you'll realise how anti-boarding you've come across and why you created such a reaction.

I've had bad experiences on the slopes with both boarders & skiers, it's not about the fact they are boarders or skiers it's down to the individual person not their method of gettiing down the mountain. I've had a few run in's with skiers pusing in line and i have it out with them there and then, job done. I know all skiers don't do it so it's just a small percentage of selfish individuals.

So you had a bad experience of the alleged 20 boarders blocking the piste and being abusive, go past them and get on with your holiday or if you felt that strongly you should have had it out with them then and there and not let it fester and then tar every snowboarder with the same brush on this forum. but i forgot you used the old chesnut,'a few of my mates are boarders so i'm not anti- boarding'


helmet wearers, personally speaking I think everyone should wear a helmet, i don't always wear one myself but know i should. A mate of mine who is a very experienced skier had a rather nasty spill in Colorado last week and the fact he was wearing a helmet probably saved his life if not a serious head injury. It was the first year he's ever worn a helmet.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Quote:

is sitting across the piste beside your mates having a chat with your vital organs the only thing facing uphill the smart thing to do? No!

It certainly sounds both painful and
Quote:

selflessly ignorant
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Hmmm, lets see. a large majority of tolerant, rational participants, and a couple of cranks causing vitriol.
As it is on the mountain, so be it on the forums... Spooky! Shocked
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
bar shaker, yours sounds like a one-off. Im talking about multiple events through the week and on some days several groups of boarders on their asses scattered across the piste. Experience includes boarders sitting around on open mountainside runs, forest runs, powdery and icey pistes. Maybe a boarders stationary profile is more problematic because of the size of the board when on its side? Boarder groups cant stand side-by-side like skiers therefore more consideration should be taken and not get so abusive when skiers make a point. Is La Plagne too flat for boarders overall and this issue is peculiar to LP? More importantly, of the boarders or La Plagne Resort who is going to sort this out?
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It shouldn't be an issue and probably won't be in 20 years time. I think boarding has probably peaked in terms of % of slope users as while a board is a great and naturally intuitive tool for getting down slopes of a reasonable gradient it has some severe limitations (much like the monoski).

I would say based on past experience although I've not been there in a while that La Plagne is not a resort I would choose to piste ride on a board due to the extended flat spots & repuation as a mileage over interesting terrain place (although I am well aware that its tame image is belied by some great accessible off piste terrain).
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
You get incondsiderate muppetts on both skis and boards - a few examples witnessed in the last few weeks

a) A group of 4 boarders & instructor stopped in the middle of the main cat-track towards montalbert.

b) Groups of skiers, often stopping a good 10 feet from the edge of the piste when on skis is relatively easy to shuffle across / back nearer the edge..

c) The 'ridge line' of nervous skiers when the stop at the top of the ridge above a steeper section - can often block close to the whole piste.

d) A stopped skier on a FLAT cat-track with their skis turned at right angles to the piste thus blocking over 60% of the available width (and it being so flat that they would have needed to pole if the they'd had their skis turned down the piste)

e) Skiers bouncing out of the trees onto a cat-track and then turning against the natural flow of skiers on the piste...


I try and let things slide but will have words if people are being complete muppets.
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Can we get this thread locked please? It's going to end in tears. gonwitdeewind is just trolling for a fight by posting inflammatory and ignorant generalisations - a bit like a drunken irishman just after closing time (see how I did that generalisation thing there, huh?) who just wants to pick a fight with anyone that "looks at him funny".

OK, OK, I admit it gonwitdeewind I have been stalking you for over a year now. I found out you were going to la Plagne and secretly arranged for all the most annoying snowboarders in the world (i.e. all of them according to you) to plague you with the most irritating behaviour they could manage. I'll tell you this, it took sodding AGES to get those 20 organised to sit across in front of you, the ignorant sods kept wanting to go and play in the powder and use the pistes (pah, can you imagine that, eh?) rather than just sit around in front of you.


Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Tue 17-02-09 11:22; edited 1 time in total
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
fatbob wrote:
I it has some severe limitations (much like the monoski).


a. don't dare lump monstrosities like monoskis in with snowboards
b. name one (of your severe limitations)
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
carled,

b. marginally uphill traverses in deep snow.

c. picking your way over some rocks in a no fall zone

d. getting trapped on a face that is too steep/unviable exit (no sidestepping up)


Don't get me wrong I love boarding but I'm not blind to its problematic features.
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bertie bassett, ... but any attempt to speak to these people on the slopes just gets an abusive response. I dont want any trouble on the slopes while on holiday, even though Im a sizeable chap and can stand my ground.

My experiences are thus and I conclude its a sector issue that has to be addressed by fellow boarders, the resorts or industry, but few seem to want to deal with it.

I have touched on this without any degree of preconceived bias and am very surprised by the responses - the world isnt made of marshmallow.
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gonwitdeewind sounds surprisingly dutch...

I put it that this is stanton sock puppet... Toofy Grin
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
fatbob, I would be careful with your predictions. similar predictions made in the 70s with skateboards vs roller skates seem to spring to mind.
You would be hard pushed to find roller skates today.

Twisted Evil
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
fatbob wrote:
carled,

b. marginally uphill traverses in deep snow.

c. picking your way over some rocks in a no fall zone

d. getting trapped on a face that is too steep/unviable exit (no sidestepping up)


Don't get me wrong I love boarding but I'm not blind to its problematic features.


Well yeah, but that's like saying that a motorbike is unsuitable for a bobsleigh run... sure, it'll work, but...

You just wouldn't (with any braincells left) take yourself into such a position on a board as it's bloody obvious you wouldn't want to be there. Your post was more like, "oh it's just a passing fad. These pesky snowboarders will soon realise the error of their ways and revert to 2 planks instead of one..." It ain't going to happen. There are as many idiot skiers on piste (and off) as there are snowboarders. It's a social problem, not a "method of getting down a mountain" problem.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
gonwitdeewind wrote:
....the world isnt made of marshmallow.


No. And your legs aren't made of chocolate.

Comprendez, big fella?
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Quote:
..except the boarders boots are way more comfortable!


I reckon even the most ardent old-skool/philistine "skiing is better than boarding etc" idiots would agree with that.

Maybe.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Interesting that people quote "method of getting down a mountain" when comparing both sports, but never say "method of having fun on a mountain".
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
carled wrote:


Your post was more like, "oh it's just a passing fad. These pesky snowboarders will soon realise the error of their ways and revert to 2 planks instead of one..." It ain't going to happen. There are as many idiot skiers on piste (and off) as there are snowboarders. It's a social problem, not a "method of getting down a mountain" problem.


Not what I was trying to suggest at all more that in 20 years time there won't be a skier/boarder divide as most active skiers and boarders will have grown up in the company of each other and will appreciate different mechanics, movement patterns etc.

If I had to guess though I'd say that boarder only numbers will decline while boarder/skier numbers and skier only numbers increase as a relative proportion, based on current equipment development rates. Of course rocker or widespread magnetraction or something else might revitalise boarding like "carving" skis did. Go in the park somewhere and see the relative number of skiers throwing it down in what used to be a board only environment.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
tuxpoo wrote:
Interesting that people quote "method of getting down a mountain" when comparing both sports, but never say "method of having fun on a mountain".


And its distinctly gravitationalist - who says snowshoers and X country whippets and masochistic mega skinners don't have fun? wink
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
tuxpoo,
Quote:

Interesting that people quote "method of getting down a mountain" when comparing both sports, but never say "method of having fun on a mountain".


Don't see the point you're trying to make? it is a 'method' of getting down a mountain, if it wasn't fun we wouldn't do !!! that goes without saying, 'method' meaning the from of transportation you take, ski, board, sleigh, skidoo etc etc it's all fun in my book and i'm sure everyone else's on here.
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dlawless, What IM try to say is too much is placed on one method or another to get down a mountain faster or over more varied terrain and not on how much fun the individual has in their chosen sport.

Its funny, but i don't think boarders see snowboards as transportation in the same way as skiers. They both obviously are, but the psyche is different.

Think it comes out if skis originally designed from a need to move in the mountain. Where boards are just big boys (and girls) toys Very Happy

tux
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
tuxpoo wrote:
dlawless, What IM try to say is too much is placed on one method or another to get down a mountain faster or over more varied terrain and not on how much fun the individual has in their chosen sport.

Its funny, but i don't think boarders see snowboards as transportation in the same way as skiers. They both obviously are, but the psyche is different.


So you are saying that boarders see snowboards as "transportation"? They would have to if they were to be different to skiers in that respect.

Quote:

Think it comes out if skis originally designed from a need to move in the mountain. Where boards are just big boys (and girls) toys Very Happy

tux


They are all toys. We go to the mountains to play, and what the original purpose of the first skis may have been is irrelevant to most of us.


Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Tue 17-02-09 15:29; edited 1 time in total
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.... and as people are individuals their choice of what constitutes fun or play can be different. A hardbooter aiming at perfect trenchdigging has a very different take on snowboarding to a jib monkey. Likewise a social skier may enjoy getting in mileage commuting between various mountain villages and terraces while a race head may be perfectly happy nailing gates all day off the saame drag.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
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Yes they are toys..saw a boarder with skiboots and bindings..best or worst of both worlds! rolling eyes
He didnt hold anyone up quite the reverse ! He had to wait for everyone else
Mind you there might be some who think he must have stolen the boots from an unsuspecting skier..You know what these boarders are like Smile
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
tuxpoo, I think I know where you are coming from Very Happy
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Get the best of both worlds. Try Mono skiing Madeye-Smiley


http://www.monoski.net/
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bertie bassett wrote:
I've never really had issues with the flat bits, you just need to make sure you gun it far enough up the hill to ride through the flats.

I take it you aren't an off-piste regular? What do you do with a few miles of flat track to get out (eg on the popular Tarrentaise circuit).
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