 Poster: A snowHead
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although they don't admit it, other flights were departing earlier than ours and that meant we had to depart from the resort really early for these people to get their flights, also same bus will wait in car park for all the flights to come in aswell to take next batch of people to resort and they arrived before our flight also - as it happens we flew back on a plane that had just landed.
on the way down the hill, we had to stop twice to load people on the bus who'd been minibus'd down to the en-route towns - then when rest of us wanted to get some shut eye, they wouldn't blummen shut up.
from Maidstone in Kent - took 13 hours there and 15 hours return, can drive it in about 10 hours.
has kinda put me off package holidays now, think it is faster and more convenient to drive via eurotunnel and book my own accommodation.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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that is indeed a horrible time to have to get up in the morning - did you not know about that in advance? I've responded in your other thread to the assertion that you can drive it in 10 hours from the UK, which I don't agree with. But certainly DIY has loads of advantages over packages - not that you have to drive all the way. A scheduled flight and a hired car, or a private taxi if there are a few of you, is also a sensible alternative. You do have to sort out the problems yourself if, for example, your scheduled airport is shut and you get dumped 100 miles away, or you have to stop to put on snow chains and dig your car out after an overnight dump, but at least you don't get treated like sheep.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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That was one of my greatest frustrations when going on package tours. I eventually got tired of being treated like a sheep, as pam w accurately described it, and started to arrange everything myself. Didn't think it was any cheaper, but I thought better value for money and none of the typical TO hassle.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I do enjoy the organisational challenges (usually...). Dealing independently with punctures, piste accidents, getting stuck in snowdrifts, mechanical problems, doing the snow chains, finding every single tyre place in France and Switzerland shut on Sundays, arriving at Grenoble airport to find a last minute ATC strike had cancelled ALL flights that day.... all part of the learning curve (and not all on the same trip!) 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Can't say I've ever experienced anything as bad as that on a TO trip. Yes, I've often been on a transfer bus with other flights and one that has stopped at other resorts en route, but never more than an hour each end added to the journey...
Driving and/or private transfers never an option for me. Maybe this is where the bigger tour ops have an edge on the smaller ones. More people to transfer so less grouping of flights and resorts together...
With my forthcoming trip I'm actually hoping I do get grouped with some other flights as the people I'm meeting up with are on flights that arrive within an hour of mine. That way we can meet up on the transfer coach before we even get to our hotels...
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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queen bodecia, no me neither, I've just posted on the other thread that I've never had to wait a silly amount of time or set off mega early to cater for other people's flights. I have looked many times into the independent route when I've been thinking of going somewhere and just the other day actually, I priced up an independent trip, before I even got to how much car hire or the public bus would have cost me from Geneva to the resort (the public bus on it's own was 129 Euros return) the B&B I found in the same area as this chalet hotel I found through a TO was going to cost 840 Euros for the week, so even excluding the flight cost and food because it was just B&B not a catered chalet, the independent option was costing 969 Euros so adding flight and food for the week was going to send it well over the 1000 Euros mark. The TO option was £750 all in with it being a catered chalet hotel.
I appreciate you can get cheaper accomodation and all that but even the self catering studio and 1 bed apartments I'd looked at had ridiculous supplements for under occupancy (this B&B was pricey because of the location) but this was a like for like example staying in the resort centre next to the lifts in both cases. For me, it's not worth paying well over £250 more to have the independence thing and not go on the transfer bus. Also I would have had to lug my stuff to the B&B from wherever the public bus stopped instead of being dropped off outside and TO staff taking your stuff up to your rooms for you.
It probably does work out worthwhile though if there is a group of say 5 people to book it all separately especially if they share a self catering apartment and buy all the food before they start driving up the mountain. 
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I can't be doing with intricate transfer arrangements with TO's, it is possible to take the package and then organise your own transfer (can be a bit pricey though, would probably work out quite nicely for a group of 6). We've done full DIY as well but it doesn't work out much cheaper (if it all) for the peak times we travel, and you're responsible for sorting out any little problems that arise on the way.
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Done both. DIY no cheaper from my regional airport. TO is a pain when they treat you like sheep though.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I think the truth is that there is absolutely no "best" or "easiest" or "quickest" or "cheapest" way to get from the UK to one of the Alpine ski resorts. They're all a pain.
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pam w, all have their advantages and disadvantages. With hubby's recent mishap, we have had to cancel our March trip ,and have rebooked the Eurotunnel for July for our summer trip. Finding suitable flights for April, which will be right at the end of the season has proved a nightmare,as the flights from Newcastle to Geneva stop on the 19th April. We don't want to waste the time driving, as it has to be over two days from so far north. If we fly, we need car hire................ airport parking, possibly a hotel.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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We gave up on the TO option after a nightmare with Ski Total one year, and then Ski Esprit the next.
The first year was just me and DH and we got early flights with a view to getting some skiing on the 1st afternoon - we sat for nearly an hour on the transfer bus waiting for connecting flights, and then for a further 20 minutes because 'two people haven't shown up' - we finally worked out that they were waiting for us! we had been on the bus, and they had checked us off, but someone their count was out. We had the 45 minute 'comfort' stop at the services, and when we got to Les Arcs we had to walk miles to get to our chalet. By the time we arrived we were about 2.5hrs later than they had told us when we booked.
The second time, we went out of school hols with Esprit (our kids were 6 and  , so of course there were tons of babies and toddlers on the plane and on the transfer. The plane ride was hellish - I have never seen so many babies on one flight (in fact I thought there were limits on how many babies a flight could have).
One particular 'hooray henry' family managed to make everyone wait on the bus for ages on leaving the airport - god knows what they were doing as our bags were the last ones off the plane (we were at the point where we were starting to panic they had lost them) and we then got on the bus and still had to sit for 45 minutes while the reps went looking for this family. When they got on the bus they promptly started asking people to move so they could sit together (I was thinking try getting to the bus on time next time). Then because the bus was late leaving the airport the driver insisted on a long break at a service station - so in the end it was really quite late when we got to the resort - I was just so relieved they weren't in our chalet, but it did take ages as well to unload everyone at the various chalets in the resort - and again wait for everyone to manhandle their luggage, buggies and babies. First and last Esprit holiday for us!
On the way back we were told to be at the hotel 100yds down the road for 5.30am - the people in the hotel were told to be on the doorstep at 5.40am... the same family finally got 'rounded up' out of the restaurant at 6.10am! "oh, fabulous holiday dahhlings, couldn't drag ourselves away, so many nice people to say cheerio to".... arghhh - then the "would you mind awfully if we were to swap seats?" before listening all the way to the airport about their fantabulous sprogs skiing abilities.
I was stressed, but not as upset as the family further down the resort who had been standing OUTSIDE their chalet (as asked) for over 30 minutes with a poorly child waiting for the pickup. Then of course when we got to the airport we were last to check in, so all seated together for a another couple of hours. Same family, right behind us, 4 yrs old kicking my back the entire way.
Last year we flew BMIbaby on a scheduled weekday flight - half empty and only our 2 kids and about 4 other kids on it - were picked up by the owner of the apartment we rented - fantastic, and same on the return. Much less 'cattle' feeling about it, and no waiting about for other people to whom timekeeping isn't an issue.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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If I had a family of 3 of us, 4 of us or 5 of us, I'd definitely drive it everytime and book accomodation separately be it catered accomodation or self catered apartment. There is something to be said for loading everything and everybody into the car, driving it and then everybody and everything unloaded the other side instead of waiting in airport lounges, trying to carry your stuff and theirs etc etc.
If it's just me or me and him, then I'd stick with the TO's until I get a bad experience that pushes me into going the independent route. Unless it is a resort I particularly want to go to and can't get a TO deal there, then yeah course I'd go the independent route no worries.
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You know it makes sense.
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" 4 yrs old kicking my back the entire way."
I've had that and I will not accept it, I ask the parents first, if it persists I turn round and bollock the little shite as if it were my own.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Quote: |
bollock the little shite as if it were my own.
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Poster: A snowHead
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innerspaceservices, which company ?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I once got the train. Yes it was an absolute pain driving down to Ashford, but if you live near there already then it probably would be the quickest way of getting to the French Alps. Only problems are it's more expensive than flying and it only goes to France, but certainly makes some sense for those that live in the south east...
I assume it's now possible to catch the ski train from St Pancras? Which incidentally is where the London-bound trains from here arrive (just over 2 hour journey!), so that would be possible with just one change of train. However the France limitation and cost would be off-putting...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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innerspaceservices, It took us 4 1/2 hours by coach from Peisey Vallandry (should be about 2 1/2) to Grenoble last year and it was not 1/2 term, had the TO not built in extra time for our transfer, we would have missed our flight!!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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innerspaceservices, one of the many reasons I go independent these days. Have never looked backed since changing and you don't fanny about at airports or resorts either waiting on folk/planes/dropping folk off. Have usually found that you get better rooms (for us anyway being a family of 5 - UK ops just don't do 5, even though the hotels they offer do  )
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Because bookings are so poor this season, it's not cost effective for the TOs to have seperate coaches to each resort.
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bertie bassett, my parents always take the train and love it - they are in their 70s. This is the daytime ski train which leaves London at 10ish and is in Bourg by 7pm rather than any of the over night options.
Several seats in each carriage are left empty for luggage so there is plenty of space - plus they can walk around the train get drinks etc. I'm sure they wouldn't use it if it was bad. They do have a slight advantage in that we take their luggage in our car, so they only have carry-on bags though
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Your early flight out probably meant that the people on the incoming flight had a cheeky afternoon on the slopes. You dont say how long it took you to get to the airport.
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I cannot help to think on seeing the title of this thread that as Tignes is at the dead end of the Tarentaise Valley in winter and must get through the crowds leaving La Rosiere, Ste Foy, Les Arcs, La Plagne, 3 Vallees and Valmorel its transfer time must be the worst of them all. The 10 hours for driving there is realistic only if one does not travel on a change-over day.
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I think the truth is that there is absolutely no "best" or "easiest" or "quickest" or "cheapest" way to get from the UK to one of the Alpine ski resorts. They're all a pain.
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Try any non-French Alpine resorts. You won't find many French there and so the queues and delays are immediately halved at least.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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or just take advantage of the flexible dates available from some apartment-owners (like Helen Beaumont) and drive, or fly, mid-week. Empty planes, empty airports, empty roads. Or even book an apartment for two weeks, then fly out on the first Tuesday, back on the second Thursday. Or at the very least, don't go to one of the resorts with the most difficult transfers, on a Saturday. Or maybe stay at home?
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The 10 hours for driving there is realistic only if one does not travel on a change-over day.
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True. Even in low season, Saturdays in the French Alps are for those with no choice, or no better ideas.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Kramer wrote: |
| Because bookings are so poor this season, it's not cost effective for the TOs to have seperate coaches to each resort. |
Yes, I thought that a few weeks ago with Inghams. Leaving Innsbruck there is normally pretty much one coach per flight to an area - no waiting, empty buses etc. This time the coach was full, some on there had been waiting a couple of hours waiting for our Gatwick flight. Lots of dropping off on the way for taxis minibuses to then go to individual resorts. It meant for us we had to get off at Worgl and wait for a minibus and then have a drop off at Soll & St Johann before getting to Kitzbuhel. But getting to the airport we had our own minibus to ourself, as did the same people we dropped off at Soll. We then met up with the coach from Alpbach at Rattingen, which had a handful of people on board.
So a bit of a lengthy journy getting to Kitzbuhel - super speedy getting back to the airport
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BB - wrote = I'd be interested to see if you still say that after getting there and back...personally I think the train is the worst of all options
Ok - so tell me why - was looking forwar to it up unitl this moment!!!!!!!!
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You know it makes sense.
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The thing that did for us and TO hols was the poor rep that got the transfer time to the airport wrong and gave us 2 hours to get to Turin from Serre Chevalier, leaving at 9.30 for an 11.30 flight...We even asked her to check and she was certain that would be ok... Hopeless. If there hadn't been a delay on the flight we'd have been stuck. The airport end rep hadn't been told we were supposed to be there either, and the resort rep had gone on another transfer. The minibus driver to his due drove like Alain Prost down the autostada, and TBH in the great scheme of things, for us as a couple it would have meant another night in Turin [bummer, I think not] but I did feel for the folks with the kids. Hope the poor girl got things sorted for the rest of the season...
And of course, the getting up in the middle of the night before you went to bed, to sit in Saturday morning traffic on an unheated coach, change at Monetier, have to eyeball someone out to move a rucksack off a coach seat, and put up with a load of yaaahs, who held us up, and etc etc ad nauseam. [not all the same trip  ]
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Next time I think I'm going to try the train - or even a coach.
Two weeks ago in Meribel I met some people who were in a Neilson chalet. Their pickup time had been moved forward at the last minute from 7am to 2.30am.
I have nothing but praise for Alpine Action with whom I travelled.
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Poster: A snowHead
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What did it for us was our trip to La Rosiere. Holiday was fine, but we were up for a 5am departure to catch a lunchtime flight out of Chambery. Chalet staff hadn't bothered to put out our early breakfast we were promised. We were still in Aime bus station in the freezing cold at 8.30, with no sign of coaches, reps or anything else. We didn't dare move anywhere in case the bus turned up. Bus came from Val D'Isere eventually, but why couldn't we have left later and met it in Bourg?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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What a nightmare. I'd like to try the train sometime though, with a stopover in Paris. The only time I went on a full-on package it was the same, 3 am pickup, horrible.
We can get to Chamonix door-to-door in 5 hours (4 1/2 is the record but involved some very close calls, I wouldn't want to do it again), going via London City - the small airports are much faster. Also we very rarely go Saturday-Saturday, makes a huge difference.
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brian
brian
Guest
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Last year...
1.5hr drive to Airport
40 mins from the long term carpark to the airport
1 hr to check in
2 hr flight
1.5 hrs max to resort (picked up by the apartment owner)
Door to door in under 7 hrs
The only stressful bit was the bus from the long term carpark because we just missed one and had to wait 25 mins for the next one, where we had been told they ran every 10 mins, then when we got to the checkin everyone was in the same queue so we were worried we wouldn't make the front of the queue in time.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Rather than saying they're all a pain, maybe it would be more positive to say they're all easy enough, when nothing goes wrong. But things do go wrong; the motorway can be on "operation stack", airports at either end can be closed by fog etc, roads can be busy, cars can break down or get punctures, flights get cancelled at short notice, you can be struggling with snowchains in minus 15 in a blizzard, your main driver can be out of action with an injury, roads can be closed by landslides (especially between Bourg St Maurice and the Haute Tarentaise!). All have happened to me at one time or another. But none of it is really a very big deal in the wider scheme of things. If you're not prepared to deal with that kind of thing, stick with the TO arrangements.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| your main driver can be out of action with an injury |
Tell me about it !!!
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brian
brian
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pam w, absolutely. Personally I (and I expect you and lots of other s) would rather deal with any mishap myself than rely on the efforts of a gap year rep.
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If you get a 4 hour transfer (like mine from GRN to L2A at New Year) I hope your coach has a bog 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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innerspaceservices, Need the TO name otherwise it helps non one else who may have the same operator.
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Never experienced anything as hideous as the OP's experience, but avoiding a TO transfer is worth DIYing it for, even if it wasn't cheaper for us (half term, in Europe) and offers accomodation not available through TOs (few decent B&B pensions need to accept the low TO rates (or the grizzly TO guests).
Our flight to Salzburg was delayed by an hour and the weather was bad driving up to Obertauern. We arrived (by cab) about 10.00pm, 2.5 hours late; God knows what time the late travelling TO people arrived.
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FAQ
Sounds grim. 
I hope the April trip works out OK.
