 Poster: A snowHead
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In the ski shop last weekend I noticed a clear distinction between mens and womens skis. I'm pretty sure this is a newish thing and any skis I've used in the past have been 'unisex'. I'm a big bird (174cm, 75kg) and in the hire shop last season I was definitely given mens skis, the same type of Salomons given to most of the men I was skiing with. The other two women (both shorter than me) were given womens Rossignols...
What's the difference? Are womens skis just shorter and lighter with flowery graphics or is there something in the design of them that is more suited to a woman's build? Should I insist on womens skis in the hire shop this season or will they be too short for me...?
Any advice...?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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No doubt an expert will be along soon, but is there not something about where they position the bindings? Further forward or something 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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In Lech, 90% of the skis are unisex. It probably depends where you go.
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I am no expert - but isnt it down to flex
mens being stiffer than womans ?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I think its called marketing.
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It's a bit more than just marketing. Women's specific skis are generally lighter, shorter and less stiff than their male equivalents. They make perfect sense for average women (who are smaller and lighter than average men), but they don't make any sense for women who are man sized! Graphics are obviously chosen by marketing to suit their target buyers (as are mens / unisex skis)
queen bodecia, You'd almost certainly be better off with men's skis at your weight, particularly if you're a strong skier too.
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^
What he said, plus what ickabodblue said.
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Have also seen that women's specific skis have lifted heels to make stance more comfortable for women, wow, high-heeled skis 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Women have bigger arses. This changes their centre of gravity and those in the know seem to think this means they need different skis.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Frosty the Snowman, this was discussed with me by an ISTD earlier in the season. Not sure I understand the logic though. I, arguably, have a bigger arse than most women, yet I don't have anything stuck out front  (well, apart from the beer belly). I still can't work out how women have a COM which is further back than a man's; however, I shall bow to the combined wisdom of the physiologists who have deemed this to be the case.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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queen bodecia, I don't understand the science but I prefer women specific skis. I'm as heavy as Mr HH, so certainly no lightweight, but even so I find that the womens skis are nicer to ski on. I suspect it's more to do with the average proportions of a womans body rather than the size of her back bottom! For example Mr HH is much taller than me but has a shorter leg length meaning that his body weight must surely be in a different place when he Bends ze Kneez even though we weigh much the same?
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skisimon, don't men generally tend to have larger shoulders and women larger hips, thereby changing their respective COGs?
A shop I was in last week also suggested that women's larger hips result in a greater tendency towards being knock-kneed on skis (certainly a hip-width stance is likely to be wider in a woman than a man) and hence affects the edging angle and that women's skis are made to compensate for this. Not sure how much credence I place in that though...
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You know it makes sense.
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Depending on the woman couldn't the weight at the hips, be offset by varing degrees by weight at the bust? I would have thought robustly endowed women at the bust dept. would have a completely different centre of gravity than those less well endowed of us.
FWIW I ski on women's skis, but have skied on unisex/mens skis - the womens skis do have the bindings mounted forward, but at my lowly skill level I'm sure I can't tell the difference. It's probably like most of these things - unless you are pushing the envelope of what a ski can offer I doubt all these niceties feature much in the actual performance. I don't push the envelope yet.
I think Marketing is the best reason offered so far. Women are told they need their own skis so many of them buy them. For the record I bought mine 'cos they were cheap and a better deal than hiring 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Hmm. Guess I'll just stick to mens or unisex skis then since I'm the same height/weight as an average chap. I do have long legs and big butt/boobies but I don't expect that makes much difference...
Cheers for the advice people, gutted they don't make purdy purple skis in my size... 
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
that women's larger hips result
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See, told ya
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Megamum wrote: |
I think Marketing is the best reason offered so far. Women are told they need their own skis so many of them buy them.
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No, I don't think it's quite that simple. There was a time when skis came in very limited choices and the only choices for reasonable skiers were race slalom or GS skis. Things have moved on a lot over the last decade and women's skis are just one natural development. I think you could alternatively call them skis for slightly smaller, lighter skiers. If you are making a ski, you have to optimise each ski length for a particular weight of person. If you decide to make unisex skis, it will be more of a compromise for anyone who is not close to the chosen average 'design' weight for that ski. It is reasonable to assume that a women's specific ski will be softer than the equivalent men's model from the same manufacturer. If it was purely marketing, manufacturers would just offer exactly the same ski with men's and women's graphics. But I don't know of any that actually do this?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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What does a softer ski actually do...?
I originally learned to ski in the 70s/80s when skis were long, skinny and stiff. Yes they weren't so easy to turn and progression from snowplough turns to parallel turns took loads longer, but I do remember them feeling very stable. Modern shorter fatter skis although easy to turn and easier to carry do have a tendency to feel 'flappy' at speed to me. Is a more rigid ski a better idea?
I did sell my last pair of skis (Atomic SX9 174cm) as I decided they were too long/fast for me and not so good at deeper snow. I have no plans to purchase new skis at present. I can't really justify the cost for the 6 days per year skiing. However, I do want to have some idea what to ask for when hiring skis. I know I can take them back if not suitable but I'd rather spend my precious six days skiing not traipsing back and forth to the hire shop...
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queen bodecia, Softer skis are generally more forgiving, but generate less cornering force and are more likely to be "flappy" at speed. It's not as simple as 'stiffer = better', it's more like 'stiffer = different pros and cons'. But in general, more advanced skis will tend to be stiffer. The important thing is to choose a ski with the right level of stiffness for your weight and ability. Women's skis just add more increments to this choice.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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ickabodblue, Heaven's Gate were the ones I saw at the ski shop on Saturday and immediately liked because of the purple bits. But they were very short, way too short for me, and the sales chap did mention they were a soft ski and judging by the responses above a big bird like me needs a firmer ski...
Damn. They're so purdy. Not to mention way beyond my slender means...
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queen bodecia, If you want purple skis what about these ones:
https://www.northernski.com/ecommerce2/shop/product/elan-mag-spice/
If you go here:
http://www.elanskis.com/pcc.asp?xpath=&xpathid=&xpathid2=&xpathid3=&lang=eng
Then pick Products/Womens skis/Spice/Mag spice there is a great picture you can zoom in on.
Mind you before you go purple also check out the Pure Spice just above them on the Elan page - I've tried a pair of those - the turquoise is amazing and they are finished with a silky fabric like tactile finish to them. In terms of being a big bird, you are no bigger than me (possibly a tad smaller). I ski on the Elan Wave Magics in a 160cm with no problems so discount a pretty womens ski if you want one.
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| queen bodecia wrote: |
I did sell my last pair of skis (Atomic SX9 174cm) as I decided they were too long/fast for me and not so good at deeper snow. I. |
Those were a classic for their time. Quite versatile. I know several guys who are giving them almost-collectible status.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Queen Bodecia, If you want something to deal with the deeper snow from what I found out when I skied them this was what the turquise pure spice skis mentioned above seemed to be designed for.
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Wed 4-02-09 19:19; edited 1 time in total
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Megamum, are you talking to yourself now? That's the first sign of hysteria, or is it the second...?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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skisimon, sod it - wrong link!! I don't think I've done that before. I'm going to edit it before I look even more of a fool. Cheers!!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skisimon, too late.....'tis done!!
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You know it makes sense.
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Megamum, they're gorgeous! Even nicer than the Atomic Heaven's Gate ones...
I'm really not in a position to buy any more skis though. It's hard enough saving up the money for a ski trip each year, let alone anything more. Plus my job is far from secure at the moment...
A gal can dream though eh...?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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comprex, the Atomics were a great ski in the right conditions, but I struggled a bit with them in soft snow. Plus they were very fast and I really wanted to slow down a bit now I'm an old burd...
Sold them on fleabay for £100 though so hopefully someone is getting their money's worth out of them...
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Poster: A snowHead
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I don't know about this 'mounting forward' stuff. I've found that I can ski quite happily on 165s as well as 155s, so how does mounting the bindings a cm forward make a lot of difference?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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erica2004, The mounting point on the ski affects the load distribution along the ski length. You can have 165s and 155s with identical relative mounting points, which will give the same balance.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Oh no...this thread is confusing me even more...
The explanation I got on women's skis was around the centre of gravity thing, hence the forward placement of the bindings, and also women's pelvis alignment is such that the angle your thighbone comes out of your hip joint makes women more prone to be knock kneed.
However, the stuff now about light skis and flexy stuff makes me think...argh...as am definitely in plump pixie zone and much more than 75kgs. I probably bend the living life out of any girly skis I get...
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MarjMJ, Yep, I would say the mounting point is the least important aspect of women's specific skis. You can also mount further forward on any men's ski too if you like. It's largely down to personal preference and intended use of the ski. At 75 kg, men's skis would make more sense for you. The skis can feel your weight but they don't understand the difference between male and female If you buy into the centre of gravity thing then just mount them slightly forward of the mark.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The best thing to do is just try loads of different skis, surely this is one of the big advantages to hiring? The next time you go on holiday ask the shop if they have a womens specific version of the ski they offer you and try it one day and the unisex the next and see what you prefer. I'm about the same size as you and have generally preferred unisex skis when comparing like for like but have never really been sure why and would am sure I would be quite happy skiing a womens specific ski if given one. They aren't all noodles as well, I've tried the K2 tough luv and it was pretty stiff although I didn't particularly like it.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
The skis can feel your weight but they don't understand the difference between male and female
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True.
lynseyf, Good advice. Have had women's specific skis last few trips, and it is nice to have lighter skis to lug about, but TBH it is all a mystery...
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I was always an unbeliever in 'womens' skis (i'm well over 90kgs and they do mostly seem to be made of cheese) but last year in ValDisere had a very nice pair of lady specific skis (black, with sort of goth flowers on them, one luv maybe?) which were more than up to the job and were quite nice to ski so I wouldn't totally discount women specific skis even if you are a little heavier. aj xx
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Like I said, a mystery.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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MarjMJ, I've got women's Volkl S5s, and they weigh a TON! Lightness definitely not a feature. They are terrific for ripping around on-piste; I think the weight - theirs, not just mine!! - helps to keep them stable. The only time I want softish skis is off-piste (or park, if I ever try that!). AIUI, women's skis are to do with the bindings being mounted a bit further forward, which can be done on a lot of unisex skis, but not the ones where the bindings are mounted on rails which are integral to the ski. The reasons are: 1) women do tend to carry a bit more weight in the butt, which creates a natural propensity for the weight to fall back and 2) women have shorter calf muscle fibres than men, so we cannot flex as far forward. Mounting the bindings forward helps us to keep out weight centred and forward towards the front of the ski by compensating for these bio-mechanical differences.
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vetski, You can mount forward on rail mounted binding systems too. Some even have a quick adjust for that very purpose (like Tyrolia Railflex which have a +/-15 mm quick adjust). The men's version of your ski will almost certainly be even stiffer and heavier. It's all relative.
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