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Taking the kids, what age

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I started at 18 years old and i feel i have seriously missed out! Dont know if i would like my kids going before they are about 7-8 thou.

(this comes from a 21 year old.... lacking kids)
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
scrubyjoe, hey stop bitching - I started at 27! Toofy Grin Toofy Grin Toofy Grin

(I'm sure someone's going to "trump" me any minute...!)
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Avago,
Quote:

A little video of his experience at 2 http://uk.youtube.com/v/c0i24f8Z1K8
That is absolute bliss - what a brilliant little chap! Very Happy
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russ_e, I don't have kids, but I do have a lot of friends and colleagues who do and this subject came up in conversation at a recent work social do.

The consistent themes seem to be:

Don't project yourself onto your kids. You love skiing and your kids will undoubtedly love skiing, but don't be in too much of a rush to get them on skis otherwise you could end up with the child totally hating the experience. I know someone who got themselves in this position and they still regret it.

Trust the professionals (including the creches) as they've got more experience in this stuff than you have. Both the French and Canadians seem to have a similar approach to introducing very young children to snowsports - that is to emphasise the kids being comfortable with, and enjoying playing in, the snow before worrying about anything to do with sliding or skiing.

Don't be afraid to not go when the kids are young. Some of my work colleagues took the approach of not skiing when the kids were young - they make the observation that their kids learned at 6 or 7; enjoy it; are still better than them and don't seem at all deprived.

For kids who don't grow up in a ski resort then 4 or 5 seems to be the youngest age when you can sensibly expect a child to ski sufficiently long and well enough for you to do it with them. I was skiing with geetee jr last year and, at 4, she was only just about big enough to sensibly have on a chairlift. She was certainly too young to deal with even a child/beginner friendly drag - although we did take her up the gentlist of gentle drags successfully. But only with great caution.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Hurtle wrote:
Avago,
Quote:

A little video of his experience at 2 http://uk.youtube.com/v/c0i24f8Z1K8
That is absolute bliss - what a brilliant little chap! Very Happy


Adorable! It is the awesome watching the tiny kids decked out in their ski gear trundling around the nursery slopes. Saw a kid in france 2 weeks ago that made the hardest of lads melt. He had the best strut off the slopes with his tiny skis i have ever seen
ski holidays
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Jonny Jones,

Quote:

There's no need to get angry


I'm not angry at all, in fact I sit here smiling, hoping for once that you might actually listen to someone who is trying to show you the bigger picture.
Quote:

When I'm told that it's fabulous to have a holiday where you can get away from the kids for a week, I'm genuinely confused. And when people tell me that it's fabulous to have your kids supervised from breakfast to supper, I'm confused. Myself, I really don't think that these things are at all fabulous.


Now, I confess I've not been using this site long, but I don't think that I've come accross anyone with that opinion. The general scenario is that parents take their kids on holiday with them, enjoy being in the snow with them, enjoy playing snowballs with them, enjoy skiing with them when they can, enjoy sledging with them etc but they also enjoy a few hours to themselves. My children often have other children (friends, cousins etc) come on their skiing holiday with them and I tell you now, it is generally me that gets "dumped" because the kids enjoy spending time with each other rather than being glued to their parents every waking second.

You said:

Quote:

If I were you, I'd put the brochures to one side for a couple of years and stick to dreaming about snow. Grit your teeth and book a trip to Disney instead (yes, it's awful - but kids don't notice). Or spend some time crabbing on a rocky Pembrokeshire beach. Or just go to the play area in your local park. Your lad will have more fun if you're around. Unless, of course, you spend so little time with him that he's not sure who you are.




So you are expressing your opinion? Fine go ahead, but make it truthful, stop with the exageration. Just because some people choose to go on a ski holiday and put their children in creche doesn't mean they never want to spend any time with their children. For example, in 2007 we had a ski holiday and we had a summer holiday (no creche or childcare) and we went to Disneyland Paris (no creche/childcare). In 2008 we went skiing, we went on a summer holiday (no childcare/creche) and we went for a week to Cornwall, "crabbing" etc. Guess what? I'm also a stay at home Mum, we eat evening meals together as a family every night and we have each weekend together. Now isn't it amazing that these substandard parents who use childcare provisons actually sometimes do spend a bit of time with their kids.

I have a sneaky suspicion that youre actually secretly gutted that, through careful considerations of all the facts (can kids enjoy creche, is creche dangerous, will the kids suffer mentally through being left in a creche, will putting the kids in creche help fulfill a parent which in turn will reflect on a child?) all of us have done so well in finding a system that works so well for all, while you saw the situation in only black and white.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Hurtle, Thanks, glad you enjoyed it. snowHead Smile

scrubyjoe, Cool snowHead
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
We started my son on skis at 2 and a half and he loved it. We didn't go the creche route for the above reasons, and because we had a very bad experience the year before with Esprit. Last year our chalet company booked us a private nanny by the hour, so she brought him up on the bubble to meet us so we could play around with him for a couple of hours and then took him home again, so we got to ski a bit more in the afternoon. It was the best of both worlds because he enjoyed learning with us, but we still got to do some serious skiing. We felt he was too young to be taught be a stranger, but because he knew the nanny well she was able to teach him a bit as well which was perfect. Plus because it was by the hour it worked out much cheaper than the creche route. The one we had was from a co called Alpine Child Care, but I guess every resort has private nannies. Your chalet should be able to sort it out for you.
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Jonny Jones, As an impartial observer and soon to be dad I find your views a bit extreme. Obviously having kids is a life changing experience and will involve compromises along the way, but I won't be giving up any of my precious skiing time in the process Smile You might be confused, but I certainly don't want to spend 100% of my free time with my baby. A bit of time out seems healthy to me, even if you can't get your head around it yourself.
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rambotion, but only if they are continent.......


really....

unless you want to change them out of wet and smelly fartbags into another- freshly laundered pair...

lots of requirements before kids go skiing;

continence
can be left with strangers without emotional disintergration
parents can leave kids without emotional disintergration
can stand still
listen to man speaking in funny voice and do what told
remember which pocket snack is in
continence (very important this)
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
I got shouted at on a different thread (the one about the kid smashing into the father) and I'm a little reticent - but I'm trying to still get involved with this site - about posting my thoughts. Here goes. I skied for the first time at fourteen. I was unsure, for all and more of the reasons given above, about how and when to introduce my children to skiing and to see if they liked it. So off we went to our local dry slope. Daughter was eight and son four. Like many youngsters with sports, they took to it like ducks to water and have never looked back. She has raced as part of a team and individually on dry slopes in this country and worked a season in NZ and he is the biggest powder hound in the world. For us UK residents, skiing on snow is a well and hard earned prize and I cannot recommend too highly getting our kids involved with a local ski club from a very early age. They learn about so much, get to know if they like it and when the real thing happens for them they aren't so fazed.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Aneira, don't worry about the shouting, no-one means it.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Whatever age, just take them. What they do whilst there is what you should be discussing. Depending on age, you can look after them yourselves (in turn), put them in creche/ski school, have a nanny/babysitter in - whatever you want really.

With son#1, we continued with our normal pattern of ski trips and did all the above - and he's find and absolutely loves his skiing. Son#2 wasn't quite so easy - he arrived in the middle of the ski season, so mum's ski trips were curtailed that year - and he loves his skiing too.

There is no reason whatsoever that kids should stop you going on ski holidays. Would you think it unusual if kids stopped someone going on beach holidays? [All that UV - bad for the kids!]
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
richmond,
Thank you Smile
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
RobW wrote:


There is no reason whatsoever that kids should stop you going on ski holidays. Would you think it unusual if kids stopped someone going on beach holidays? [All that UV - bad for the kids!]


My thoughts exactly.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
As stated it is down to the individual child - my daughter started when she was 4, and to be honest it was a year too early. At 5 she loved it and has never looked back. We took my our son at 3 1/2 - convinced ourselves that as he is a boy he will take to it at an earlier age - quite the opposite to be honest!! So the next year he went to the grandparents for a "special" holiday and we went skiing! Very Happy Didn't go last year due to work commitments, so this year - off to Meribel on Sunday, can't wait!! - will be his first time. I managed to take him to xscape in Milton Keynes for a 1 hour lesson - just to find out if he liked... thankfully he loved it, and cannot wait to go - what a relief!
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
[quote="RobW"]Whatever age, just take them. What they do whilst there is what you should be discussing. quote]


Absolutely! I've been taking my boy to the mountains since he was two months old. He's been a couple of times a season and he's 2 now. At Xmas he'd just gone 2, I didn't get much skiing/boarding in (first lift run in the morning, last lift run evening when someone wouldn't mind watching him for half hour) BUT he had the BEST time. We played in the snow all week, went sledging every day, he pottered around in the playpark on his plastic skis, we built snow men, we rode up and down the "bubble lift" endless times a day (he was a bit obsessed with it!), he drank hot chocolates and ate pizza and ice cream. He helped the chalet staff shovel snow and had a ride in a piste basher and I didn't once see him without a smile all over his face! I'm looking forward to getting him out again this season, he asks when we're going all the time! and when I think he's ready he'll be on skis...not before! but when that is depends on the individual child. A child being too young to ski is no reason not to take them to the mountains and enjoy your skiing holiday and have brilliant fun!

I honestly don't understand why people think it's wrong to take young children on this kind of holiday! It's fabulous fun, they love it!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
A ski school boss once told me that, "on average", the age that a kid doing 1 week a season could put up with 5-6 mornings in ski school was 6
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Frosty the Snowman wrote:
A ski school boss once told me that, "on average", the age that a kid doing 1 week a season could put up with 5-6 mornings in ski school was 6


However, just because you take your kids skiing does not mean you have to put them in ski school for a week (or at all), so it doesn't mean you shouldn't take them before they are 6 (or whatever age the ski school will take them at your particular resort).
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Joanne Mountainsun, agreed. Skiing is quickly becomin a luxury. You say in your post that
Quote:

I didn't get much skiing/boarding in (first lift run in the morning, last lift run evening when someone wouldn't mind watching him for half hour)
fine on a season pas but not an option for Joe Public at £200 for a 6 day pass.
We took one of ours on a Mark Warner holiday when he was 3. He was "nannied" and had a bit of skiing whilst we bogged of skiing.. We would knock of an hour early and sledge, slide and mes about both before and after tea. yes he loved it but would have had just as much fun at home with grandparents Toofy Grin
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Frosty the Snowman wrote:
Joanne Mountainsun, agreed. Skiing is quickly becomin a luxury. You say in your post that
Quote:

I didn't get much skiing/boarding in (first lift run in the morning, last lift run evening when someone wouldn't mind watching him for half hour)
fine on a season pas but not an option for Joe Public at £200 for a 6 day pass.
We took one of ours on a Mark Warner holiday when he was 3. He was "nannied" and had a bit of skiing whilst we bogged of skiing.. We would knock of an hour early and sledge, slide and mes about both before and after tea. yes he loved it but would have had just as much fun at home with grandparents Toofy Grin


Don't have a season pass. I bought a points card, and occasionally borrowed someone elses pass while they watched Saul! I'm not saying you MUST take your children skiing ; I'm just saying if it works for you you can have a lot of fun with them in the snow and there's no reason NOT to (as lots of people have said it's selfish and you're pushing them into it and the like. Some people here seem to think that if you have a child then you can't ski for X amount of years, and I'm just pointing out that's not the case. I was back on skis and a snowboard withing two months of giving birth, and I think my boy is a lucky little devil getting to the mountains at such a young age - and I'm not being selfish, I'm not pushing him into skiing, and we do have a lot of fun together. And once he's old enough and ready I will put him in ski school, if he wants. If there's two parents (there's only one of me and I still manage it) you might have to sacrifice skiing together so much, but you can split the child bit. I'm waffling now! All I'm saying is, if you've got young kids and you want to go skiiing go! It's not selfish to put them in a creche, it's also fun to ski less and play with them - and leaving them at home with the grandparents is also an excellent idea! (I do this the other times I go!).
ski holidays
 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Joanne Mountainsun, I think what your saying is that there is no definitve or fixed answer, and I couldn't agree more. Most options have there good points Very Happy
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I see Jonny Jones' point of view and share it to a certain extent.

We took our youngest from when she was 14 months , once or twice a season. We tried creches etc but were never happy so we alternated care morning and afternoon . For about 4 seasons we never skied together but as we were in a big group that was not too bad.

Most importantly of all she was well looked after . As a dad it was fun , at times frustrating , but it meant we all ( including her sister who is 6 years older ) kept going as a family. Friends thought we were mad , and that we should have put her in a nursery .

I think whatever suits the family . For us , it was her holiday too and we were happy .

John[/b]
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alltnaha, said:
Quote:

For us , it was her holiday too and we were happy .


I agree with this too and also the spirit of what Jonny Jones is saying. I've been thinking that really it's about whether you view the skiing holiday as a family holiday. I certainly can't imagine going on a summer holiday and paying someone else to look after my children while I did something different from them. During the year, the children are at school so it is weekends and holiday times that we get to spend quality time together. We often explore and learn stuff as a family.

We took our first child when he was one skiing and we didn't use a creche; we took turns in looking after him. Looking back I can see that the reason we went skiing then was really only about me and not about anyone else. The baby didn't really get anything from it, my wife was indifferent, so the reason we went was primarily a selfish one, so that I could ski. Although we enjoyed the holiday, I think now that it may have been more sensible to wait a few years until he was older (and those years really do go quickly) and maybe to have holiday-ed as one unit instead of the pass the baby holiday we had.

I don't think you shouldn't have any time to your self it's just that the principle of arranging and paying for someone else to look after your children for the majority of the day while you are on family holiday isn't one I would opt for. Just to be clear here, I am not talking about 2 hours at children's ski school - that makes sense, they are learning to do the thing you are all there to do. And if they chose to go sledging with their mates without you, that's fine too. Ours both go to ski school for a couple of hours in the morning. But if they didn't or didn't want to, I can't see myself paying someone else so I could get my skiing in, while we're all on the holiday together.

Dad/Mum solo trips the same - if you can get G/parents to look after them and everyone is happy then why not. But the argument here I think is about those early year, bung them in the creche let them eat before the adults and basically not spoil your holiday approaches. I just don't get it.

I know plenty of parents who do holiday like that, and the Chalet holiday's often state that children eat early and then have to be in bed so the adults can enjoy themselves. Hmmm . . .

As has been said, it's just a view and I don't actually care what anyone else does so don't get all argumentative - you do it your way, we'll do it ours. That way there're more places on those Chalet holidays for you, and more places in the creche. It's a win win!!
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Frosty the Snowman, Yes, thank you! That is what I was trying to say in far too many words!
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
johnnyh, People only get argumentative when your "view" turns into some sort of judgement about parenting or selfishness. The other chap comes across like he's having a bit of a self righteous go at parents who don't share his "view" of how to deal with kids and ski hols. You seem to be slightly disapproving too at the end of your post.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Today's Guardian, in an article about living with a toddler, wrote:
There's no such thing as a vacation, it's just childcare in a different climate.
Sounds about right.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Just returned from pielette's 3rd trip to the mountains. She had her 2nd birthday over there.

First one - age 11 weeks, with grandparents in tow. Worked out ok for everyone, we managed to get some skiing done, show the grandparents why we have such a passion for the hills and give them a chance to spend some time with their grand-daughter without fussy parents telling them how to change a nappy!

Second one - self drive trip to Italy, with company called Ski2. Excellent childcare in a creche, where they took them out at least twice a day. We spent a few half days with pielette - some with plastic skis that strap onto her feet for a few runs (only about 3 runs on a very small nursery slope before she got tired - approx 30mins), or else just messing about in the snow. Kids tea was at appropriate hour, before she was exhausted, but could be just about anything you could think of (including gnocchi)

This year - Espirit holiday. Only a couple of weeks after we had escaped for a few days leaving her with Nanna and Grandad. They did a brilliant job of getting her REALLY excited about the snow, so all she wanted to get out in it - any snow related activity was fine with her. This meant that she wasn't very bothered about the creche (spends lots of time in nursery at home anyway, and hasn't quite realised the value of friends yet). They also didn't manage to get them outside as much as we thought they might (once a day or not at all). She really couldn't get enough of the numerous half days we spent with her (leaving her at creche to sleep away most of the afternoon). She seemed to love the skiing (and sitting on the chairlift), again on the tie on plastic skis, and managed about 1 hour before asking for "hot chocolate please"

We have had lots advice about skiing with kids, from experienced people who live in the mountatins the whole time -some have recommended that tiny kids aren't able to hold their weight appropriately over their skis until they are at least 5 (just look at all the tiny tots on skis who are just hanging in the back of their boots). This could risk them learning bad habits from the beginning. Mind you if you live in the hills I guess their kids will get all the time in the world to perfect their technique.

The tie on plastic skis, were just to give pielette a taster of having a pair of planks attached to her feet, rather than actually get her skiing. We have been advised that until they can fit into a rigid boot that we shouldn't let go of her. The smallest ski boot we can find is European size 26 (UK size eight). Pielette is only a size 22(UK 5), so I guess we'll be waiting til her feet grow a bit before we can post any video like Avago
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