 Poster: A snowHead
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Just back with a one pawed Dr/Mrs Doggy, who dislocated her shoulder on day one (on Le Bois if anyone is interested). I ask, not because of our unfortunate experience (although it brings it into focus) but because I have never seen so many people stretchered/helicoptered of a hill in one week in 20 odd years of skiing. Dislocated shoulders, broken shoulders, collar bones, ankles, legs thumbs. Quite incredible. Personally, I think the resort was far too crowded, I have skiied New Year in Tignes twice and in Les Arcs and Alpe D'Huez and it has never been anything like as busy, the queues alone will mean I am very unlikely to ever go back to La Plagne (that and the slowness of so many of the chair lifts).
I will now duck for cover as la Plagnes' fans respond.
Off to Mayrhofen in 3 weeks sans kids and aforementioned Mrs/Dr Doggy, but that's another thread.
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Mon 5-01-09 18:22; edited 2 times in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Ghost Dog, I've seen and heard of similar occurances elsewhere, I suspect it's down to multiple factors, I doubt any resort is inherently dangerous though
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Well, there are always people hurt, but I kept meeting people with broken limbs. I didn't meet (but his ambulance woke me up) the Ski Beat rep who (allegedly) skiied down to 1800 at about 3am with his eyes closed and hit a tree.
There did seem to be an awful lot of injuries, at airport there were walking (and not walking) wounded all over the place.
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Ghost Dog, not LP specific I think. Fast, hard, crowded pistes have inevitable consequences 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Ghost Dog, La Plagne is the most popular resort in France in terms of visitor numbers.
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I've been to La Plagne in mid-Jan. Clearly it is nowhere near as busy then and the only incident I can recall is one where a snowboarder lost control and hit a lift pylon (ouch!). I can't see how La Plagne is different to any other large resort really. If the pistes are over-busy and have a proportion of people acting like loons, then there is potential for danger, no matter which resort. Avoid busy weeks and you'll probably avoid most of these mishaps...
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I can't speak for La Plagne as I've never been there, but one unfortunate consequence of the past decade's heavy investment in high-speed, high-capacity lifts is that many pistes have become dangerously overcrowded. All those 'skiers' who 10 years ago were standing in a queue or riding an interminable slow lift are now actually skiing, but few resorts have added pistes to match the increased uphill capacity. It's a long time since the snow conditions on a piste frightened me, but I've had several scary moments caused by large numbers of fast-moving and out-of-control skiers on sections of relatively easy piste.
I'd love to see a table of resorts ordered by the ratio of hourly uphill capacity to kilometers of piste.
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| Ghost Dog wrote: |
Just back with a one pawed Dr/Mrs Doggy, who dislocated her shoulder on day one (on Le Bois if anyone is interested). I ask, not because of our unfortunate experience (although it brings it into focus) but because I have never seen so many people stretchered/helicoptered of a hill in one week in 20 odd years of skiing. Dislocated shoulders, broken shoulders, collar bones, ankles, legs thumbs. Quite incredible. Personally, I think the resort was far too crowded, I have skiied New Year in Tignes twice and in Les Arcs and Alpe D'Huez and it has never been anything like as busy, the queues alone will mean I am very unlikely to ever go back to La Plagne (that and the slowness of so many of the chair lifts).
I will now duck for cover as la Plagnes' fans respond.
Off to Mayrhofen in 3 weeks sans kids and aforementioned Mrs/Dr Doggy, but that's another thread. |
Interesting point. My m-in-law suffered a fractured upper humerus last time we were there (whilst standing at the edge of a blue run minding her own business). My wife had her head sliced open a few years before that. I`m sure there`s a rational explanation but...we now go elsewhere.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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went there last year, would pass a landed helicopter 2 or 3 times a day picking up some poor soul. could be a scam to get a free copter ride
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Ghost Dog, Very very good question! This New Year was noticeably busier than past ones, apparently due to lots of exposure on French TV with the re opening of the Vanoise Express.
We were sat on one of those slow lifts that you mention wondering how 'they' can go on expanding the number of beds without expanding the actual skiable area. Pistes have been widened and regraded etc but no new skiable area has been added.
Just this year there are new hotels and appartments being opened in Plagne 1800 Belle Plagne and Plagne Soleil.
Alledgedly a permission exists to expand skiing into the Biolley area but Compagnie des Alpes, who own the La Plagne lift company, do not see any profit from opening up the area. In addition I was firmly told by a Ski club rep that the French goverment has placed a moratorium on any expansion of any ski areas in France.
Therefore whilst demand increases and supply diminshes we will have crowded slopes.
I'm really looking forward to half term, perhaps the credit crunch will help.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Ghost Dog, skiing is inherently dangerous. La Plagne brings the added danger of choking on one's own vomit when confronted by the 'architecture'
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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red 27, Harsh, La Plagne is easy on the eye when compared to Les Menuires and Avoriaz.
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lets not slag off the resorts..tis a realy interesting topic and one i'd not considered.
I was in La Plagne last Jan and have only just realised how many accidents there were. Is the quote from David L re the visitor numbers... is that a fact????
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You know it makes sense.
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Ok ...Lets let the accident statistics speak for themselves, The La Plagne facts!
2007/2008 Number of Journeys 31 263 867
2007/2008 Number of Evacuations 2620
2000/2001 Number of Journeys 31 060 308
2000/2001 Number of Evacuations 2645
Figures from
http://www.presse-laplagne.com/info_detail.php?id=874&lang=en
Page 18
Last edited by You know it makes sense. on Mon 5-01-09 22:25; edited 1 time in total
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Libertine, The answer is obvious for those of us who were skiing over NY week... The busiest week of the year combined with alcohol and slick, icy, hardpack pistes can have only one result
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Poster: A snowHead
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My 2p worth: I've skied La Plagne a few times (last time was Christmas 2008), and I don't find it obviously busier, longer or shorter lift queues, or more or less dangerous than anywhere else. There are some bottlenecks, but many resorts have those, and skied with consideration they are safe (in skiing terms).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
I'd love to see a table of resorts ordered by the ratio of hourly uphill capacity to kilometers of piste.
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Yes, that would be a fascinating statistic. Sorry to hear about Mrs Doggy's shoulder - was it a collision?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Boredsurfing, I cannot get into the link which my work web washer seems to have decided is inappropriate material  ..
So what do those figures actually mean Journeys = lift journeys or visitors?
Evacuations = accidents, or those carried off the mountain??
Also, is it correct what David L, says that LP is most visited resort in france ?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Ghost Dog, Simple answer to the OP..yes, IME
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| D G Orf wrote: |
| Ghost Dog, I've seen and heard of similar occurances elsewhere, I suspect it's down to multiple factors, I doubt any resort is inherently dangerous though |
On the contrary, all resorts are inherently dangerous.
Mountains are nherently dangerous places, particularly in winter, and we should not lose sight of that.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I went to Tignes last January in a very quiet week and there were certain spots that were total mayhem e.g top of the Bellevarde (Vd'I) and the area around the top of Toviere. Both were total mayhem due to the number of skiers being deposited by the very good lift system. This year the slow 3 man Tufs lift has been replaced by a fast 6 man chair increasinfg even further the number of skiers being deposited on Toviere.
That "quiet week" persuaded me never to return to a mega resort in half term or New Year. Is LP more dangerous than its big neighbours - No. is it more dangerous than quieter neighbours e.g. La Rosiere - No.............. but in the peak weeks I would say La Rosiere was much safer and would always choose the quieter resort.
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| Libertine wrote: |
Boredsurfing, I cannot get into the link which my work web washer seems to have decided is inappropriate material ..
So what do those figures actually mean Journeys = lift journeys or visitors?
Evacuations = accidents, or those carried off the mountain??
Also, is it correct what David L, says that LP is most visited resort in france ? |
Try this
http://www.presse-laplagne.com/info_detail.php?id=874&lang=en
Pages 17 18 19 when downloaded
Journeys I guess are ski lift journeys?
Evacuations are 'Rescues'
Interestingly the actual number of visitors is not given. I would imagine because there is no accurate way of counting the number of visitors. Even the number of skiers would be difficult given the number of season annual sports clubs schools and other types of lift pass. For example my annual pass this year will be used for a lesser number of days than last year.
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Be interesting to be able to compare the ratio of rescues/uplifts to other resorts. Are the figures for other resorts available?
Pam W, thanks, she's fine but reluctant to commit to Selva in March at the mo. She fell forwards, no idea how, I was below her looking the other way and she doesn't remember. piste had been really busy and was a bit chopped up, but when she fell there was noone else on that part of the slope. Dozy moo I say.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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A resort can be made dangerous by a large number of piste users who are not disciplined and do not respect the safety of the others as well as their own.
It is possible that some popular resorts do have more of this type of piste users than the other less popular resorts.
Also if a resort is upmarket and expensive then there may be less of the skiers going at speed beyond their own abilty.
Take the "White Ring" in Zurs/Lech as an example. Would there be many careless piste users on a circuit where parts of the ring is a skiroute (or ungroomed piste) and once skied there is no turning back. The Sella Ronda loop is another example as piste users travelling on this circuit are unlikely inexperienced to run into each other because they don't have time to do that.
Switzerland resorts are generally more hilly with less rowdy beginner skiers so some countries are safer to ski with as their natives are more respectful and careful with each other on the slopes.
The resorts with the most skiers I experienced are Merbel and La Plagne. Les Arcs, Courchevel, Val D'Isere and Les Menuires also have a lot of skiers but these places have more open wide space for dissipating the piste users. La Plagne's layout is not particularly appealing in this respect because it seems to have a lot of mole hills channeling skiers into each other and everybody seems to have to converge to either Plagne Bellecote or Plagne Centre.
May be it is just me I always spend more time and find it more relaxing in Les Arcs than La Plagnes every time I ski the Paradiski.
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| red 27 wrote: |
| Libertine, The answer is obvious for those of us who were skiing over NY week... The busiest week of the year combined with alcohol and slick, icy, hardpack pistes can have only one result |
Absolutely - I sacked it off in Les Arcs around 14:30 every afternoon, just before all the drunkards got back out on the slopes and before the 4 o'clock rush down the hill. I did head over to La Plagne (as far as Belle Plagne) one day that week and the return run (to the Vanoise) was noticeably icier than some of the pistes on this side of the link-lift.
I did see quite a lot of person to person crashes on this side of the hill - not surprising given the vast volume of people and crappy conditions really!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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We just got back from Pralo/3V/Paradiski and I dislocated my collar bone after a fall on a rock hard piste, but wasn't doing anything silly, there was no blue ice or other people involved, it was just one of those things. I did though think some of the piste overcrowding at La Plagne and Val Thorens in particular was the worst I've seen in 23 seasons skiing in the Alps, and that's even with lift passes costing £250 for the week!! Not sure what can be done...personally I would rather have busy pistes than queues for lifts because in normal conditions I can avoid the crowds by going off-piste...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Plake, yeah thats fine. i hate lift queues and can see the nobs to avoid so woud prefer the decent lifts. my argument is always that you dont ned a million kms to enjoy it. I think the credit crunch - if it continues - that peeps will go back to smaller resorts. i'm just as happy on 80km as i am on 600. A decent ski/boarder knows how to safely enjoy.
HOWEVER, the thread remains unanswered to my earlier points....
1. ARE THERE ANY STATS TO PROVE THAT VISITORS TO LP ARE THE GREATEST IN THE ALPES?
2. WHERE IS THE EVIDENCE THAT THE CASUALTIES ARE HIGER PER CENT THAT IN PREVIOUS YEARS?
That is the main purpose of the thread right?
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We've just returned from a week in the Three Valley's (staying in Le Praz). Bearing in mind we have gone there for the past 3 New Years I have to say that it was more crowded this year. One of our friends damaged their ligament on the first morning and was unable to ski for the rest of the week due to a collision with another skier (who skied off without stopping to find out what damage he had caused). This was due to the other skier going to fast on an overcrowded narrow blue run. We also saw a lot of collisions - one between two women that lead to a fight. I think there is an issue about resorts increasing bed capacity whilst not increasing piste capacity. I read that this year an Interwest development in Flaine has increases bed capacity by 30%. Where will those extra 30% of visitiors go? On the piste. Result - much more crowded pistes. I have always been a big 3V's fan (and can only go during peak weeks as I am a teacher) but will seriously consider whether to go back there after last week. Even the normally quiet slopes were busy - I'm thinking about skiing at Easter or in smaller resorts.
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You know it makes sense.
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Just returned from a week in La Plagne (stayed at Champagny en Vanoise - the easternmost resort in the Paradiski area). That end was very quite with empty pistes, and a nice mix of runs - worth a visit. Both La Plagne ande Les Arcs were reasonable, especially if you made an effort to use the Vanois express early in the day. Coming off Roche de Mio was a bit hairy a few times with the sheer number of people, of all abilities. I found the snow better in Les Arcs. Unless the pound strengthens, though, I may not be back for a while!
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FAQ
