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Why? Perfectly serious question from a non-boarder

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Snow board bindings.

I saw a post on the equipment thread where someone was asking about 'step into' bindings for a snow board so 'no more wet bums'.

It made me wonder snow boards fasten to boots the way they do.

Given the addition of a suitable hand operated lever to release the bindings (boarders don't carry poles and can't use a moveable spare leg - as someone wearing skis can to spring the first catch) why don't boarders have a simple to click into binding like a skier does? I'm sure boots could be designed with the necessary tabs front and back to operate with a similar binding system to a ski.
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Short answer - overhang and soft boots. Longer answer - various step-in bindings have been created over the years and largely died off - Salomon killed theirs at launch after shops had in the catologues etc. Problems being play in the binding, icing, sheering of bolts, lack of a universal standard etc etc.

Strapping bindings on really isn't a big deal that requires sitting down for anyone competent.
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yeah click in bindings have been done, they sucked and were killed off.
Like fatbob says, putting on bindings is not a hassle, I can do it while moving.
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Click in bindings do exist...

And I'll venture a guess that snowboard bindings are the way they are because of the way the board is controlled/used in most people's day to day boarding.
I don't think release mechanism would work (i.e. they'd constantly release) plus`imagine the width of the board if they'd have a ski like configuration..just not workable..

Slalom racers in snowboard do have fairly rigid boots and "click in/step in" bindings.. but very uncomfortable for joe average...

Burton did step in bindings but you need to buy board, binding and boots from them...expensive...
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some of the off piste monkeys reverse the straps on their bindings so the buckles are on the inside, then tie a wire between the front and rear bindings so if you get stuck in an avalanche you only have to dig out the bindings and pull the wire, then dig your board out when you're released.

For some reason I see a lot of dutch with click in bindings, I tried it years ago and it's crap, the bottom of the boot keeps icing up.


burton est with shred beds wink
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stab wrote:
some of the off piste monkeys reverse the straps on their bindings so the buckles are on the inside, then tie a wire between the front and rear bindings so if you get stuck in an avalanche you only have to dig out the bindings and pull the wire, then dig your board out when you're released.



Surely the panic strap is to eject when caught in the slide so you don't get dragged down by the board, not simply for ease of digging out. Mind you upside down in a tree well is a place where a panic strap would work well.
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stab, that's an interesting idea - especially for tree wells which I have a morbid fear of.
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It was me who asked about step in bindings - something like this -



As you see it's nothing like a clip in binding for hard boots.
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Max13biker, that's not a step-in binding. Step-ins have a base plate and various kinds of hooky systems for attaching the boots. Boots come with compatible attachments, and the binding may or may not have a highback.

They aren't popular because the base plates ice up, they give less control and responsiveness, they are less supportive and they severely restrict your choice of boots.

Bit rubbish all round, really.
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Max13biker, They are Flows, not step-ins, and you can find (endless) discussions of their merits or otherwise Smile. I have them on one board, and like them. But you don't need to sit down for either type. I know a few people who like step-ins, but not many. I don't think Drake, or Switch, make theirs any more.
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fatbob wrote:

Surely the panic strap is to eject when caught in the slide so you don't get dragged down by the board, not simply for ease of digging out. Mind you upside down in a tree well is a place where a panic strap would work well.


last thing I would want to do in a slip is wave goodbye to my board, if I saw a wall of death coming down towards me then yeah, adios board, swim forest swim.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Max13biker wrote:
It was me who asked about step in bindings - something like this -



As you see it's nothing like a clip in binding for hard boots.


high back - detach - die, in that order Laughing


Thats a flow, k2 cinch have the same kind of idea. Neither are gold.
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these guys do a different kind of step in, looks ok but for me its solving a problem that doesnt exist.

http://www.beyondsnow.com/index.htm

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 You know it makes sense.
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I'm turning into a gear geek Sad

Union contacts, 19% of the base plate touches the board, lets the board flex better. The only inovative binding besides the est stuff imo, good idea, just wish burton invented it 1st Smile

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stab, geek Very Happy
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rayscoops, sad innit Sad I have a day in early december with all the reps from atomic/nitro/burton/salomon etc, I'm sure they can't wait for me to start up with the useless info and questions. I'll be sad if I dont scam at least a pile of stickers and t shirts off them though, except salomon, french ski makers after all.
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Hmm like the panic strap idea, might have a play with it: the thought of being caught in a slide is scary enough before thinking of what the board is going to do to you.

I like those orange ones but I'm not swapping mine yet (only got ratchets 3 seasons back Embarassed )
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
best not watch sky channel 121 tonight at 10 then. Shocked
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Megamum, snowboard boots are quite soft (and therefore much nicer to do the shopping in. wink ). So if the soles of them were attached to the board (like they are to a ski), with no "wrap around/highback" stiffening, you'd have nil control. And even I, with dainty size 7 feet, and a not-very-wide snowboard, find that there's not much space between the ends of my boots and the edges of the board. Definitely not room for a binding of the ski type. In the old days lots of ordinary boarders used hard boots - ski boots, in fact. But not any more. Not having to clump round like a moonwalker is one of the main reasons for not being a skier.
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I've always used step-in bindings for soft (Shimano/Clicker) and hard boots (Fritschi/Nidecker) over the last ten years.

Removing snow from the binding and boot prior to entry is a frequent chore, but can be done standing up.

Where I find they come into their own is on some long and tiring or rodeo-fierce button/t-bar lifts, at a moments notice in the queue to the button lift, if you figure both feet in the bindings may be warranted you can simply step the back foot in.

I also have to keep up with my skier buddies, who'd simply hate continually waiting after chairs, or each time there's a flat and I need to walk (despite schussing).

My preference for step-ins may well have something to do with the fact that I'm more of an alpine carver and powder hound, than a park acrobat, trickster or half-piper. The latter may need the flexibility and foot/board contact that comes from strap bindings.

I think there's a tad of fashion in it too. If the pros don't use 'em, who'd covet or aspire to using them?
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My first board was an F2 world cup race board, bought from the UK F2 importer (Jonathan, for those that remember him from late 80s windsurfing days).

It had hard boot bindings as soft boots hadn't really been invented and certainly not even considered for going fast on a board. You had a wire loop on the front and an over centre catch on the back. The bindings worked OK but boarding in ski boots was a nightmare, due to the amount they would flex back before holding the board on an edge. My shin muscles were in bits from lifting my toes to hold a heel edge, a fact made worse because the board didn't start working until you were doing about 40mph (no exaggeration).

I could have easily thrown it in the skip outside our hotel but I brought it home and threw it in a skip outside my neighbour's house.
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the thing ive noticed a few times with step ins is that you get heel left on stiffer boards
orange bindings rock! Very Happy
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Ski bindings are a lot more convenient really aren't they. The boots are comfier too.
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paulio, bollox to the boot comment Toofy Grin
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OK, maybe not comfier. But I find them about the same, definitely, contrary to popular opinion.
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paulio, same here, except for walking about in.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Had a play with some K2 Cinch the other day and although a nice design idea, I think FLOW has that 'step-in'/strapless thing down to a tee. FLOWs just seem to have a larger entry hole to get the whole of your boot in quickly.

Saying that, I've been using Flowss for the past 18 months and am starting to see less of the benefit that I initially thought they were bringing – the ability to basically ride straight off and get secured in much quicker that with a two-strap binding. Although I like being able to get my back foot in the binding as I approach the end of the lift, allowing me to ride off in one, it's maybe not the be-all-and-end-all I thought it was.

Going to give two-straps a go again this weekend to see if I prefer them.
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Specialman,

In the whole Cinch vs Flows debate I think the rider is a massive factor, i.e. have they got the hang of their set-up.
One of my mates got flows, the other got Cinchs.
Last season, the guy with the Cinchs was always the first one up and running, quicker than the one with the flows..
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 You know it makes sense.
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Kruisler, I think you're spot on there. Knowing your gear and being confident in it plays a big part. That was one reason i switched to Flows; I didn't like my strap bindings but then again, they were cheapo ones that were definitely at the bottom end of the quality ladder.

I suppose what you've also applies to the 'step-in' Vs strap binding argument. My missus is always the last to get going (she uses Head PX5s) but she's totally not bothered about the whole speed thing, whereas me and my mate want to be razzing away as quick as poss... maybe it's a bloke thing!! Smile
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Specialman,
I really like my strap bindings... they're a cheap £70 model but solid and good looking....but I am eyeing Cinchs just because being a converted skier I like to be on my way straight off the lift..
Only boarded once with the opposite sex and that was with the wife on her 1st (and so far, last) attempt at snowboarding..So dunno if that "post-lift" rush is typically male... Toofy Grin
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Kruisler, yes it is ...
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I think step-ins benefit beginners the most - I wish I had some when I learnt to board.
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