 Poster: A snowHead
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I'm always hearing/reading about the problems folks have with their knees, would it not be a good idea to wear a knee brace/support contraption when one's knees are OK to prevent such horrible injuries occurring. Maybe it wouldn't prevent everything but my right one twinges a bit on the inside sometimes, and when finding myself on rather more challenging snow/piste than l'm used to, l'd like to be worrying less about the knee, instead concentrating on learning in a challenging way. ie when on a black run with an instructor, the knee (and it is only a slight twinge, hey at 46 one is going to have a few)is more on my mind than l'd like it to be.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Moto Xers wear full articulated braces prophylactically but these cost approx £500+ a pair. The neoprene based ones (even if with metal hinges) are not strong enough to prevent a major injury IMO but can be a psychological crutch and provide a bit of comfort. In the end with no ACL I reverted to a double wrap tubigrip so nothing special.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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No doubt an expert (eg CEM) will be along shortly, but is not the best way of avoiding injury, to work on strengthening the musculature around the knees (before going skiing)? Certainly cheaper than buying braces!
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Hurtle,
It is...but lots don't do it and do women want big quads anyway...?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| No doubt an expert (eg CEM) will be along shortly, but is not the best way of avoiding injury, to work on strengthening the musculature around the knees (before going skiing)? Certainly cheaper than buying braces! |
Up to a point. & It's true that the impact of injury can be lessened and recovery times improved if the leg is strong and in tip top condition to start with.
My injury could have/would have been prevented if I'd been skiing faster and been less of a wuss 
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clare mcbride, I too have been worried about all these tales of folks doing near permanent mischief to their knees and wondered similarly to yourself. Although I have also come to the conclusion that increased fitness and strength is probably a good idea in helping to prevent injuries hence the recent adoption of the new bike riding lark here on a regular basis.
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clare mcbride, you can strengthen the muscles as Hurtle says but you can also do static stretches to improve your flexibility and suppleness....
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clare mcbride, I wear neoprene ones with metal bracing and kneecap supports, true they will not prevent serious injury but they do stop me knees aching whist skiing leaving me to concentrate on survival. I have had the knees MRI scanned and there is not apparent reason why they ache when skiing without support. You gets what you pay for but mine do the trick for me.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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the best way to avoid popping your ACL is to GET OUT OF THE BACKSEAT
I know this from bitter personal experience 
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| clare mcbride, you can strengthen the muscles as Hurtle says but you can also do static stretches to improve your flexibility and suppleness.... |
Gosh, yes, I didn't mean to suggest one without the other (said the Pilates obsessive!)
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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pam w, Just loving that comment!!
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You know it makes sense.
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Arno, clare mcbride, isn't in the backseat.
clare mcbride, No reason why you should have a knee problem as a result of skiing unless you're pushing it to the limit like the WC guys. If you have a nag then it's worth getting it looked at to see what might be causing it. Chances are that strengthening the muscles (as already mentioned) would do the trick.
JT, Have you ever seen Jutta's legs? Incredible definition. wish I had legs like that. 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
| JT, Have you ever seen Jutta's legs? Incredible definition. wish I had legs like that. |
Easiski, I know her pins got a few admiring glances from my three men when she turned up to open the shop in a very short pair of shorts.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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easiski, wasn't aimed specifically at clare mcbride - as a general point if you get in the back seat your knees are much more vulnerable
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Arno wrote: |
the best way to avoid popping your ACL is to GET OUT OF THE BACKSEAT
I know this from bitter personal experience |
Thumbs Up....
Read vermont knee safety website and/or watch the video... practice the stuff they suggest... Much less risk
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I've seen Jutta's legs too - fantastic. By "taking it easy", by the way, I don't mean permanently pottering around. But if I have a hard day (usually because I'm skiing with my kids) then the next day I do take it easy, and my knees do feel it. Not when I'm skiing, but afterwards - they get a bit puffy and sore, and that's the signal to take it easy till any swelling subsides. I used to wear neoprene supports but I don't any more. I do work on the muscles, though not with great fanaticism.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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pam w,
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Not when I'm skiing, but afterwards
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Me too. I've always put that down to an old injury. Maybe it's just old age.
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Fact having strong quads, glutes and abductors will help reduce injury
Fact neoprene braces will do little to reduce risk of injury other than to warm the area and reduce the "fear " of an injury they also encourage the user to become relient on them
working on glutes and piriformis strengthening, abductor strengthening and quad and VMO strenthening along with loads of stretching for the claves hamstrings and TFL
unless there is significant injury then doing these should keep everything stable and strong
for quads and glutes try standing feet about 6-8" apart concentrate on centre of knee over second toe and do very slow squats only as low as knees just past toes when looking down....do 15 every day for a week, then using something for balance [a desk or chair] do the same thing on one leg, concentrate on knee over second toe 10 each side ...do all these ultra slow on both the down and up for other stuff go to that hidden page www.solutions4feet.com/cp7.php
good luck
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CEM, my physio says biggest error in squats is not moving butt back first (so using wrong muscles or wrong sequencing of same - I forget which).... he spends quite a bit of time teaching proper movement orders.... but then one of his specialty areas is back rehab and another is sports physio - so he also spends much time with ultrasounds teaching people to isolate and activate correct muscles....
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I occasionally use the Power Plate thingy for holding squats: if you make sure you target the correct muscles, it certainly feels as though it's doing something meaningful. I also use the Power Plate for doing a few hamstring and calf stretches, it's really good. Any views out there on Power Plate?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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CEM,
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they also encourage the user to become relient on them
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Ah, I wondered that.
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| I occasionally use the Power Plate thingy for holding squats: if you make sure you target the correct muscles, it certainly feels as though it's doing something meaningful. I also use the Power Plate for doing a few hamstring and calf stretches, it's really good. Any views out there on Power Plate? |
i feel like my brain is rattling around inside my skull when i stand on one
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hurtle, I have always had trouble with squats.... the gym always refused to let me do them as I could not get the movement to work properly...When the physio had me do them he warned I would be sore for a while.... Never was... seems that is not one of my weaker areas - except the ankle issues... I cannot feel just body weight squats- and I'm not allowed to do weights due to movement/balance issue - lunges though are a whole nother thing.... they always take time to work up to and I ALWAYS feel them(just my limit for weight and number increase).... Ditto back extensions.... last time I did a gym program they told me to do them until I stopped.. and returned -I was still going having lost count at 50... I could always do them and with any practice could carry quite large weight plates on chest .... Ask me to hop or jump a few inches - forget it - I could never manage to work out what you do to go UP...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Keep fit
Keep strong
Have good lessons
Ski safely
Ski on piste
Ski in quiet resorts
Ski within your abilities
Keep you bindings in good condition and have them set properly
Don't go skiing
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You know it makes sense.
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little tiger, CEM, yeah, that's why I find that isolating the correct muscles, and just holding the position (without moving up and down) on the Power Plate - and maybe lifting some weights at the same time - seems to work so well. That does indeed burn! 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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CEM, I would find that hard to move butt back initially and then keep back straight( it feels like it has a slight forward angle when kept straight) if I had a ball behind me... Physio uses balls a LOT (Hence why they are called 'physio balls' I guess  ) but not for squats that I've seen ..... For bridges and hamstring thingies(same as bridge but pull feet in instead of hold hips) he uses ball...
He and I watched his folks in the gym doing them.... I guess he had 20 people in the rehab gym and we saw about 5-6 doing squats while we were there(we were doing some 'tests' and stuff) none with ball.... As I said he is very focused on good movement then add weights to good movements only... but as I said his practice type means he sees many folks like footballers who are strong - with poor core activation and consequent back pain and many folks post back surgery...
Re burns - yes if I do wall sits they "burn" - I have done them regularly and got to >1.5mins on 1 leg - but I never feel that when doing his squats(body weight)...
Oh also he won't push for range until movement sequence is very 'clean'... He puts bench seat behind you and if you hit it you have gone too far
I have done the ball squats in gym - only one I was allowed to do.... not much burn for me unless I stacked the weight up a lot.... Step ups to above knee height(roughly mid thigh) were what always did me in (I used 10kg dumbells in each hand and weighed <48kg at the time)... I could alternate legs fine but was made to fatigue each leg in turn - by somewhere over 30 steps I was rubber legged - by second leg I would have to sit on floor...
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Poster: A snowHead
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JT, Have you ever seen Jutta's legs? Incredible definition. wish I had legs like that.
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easiski,  No, I must have a look next time..
but............. a generalisation is that a lot of people's knees aren't in the condition they might want to be for skiing.
and a symptom of that...IME.....is that pains in the knees can be because the ligaments are taking the strain that muscles are there for...therefore muscles not strong enough for the job...
Now, if a DR told me that there was nothing that he could find wrong after scans etc... I'd be straight off to a physio...qualified, sorted, recommended, to get a program for the legs.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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For aches in knees/back/shoulder etc I usually go to the physio first.... Then doctor if needed
Failing that the old doc I saw as a kid is good (he teaches anatomy to med students) - he is also the best 'sawbones' in the practice... I always choose him for cuts and sutures and injections as well as bone & muscle stuff....
I have a couple of friends 'rescued' by physios and have a lot of faith and good experience myself - but I do tend to hunt around for one I think is good...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Big thanks everyone for all your help and advice. l've seen a physio, had treatment and exercises which l do for a weak inside thigh/knee. BUT
l've ignored outside of thigh/knee and given no thought to stretching. Stupido or what, bit of an imbalance there. My lovely exercises which l so enjoy are prob. aggravating the soreness.
Recently had a bruise appear on site of twinge, bleeding maybe ? l bruise easily and won't panic but think now l should visit the Doc.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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clare mcbride, Always do a well rounded set of exercises even if you have a special one for rehab. Stretching is v. important for the more mature (you've got a way to go before you catch me up though!) 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Hi all this a topical conversation for me as i am giving a talk on stretching this coming weekend. The following link is a draft of a stretching routine i like to use myself with images and photos nicked from various online resources. Any and all comments welcome
Stretching Workshop Notes
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skimottaret, don't worry we won't sue for the use of images without credit
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CEM, I did say i "nicked from various sources", doesnt that count as a general disclaimer ... Your exercises are good but i really liked the Profeet sheets i got a few years ago... Over the years I have mainly collected stretches from "the anatomy of stretching" by brad walker. ever seen that book? if not you should get a copy, fantastic diagrams and explanations...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Frosty the Snowman wrote: |
Keep fit
Keep strong
Have good lessons
Ski safely
Ski on piste
Ski in quiet resorts
Ski within your abilities
Keep you bindings in good condition and have them set properly
Don't go skiing |
also ....... do not get pissed and slip on the way home after the apres
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skimottaret, i have got the brad walker book, and one called stretching anatomy by Nelson & Kokkonen, i think some of the diagrams in the walker book are marginally better but they are both great books
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