Poster: A snowHead
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Well we're just analysing patterns of UK school holidays to work out what our higher season weeks should be. Not having children I was suprised to discover yet another marvellous invention of the UK authorities. The "Standard School Year". No doubt yet another ploy to ensure that all UK families end up with a uniformly appalling "standard" of educashun.
What's most worrying for me and my mortgage is that it looks like the "standard" easter break will (apart from the Easter weekend itself) typically occur around the first two weeks of April. Oh, and all schools are recommended to take half term all at once.
Now, I hope we have a height advantage here (rare for diminutive me) being in Chamonix, but does this suggest I will need to triple or quadruple my half term prices while relaxing my "Easter" ones?
Will it further diminish Great Britains competitiveness in alpine sports (not only will we not have snow of our own, but we won't even be allowed to take our children on holiday in the winter)??
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Quote: |
but does this suggest I will need to triple or quadruple my half term prices
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Why?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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currently the english half term is staggered, i know this coz our family holiday this year fell through for this reason
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David Murdoch, Not quite sure what you are whinging at. This year the Easter and half term dates have been spread accross 6 weeks. Surely a big opportunity to triple or quadruple your prices.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Easter is almost always in April, this year an exception, so what's the problem? I don't have school age kids but aren't Easter hols normally in April anyway? I do think that the "standard school year" stinks of Gordon's control freakery. Not having staggered half terms will create one mad rush. Will hit ski schools / instructors trying to cope with one large avalanche of brit kids.
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jonm, cos I can?
waynos, I should have done my research. And recalled that I'd been whinging earlier about a ridiculously early Easter this year. Can I delete this thread now please?
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I think that that will be exactly the case next year. Half term is I believe standard across the UK (14 - 22 Feb) and Easter holidays are from something like 4th April. However if you plan ahead prices can still be manageable. For just 2 of us, my daughter and me, I've booked Zermatt for around £340 each (BA to Zurich, Swiss rail transfers and an apartment for 2) and I'll probably go to Les Deux Alpes for the first week of the Easter holiday. If prices escalated wildly I just wouldn't pay that much.
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I teach in Bradford. My wife teaches in Leeds (the two cities touch, almost seamlessly). I've lost count of the times in the last five years when our two sets of holidays were out of whack. It's infuriating. Next Christmas for instance, Leeds = 2 whole weeks while Bradford work the Monday of week 1. This reduces the holiday by three days - making our usual Christmas Ski impossible.
We accept the high prices, it comes with the territory. A commonly agreed set of holidays is a top idea IMO.
Grrr!
Chris.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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jwhiteley1 wrote: |
currently the english half term is staggered, i know this coz our family holiday this year fell through for this reason |
Next year, just about everywhere in the country has the same feb half term (16th-20th Feb).
Just take the kids out of school whatever week you want.
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We have always had a standard school year! Currently it is undergoing a few changes to equal out the terms. This year for instance in the beautiful South we are having a long weekend for Easter and the proper 2 weeks end of term hols starts a week later.
David Murdoch, a useful list of the English dates by county is here http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?p=615423#615423
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I'm sure you can - but if you can get away with it in that week, why not just make that the price all the time? Then people who have to go on holiday in that week won't feel they're being ripped off, and you'll make more money, all the time. Simple.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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jonm wrote: |
I'm sure you can - but if you can get away with it in that week, why not just make that the price all the time? Then people who have to go on holiday in that week won't feel they're being ripped off, and you'll make more money, all the time. Simple. |
Yep and supply and demand will ensure he doesn't get any bookings at all in January
No one forces anyone to go on holiday where is the rip-off?
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Maybe I should have added a smiley...
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You know it makes sense.
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boredsurfin wrote: |
We have always had a standard school year!
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Not under anything remotly approaching the normal English usage of that phrase.
Holidays have always been different across the country, although it used to be the case that they wree usually standard within a county.
But this year they have been stupidly staggered (not that it affects me any more).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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David Murdoch wrote: |
Well we're just analysing patterns of UK school holidays to work out what our higher season weeks should be. Not having children I was suprised to discover yet another marvellous invention of the UK authorities. The "Standard School Year". No doubt yet another ploy to ensure that all UK families end up with a uniformly appalling "standard" of educashun.
What's most worrying for me and my mortgage is that it looks like the "standard" easter break will (apart from the Easter weekend itself) typically occur around the first two weeks of April. Oh, and all schools are recommended to take half term all at once.
Now, I hope we have a height advantage here (rare for diminutive me) being in Chamonix, but does this suggest I will need to triple or quadruple my half term prices while relaxing my "Easter" ones? |
Looks like it - suits me though 'coz I have the Easter weekend and two weeks in early April to ski now
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Will it further diminish Great Britains competitiveness in alpine sports (not only will we not have snow of our own, |
You'll be unaware of the Scottish mountains then, the current stunning powder conditions and large dumps of snow in the western Highlands (Glencoe/Nevis) and the fact that in recent years this has happened more than once in March/April? I guess that'll be one reason why in recent years some Scottish ski areas have closed sometime in April/early May as a result of low numbers of customers rather than lack of snow!
Try substituting England for Great Britain and you might be closer to the mark!
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but we won't even be allowed to take our children on holiday in the winter)?? |
Do Xmas and the February half term fall outside winter then?
That's news to me...
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Poster: A snowHead
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roga, sorry. You are quite right. Having been brought up skiing mostly on Glenshee/Cairngorm I had merely forgotten. Turncoat. But anyone else remember the Scottish-Norwegian Ski School? In my defence though, I will ask where you could reliably host a WC downhill in Scotland... ??
For for Great Britain please substitute England.
Xmas? Yep. Definitely outside the general perception of winter going by my observation of Xmas bookings around the place this year.
Half Term? Oh good, so the entire child rearing, skiing population of the UK are all going to be accommodated at once? Marvellous. Trebles all round.
boredsurfin, thanks
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Then people who have to go on holiday in that week won't feel they're being ripped off, and you'll make more money, all the time.
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No, he'll be empty half the time.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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RobW wrote: |
Just take the kids out of school whatever week you want. |
This is the approach ruthlessly employed by Mrs Snowplough. I protested on moral grounds, very briefly, was easily rebutted and then accepted the inevitable and started monitoring the snow reports!
I wouldn't do it in exam years, but I can't see it harming the kids for a good few years yet.
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David Murdoch wrote: |
But anyone else remember the Scottish-Norwegian Ski School?
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oh yes, my first ever lesson was with them
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I am in total agreement with taking kids out of school for a week skiing ! Any suggestions for the teachers, can we be taken out of school for a week too please?
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I suggest that people without children should not be punished any further.
Make the kids stay in school during term time. If the parents take the kids out during term time, then fine the parents.
Parents, stop spoiling your kids - if you can't afford to take them skiing at half term this year, then save the money for next year. Make them appreciate it more. (or, if they are old enough, make them get a job so they can help pay for their trips)
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Last winter of being constrained by school holidays for me. The kids still want to come skiing, but the longer uni hols mean we can get better prices and empty pistes.
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Wear The Fox Hat, and while we're at it, can parents keep the little sods off my skis/board in the lift queues please.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Half terms are all over the place, especially if you consider that private schools vary their half terms enormously too.
The solution is simple; as suggested, take them out of school for the week. Does no harm and allows them and their parents a week's holiday involving hard physical exercise, exposure to foreign language (especially in Scotland) and foreign currency - to say nothing of a family holiday with Mum and Dad or variants thereof. A better week of education you'd be hard-pushed to find.
To the apartment owner - I guess if you could guarantee to fill your place every week then you could avoid the spike in prices, but you can't so we have to lump it. Sucks for us, but if you don't cover your costs, you're not going to do it are you?
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mdemon2 wrote:,
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Half terms are all over the place, especially if you consider that private schools vary their half terms enormously too.
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Our kids half term next year is 14th to 22nd February. Easter is 4th to 20th April.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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David Murdoch wrote: |
roga, sorry. You are quite right. Having been brought up skiing mostly on Glenshee/Cairngorm I had merely forgotten. Turncoat. But anyone else remember the Scottish-Norwegian Ski School? |
Yup, I do indeed - happy times!
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In my defence though, I will ask where you could reliably host a WC downhill in Scotland... ?? |
AFAIK nowhere but I think the M1 is FIS approved for slalom and giant slalom, at least BASI are allowed to run the speed test there as I recall. Reliability ios another question but then there were a few WC races cancelled this year and last as a result of inclement conditions so it can happen elsewhere too but reliability, especially early season is, and was, never Scotland's strongest hand!
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For for Great Britain please substitute England. |
Mind you, you'll get the Welsh and Northern Irish complaining they've been forgotten now as snowless nations
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Xmas? Yep. Definitely outside the general perception of winter going by my observation of Xmas bookings around the place this year. |
THis'll be why people think I'm a bit crazy heading off skiing at Xmas every year then
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Half Term? Oh good, so the entire child rearing, skiing population of the UK are all going to be accommodated at once? Marvellous. Trebles all round. |
I can see why the idea might be a trice alarming from your POV, from mine though nae hassle
Seriously though, people do and will continue to take their kids out of school during term time for ski trips, a lot of schools are easily convinced of the educational value of such trips and would rather put down such absences as authorised than unauthorised. Don't believe government hype about crack downs on this type of thing, it's all spin!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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My school sanctions 'up to' 10 school days absence per academic year, provided attendance is above 90%. I did ask if that applied to staff - but I just got the thousand yard stare
CD.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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waynos, Er Not Godon's control freakery, but an idea that has been around for some years now - so that the spring and summer term is about the same length, which helps schools to plan their work (which is teaching children). This was the first year it really impacted, as Easter was so early, and the London schools went first by breaking the spring holiday away from Easter. That was why both half-term and easter was so different with some - generally the non-London schools being off first, and the London schools off later. Yes and i got caught as I had planned on going with my sister and her kids, but our schools had completely different breaks at both easter and half-term.
From next year, as in previous years, most state schools will have the same holidays. See http://www.lga.gov.uk/lga/core/page.do?pageId=238191 You'll notice the name of Cllr Les Lawrence -not only not a Brownite, but a Tory. Sorry. Oh, and the nasty teachers and councillors who decide these things, strangely don't put the needs of the minority of families who ski, or the even smaller number of people's whose livelihoods depend on these families, at the top of their priorities when making these terrible decisions. I bet they really worry about this David.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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SuburbanSkier wrote:,
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...strangely don't put the needs of the minority of families who ski, or the even smaller number of people's whose livelihoods depend on these families, at the top of their priorities when making these terrible decisions...
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Yes a minority will not ski, but it will not be a minority who go on holiday at those times - a red light to the holiday companies to bump up the costs of holidays on those dates. Then you have the added problem of everyone with kids wanting to take the same days off work. Not good.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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SuburbanSkier, and your issue with skiing is...?
P.S. "were", not "was" - perhaps you'd have benefited from the standard school year yourself?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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There are good reasons educational reasons for fixing the Easter/spring break rather than letting it follow the moveable feast. Living in London there is a huge amount of cross-LEA school enrolments, so staggering holidays, including Feb half term, would cause many families a lot of grief, as my link to the BBC News item showed. There might be an argument for splitting half terms on a regional basis as the French do (it would minimise the disruption to families in terms of having siblings in different holiday patterns), but speaking cynically the tour operators and independent chalet owners would more than likely take the opportunity to jack up their prices for all the holiday weeks, rather than equalising them down slightly. I think the law of "captive market" rather than "supply & demand" would prevail
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David Murdoch, This year is a one-off, as the London authorities went for the standard school year before the rest of England, coupled with this being the year that Easter is so early. As you see from the LGA web-site, the rest of England has now agreed to go for the standard school year, and in future if Easter is very early, the whole of England will have a spring holiday after Easter, as London did this year.
Yes I benefited this year, with my kids and their friends being in a London state school we got a fantastic deal for our half-term which we won't be able to replicate next year. However I lost out on not going with my sister and the cousins being together. But this is the first year I've not been in April, and I expect to go back to the cheaper deals, better weather, genearly better snow, less crowded slopes, and shopping bargains of the April ski holiday.
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SuburbanSkier, rob@rar, after reading some posts here (and being reminded that Easter is usually around where the standard school year is placing the Easter break I am much relieved and can see the benefits - not least that of moving away from a pseudo-Christian (what were the Christians anyway? and what do lions eat these days now the Christians have all disappeared?) moving festival.
I would much rather be full most of the time at lower rates than only full at high season at a jacked up rate though.
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