 Poster: A snowHead
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Following the interest shown by those that have contacted me and any others that might be interested in race training. We are now going to run a race camp in Les Arcs from the 30 March - 5 April 2008. This will be open to anyone of at least 'White Gold' Flesche (GS) / Chamois (Sl) standard'. There will be two groups, one for under 15 years and one for adults. If you are interested in joining us, PM me for further details.
This is a trail event for this season to see how things can be developed in the future. We must cover the costs but do not intend to make any profit from this activitiy. Accounts will be available for all those that take part to look at afterwards if they are interested in seeing how the money was spent!!
If you fancy giving it a try then please do get in touch, places are limited so hurry!!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Silver, Vermeille (Sp?) and Gold I understand. White Gold?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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snowcrazy, great idea but i am already committed to the following week so cant make it this year but would be interested in a session next year... please put me on any mailing lists you may have... scott@skimottaret.com
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Aaargh, have just booked off from work the week of the 22nd, and my boss has taken the following week so I can't change it  Out of interest and for future reference, what standard is "Gold" in terms of FIS/BASS/dry slope points?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Not able to make those dates unfortunately, but very keen for next season. Sorry!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Hi snowball I tried to email you just now and got a bonced message is something wrong with your email addy. White gold is Vermeille thats what the basic translation is for the simple folk like me, the french have two golds. White gold and real gold, never understood why.
To get white gold you have to be able to get down the cousre within 26% of the winners time (I think) so quite fast. If any expert on French conversion wants to put the exact figure please do so, I am adding this from memory.
Hope to see some of you in les Arcs soon even if not for racing. All being well this will happen again next season so keep an eye on the threads here.
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Hey Snowcrazy, good luck with the course. Do you have any  going? I'd love to see a report after the training.
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snowcrazy, would have quite enjoyed that I think (especially as I've been thinking of visiting Les Arcs almost every year), but have just booked onto a course that week. Hope it goes well and you get to continue with it though.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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So, how'd the training go? Any reports? Plans for a further week next season?
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snowcrazy, I think "Or" is the highest and is within 17% of the pacesetter. Vermeil is within 30% (at least in Mottaret)
Sideshow_Bob, Not sure about conversions but Test Technique SL test is +20% for Men. I believe GrahamN worked it out that it roughly equates to around 180-190 FIS points.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I remember doing the FIS calcs for the Eurotest but not the Test Technique.
Slalom F-value is currently 610 and GS F-value is 880 (GS times tend to be more tightly spread), hence a time of +20% means an equivalent FIS point of 122, which is quite a lot lower than the equivalent Eurotest-passing FIS point of 172. Of course as I mentioned in a different thread, the FIS (or BASS) point system is a far more reliable indicator of level than both the ESF/FFS-run Chamois/Fleche 'tests' and (or so I would argue) the Euro/Test Technique tests.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Sideshow_Bob, Im not sure you have the Test Technique level right in that the +20% is not handicapped against 0 FIS points like the Eurotest but rather it is +20% against the fastest French Instructor who is typically around 50 FIS points.
assuming the pacesetters are handicapped to against a 50 FIS pointer what would you make the 20% pass in terms of rough equivalent FIS and /or BASS points?
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I thought the Test Technique was like the FFS/ESF tests where they base it on members of the French team (who are as near as damnit 0 FIS points)? Anyway, if we take it as +20% of the time of a 50 FIS point racer, the 50 FIS point racer would do a course in 1 + 50/610 = 1.08 times the fastest racer, so 20% over his time would be 1.08 * 1.2 = 30% over the time of the fastest racer, hence a FIS point of 610 * 0.3 = 182. Actually sounds far more reasonable!
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You know it makes sense.
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Sideshow_Bob, Your 182 ties up with what GrahamN worked out and as far as i know the correct way they do it. I think the openers have a penalty coefficient to bring them into line with the fastest instructor..
Someone in the know told me ... "pass times are calculated on the time of the pacesetter. The pacesetters are classified according to their final result at the last "Challenge des Moniteurs" For instance in 2007, Greg Guignier was the winner and will have a coefficient of 0, those finishing afterwards will have a higher coefficient. This is based on time difference. one of the main pacesetters in France is Gregory Guignier from ENSA, in the latest FIS list he has 53 points in SL and 56 in GS. Times therefore are not handicapped against 0FIS points.."
This formula was posted here a long time ago for Test Technique....
There are 2 forerunners. Both have start numbers between 1 and 10. If either feels they have not managed an acceptable run they can go again. The forerunners have a penalty coefficient between 97 and 102. The better the forerunner (ref FIS points) the higher the coefficient.
Slalom - between 42 and 55 gates, a 120 – 150m vertical drop. The time of the faster of the openers is used, using this formula:
Maximum admission time = best opener’s time X 1.22 X forerunner’s coefficient (between 0.97 and 1.02)
So you’re looking at somewhere around chamois de vermeil (white gold standard) as compared to the ESF open to all slalom tests.
For a woman, the opener’s time is multiplied by 100 over 95 before using the above formula.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thanks for that. I wonder if the ESF have a waiver on the test for those with the equivalent FIS points?
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Sideshow_Bob wrote: |
| Thanks for that. I wonder if the ESF have a waiver on the test for those with the equivalent FIS points? |
I vaguely recall reading that there was an exception for 80 FIS points, which seems a bit harsh given where the equivalences work out.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Sideshow_Bob, i have heard 100 for the Eurotest and 120 for TT but i think the exemption cut off changes from year to year.
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FAQ
