 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Looks fine to me! But that said, I suck
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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part two... this time it's Aspen in January this year.
This time I'm really hoping for constructive criticism/comments on what I could work on and what I'm doing well.
...and I haven't forgotten the flaming I got the last time I did this
For clues as to what I am trying to do, read the ESA Take-away thread. Mainly working on completing the old turn, good transition, and lifting the big toe to begin the new one.
Based on the posts made the last time I did this, I'd like to add this note: If you think the skiing is really bad, or a big disappointment, please post a video of yourself doing a similar exercise, so I can see how it should be done. If you don't have video, or aren't prepared to post it, then perhaps you should refrain from making derogatory comments.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Wear the fox hat, if that was aimed at me if wasn't meant to be taken the wrong way sorry man!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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anotherproblem, no, not aimed at you at all! 
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Good lol, you're better than me. I know what I'm doing wrong its just trying to get out the habits!
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Second video was very interesting, clearly lots of improvement over the years. Not quite sure what the exercise was, but on a gentle slope you'd be happy to be carving arc-arc turns without picking up too much speed. What I saw was a bit too much skidding so you weren't leaving clean tracks but more of a 'skarved' turn, although the first part of the video was better in that respect than the second part. I know you talked in another thread about narrowing your stance - I think you've gone a bit too far for my tastes, although that might well be a 'BASI thing' from me as I know they like a wide stance. Nevertheless, a wider stance would give you a more stable base of support and I hope it would enable you to go for higher edge angles.
If I was giving some tips I'd say you should work on just two things: more edge angle; and a more progressive cross-over. The check on progress would be how clean were your tracks - two pencil lines, or a bit scrubbed? Progression would be to speed up the whole process and get bigger angles so you can vary your turn radius at will. The mental trigger for increased edge angle would be up to you, but I like to think about shortening my inside leg although YMMV. I wish I knew how to convey the feeling of a progressive cross-over - I know when it feels right for me, and I know when I snatch at the turns but I'm often not able to control it that well. I try to check my tracks from time to time to see how well I'm doing on keeping the arcs clean, and that seems to help with smooth, progressive moves.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Wear The Fox Hat, 5 years later, hard to see any difference really, apart from the dodgy green boots. 
Seriously, still lacking a bit of range of movement, most of the flexion is taking place at the knee rather than balanced between the ankle, knee & hip, which is putting you in the back seat slightly.
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rob@rar, I think the ski width is pretty much bang on hip width. The knees are occasionally coming too close together, creating an 'A' frame, which in turn is not allowing the skis to be tilted to similar angles to each other.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Spyderman, I've been trying to get my feet closer together, and sometimes the knees just ended up touching.
Thanks for the comments guys, keep them coming!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Musta been the boots! Not even remotely fair to compare the Krypton video to the Technica video.
The difference between the first part and the second part of the current video seems to be in how quickly you find your edges. In the first part of the video there is more upper/lower body separation, more counter, and you find your edges more quickly.
In the second part there is a distinctive 'sit' when you find the edges and ride them out, sometimes it comes a bit late, even at the apex of the intended arc. The sit, of course, has it's counterpart lift or hop at transition.
Are you also trying to eliminate tip lead?
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Tue 12-02-08 23:59; edited 1 time in total
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If I could ski as well as the 1st one I'd be deliriously happy - to the untrained eye (mine!) it looks relaxed and enjoyable & that is my chief goal!
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You know it makes sense.
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| Spyderman wrote: |
| rob@rar, I think the ski width is pretty much bang on hip width. The knees are occasionally coming too close together, creating an 'A' frame, which in turn is not allowing the skis to be tilted to similar angles to each other. |
His 'neutral' stance is about hip width, but his legs drift together occasionally (not just A framing) and causes little bobbles where the balance moves around a bit. This causes a bit of skidding, as well as restricting the edge angle. On terrain like that I don't think that a wider stance would be a bad thing, in fact I'd say it would really help with performance. Compare with Eric Guay free skiing turns of a similar radius.
Apologies to Fox for talking about him in the third person 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Quote: |
| Musta been the boots! Not even remotely fair to compare the Krypton video to the Technica video. |
Just think how much better you'd ski if you had Red Boots. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Butterfly wrote: |
| If I could ski as well as the 1st one I'd be deliriously happy - to the untrained eye (mine!) it looks relaxed and enjoyable & that is my chief goal! |
(off topic)
Butterfly, a few years ago I posted this, and from time to time I read it to remind me...
| me wrote: |
My skiing isn't about chasing challenges and getting achievements, it's about enjoying myself. I don't care if someone skis faster than me, or "better" than me, but am I enjoying what I do? Perhaps others do it for the same reason too.
Yes, I do take lessons, in an effort to improve my skiing, but that is so that I can have more fun - perhaps that is the achievement in itself. If it is too challenging, I don't bother. I'm skiing for fun, for pleasure, not for an ego boost.
I have no problem with skiing with people who say "let's go down there" and I look at it, and go "no thanks, I'll go this way", equally, I may go some way they don't want to go. |
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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rob@rar, I think Eric Guay's feet are pretty much hip width apart also, the difference I see making the skis look wide apart is more to the height difference, due to his extreme anglulation and flexion of his inside leg. I'd say he was an 'Expert'
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Spyderman, Red Boots are all wet. Black Boots are where the nappy-free action is.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Spyderman wrote: |
| rob@rar, I think Eric Guay's feet are pretty much hip width apart also, the difference I see making the skis look wide apart is more to the height difference, due to his extreme anglulation and flexion of his inside leg. |
Possibly, I've often wondered about that point in my own skiing. I'll look a bit closer at both videos.
I would agree with your diagnosis of Guay
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| Wear The Fox Hat wrote: |
| He also wonders if, perhaps, his mind was sometimes reminding him to pull his legs together, and that was maybe throwing him a bit. |
I did think that you bobbled about a bit, on unchallenging terrain. It's only a momentary thing; as I said, your 'neutral' stance is hip width, but to my eyes (which aren't terribly experienced and you should take account of that) your range narrows from neutral, but doesn't widen.
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I see EG is using substantially different transitions than WTFH is working on. Foxy, as a suggestion, a bit further across the fall line?
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rob@rar, If you look at the Guay video again, at crossover his feet are hip width apart, as he starts to angulate his inside ski is moving vertically away from his outside ski, but the width of his stance does not change.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Wear The Fox Hat,
I thought the 1st part of the second video was a massive improvement from 2003. It did cross my mind that the legs might be regarded as too close together but I have never minded this anyway if you feel comforatble on the terrain you are skiing. The 2nd part of the 2nd video, I think is a bit lazy...which, again, nothing wrong in that, if that is what you want to do. For example, after a hard day, you might just want to waft down because you are tired... I am not sure that would be the case here otherwise you probably wouldn't have posted it... I think the skiing there is reactive rather than pro-active, so I think you need to be driving the skis with a shade more determination.
Leaving two tracks on a piste can be good...leaving them in deep snow is a big no-no in my book so an ability to switch between the two would be good.
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JT, funnily enough, the second part was towards the end of a good day's skiing, and possibly was a bit lazy. I posted it cause I thought it had a few clearer shots towards the end (where I go past the camera).
As I was skiing that run, I was looking for somewhere appropriate to stop so I could take some stills of the others in the group as they skiied past. (not that that should be an excuse!)
Here's Terry:
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| comprex wrote: |
| I see EG is using substantially different transitions than WTFH is working on. Foxy, as a suggestion, a bit further across the fall line? |
So, stay in the old turn longer?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I think there are cases where you want to stay in the turn longer... round them off and complete them but sometimes you want the opposite. In deep snow, you might want to be getting out of the turn and back into the fall-line, therefore not fighting the snow too much..
It all leads to being able to crop your turns for the purpose at that time... depending on conditions, pitch, all sorts of things.
This is why, for me, the goal, is to get beyond hard and fast rules.
Wear The Fox Hat, at the end of a hard day, that is perfectly understandable.
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JT, yes, I agree with no "hard and fast rules", in the same way that I don't believe in just "one way" to ski. In soft stuff, I'll want to spend more time in the fall line, and little going across the slope.
Thanks everyone for the comments (and attitude) so far, it makes a change from where BZK was a few months ago!
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You know it makes sense.
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Wear The Fox Hat, Even I could ski well in the conditions of the 1st bit of the clip. Groomed slopes with 3 inches of fresh powder. Looks rubbish
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Frosty the Snowman, those were the worst conditions we had all week!
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Poster: A snowHead
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what a coincedence, I just found some long forgotten video of me skiing in 1998 on 203cm Force9s!!!
I still think you look too "rigid" as if an instructor has set you up and you daren't move your upper body at all, it doesn't look like your enjoying your skiing, perhaps because you know you are being videoed......might just be me thought
Also just realised no pole plant..maybe that's why you look so rigid???
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Wed 13-02-08 11:17; edited 2 times in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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kitenski, well, get it up here!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Okay here is my novice suggestion (prepare the flame throwers): Although it all looks very smooth, it looks too rigid in the upper boddy. A bit more movement eg bringing the outside arm around in the turn to do a pole flick/plant, could well help you finish the turn (as mentioned above) more thoroughly. It would also assist in giving your skking a more fluid appearance.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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bah clicked wrong button
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Wed 13-02-08 11:59; edited 1 time in total
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Fox,
Big improvement from 2003 to 2008.
Can see your inside hand drops as you pole plant sometimes causing your upper body to twist.
Rather than thinking about how far your feet are apart just concentrate on your edges. Imagine you are standing still and the piste is moving underneath you, you are merely switching 2 sets of edges that are a (fairly) constant distance apart.
In comparison to you EG uses a lot more flexing of the legs (esp the inside one). I suspect your stance/feet width problem might be because you are not so comfortable on getting your legs out from under you while the ski is on edge.
Exercises that might help
a) Flexing as much as possible and getting high edge angles until you fall over into the turn. Try again but increase the speed so that the centrafugal force holds you up through the turn. This helps you to test the limits of whats possible.
b) Work up to one legged turns on the inside leg only, start with most of the weight on the inside ski to begin with until you can do it without the outside leg on the snow. Try not to lock the inside leg out stiff all the time though. See how far you can get the ski out from under you.
c) Rather than standing stiff on th skis imagine you are standing on a truck bed as it goes through a series of small accerleration and deceleration phases - your body compensates accordingly from the core staying forward in the accerleration phase. Your body mass needs to continue down the hill and not get hung up with what's happening with your feet below. Over exaggerate almost diving from one turn into the other to get a feel where the limits are.
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Wed 13-02-08 11:53; edited 1 time in total
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| Wear The Fox Hat wrote: |
So, stay in the old turn longer? |
One of the nice things about relaxing the outside leg for transitions is that one can do it -fast- without over doing it.
So an easy trick for learning it in fall line turns is to wait until gravity (not turn forces) just about lines up with the old leg support, and then fully commit.
Bingo-presto, gravity yanks ya over onto the new edges, no work at all, and a fun floaty zero-g sensation to go along with it.
There is none of that in the Guay video; EG is using the inside leg to drive himself onto his new edges.
I was taught OLR using gorilla turns and pointing down the fall line. You could probably modify your teapot exercise.
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This is a very interesting and educational post; thanks to WTFH for putting it up and all who are commenting.
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Wear The Fox Hat, I am afraid that 1. I have had (as usual) a glass or 2 too many ( ) and 2. I am struggling to find anyone with the patience to vid me for similar castigation. Hey ho. Once I do you can rip me to whatever shreds you like.
Huge improvement '03 - '07. Well done. Who on earth sold you Tecnica "racing" boots then though? I would be surprised if they helped the transition!
My €0.02 worth...and speaking purely from an aesthetic point of view (function being slave to form, naturally). If this was a "strictly come ESF" competition I'd like to see a little more:
- smoothness; more absorption of bumps, a quieter upper body (yes, I know this is a flattish slope - if it's noticeable here, them it'll be worse in bumps) and maybe a little more dynamic action. I suspect that you are concentrating hard for the purpose of being vidded?
- poling; It's worth a go, you never know you might like it! What's triggering your turns? Nothing's evident...Then again maybe this is a good thing and I'm just old fashioned.
- angulation; As has been commented above, you're skidding more than I think you want to be. I think maybe more angulation would help, =>higher edge angles, cleaner turns more g-force and more fun. Try my new favourite exercise maybe of keeping your "outside" pole tip on the ground throughout the turn.
Hope that helps, it's certainly meant in that way!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| David Murdoch wrote: |
| What's triggering your turns? Nothing's evident... |
Look closer: there's a hand and shoulder cue for almost every transition, that doesn't -quite- make it to being a pole plant.
I was actually impressed that he kept the head nicely steady through it all, no pesky tilting or nodding.
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| David Murdoch wrote: |
| I am struggling to find anyone with the patience to vid me for similar castigation. |
Anytime you want
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