 bloxy
bloxy
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This really arises from a thread in the Equipment forum.
Fox reckons:
"Expert: someone who thinks they know it all. Will only give answers, never ask questions.
Intermediate: someone who knows they don't know it all, will ask questions and give answers."
So thought I better as a question and quick 
But I really mean in a skiing sense, I think this definition is close :
"Expert Skiing
Expert skiing means being adept at handling varied terrain and different snow conditions on marked trails. The terrain may include steeps, trees, and moguls, or a combination of the three on black or double-black runs. Snow conditions might include hard pack, ice, crud, or powder, as well as groomed or un-groomed snow.
Expert skiing requires that you make quick adjustments to your speed, turn radius, and balance to maintain control at all times. The challenge for the expert skier is to ski all the terrain in the descent of the mountain.
The essence of expert skiing is to be able to comfortably handle a run with a 40-degree pitch containing dense trees or tight moguls on un-groomed snow when there is no way out on either side." (http://www.chiff.com/a/ski-expert.htm)"
As it is an American definition it refers to marked trails(meaning within the ski area boundary in American terms) so I would extend it to be any and all terrain, Backcountry (in American terms) and off piste(in European terms).
How about a simpler definition? You don't even think its' a blue, red, black or off piste; it's just a slope and you ski it in style no matter the conditions or the terrain.
So what 's your definition?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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hmm, "the ability to pull a switch 3 off a 20ft cliff.." yeah, that about sums it up for me...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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An expert is some one who knows what the right questions are to ask 
Is it as simple as someone who can adjust to any terrain adn maintain their perfect techniqe while skiing any terrain.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Able to ski any snow conditions (including breakable crust) and any slope, up to 45º (and steeper for very short pitches) with style, fluently and at a good speed. I think I'd call that my definition of an expert recreational skier.
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Sun 10-02-08 20:11; edited 1 time in total
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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This is an expert:
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Anyone with over 10,000 posts
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Nah, he's just a poser modelling ski gear. He can't even get down a blue run.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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X - an unknown quantity. Spurt - a drip under pressure.
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bloxy
bloxy
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| the_doc wrote: |
| hmm, "the ability to pull a switch 3 off a 20ft cliff.." yeah, that about sums it up for me... |
Sorry no understand the lingo.
Why would you want to turn on three pull cord light switches whist hanging off a 20ft cliff, do you ski in the dark, do you test outdoor electrical installations? Who installed the switches on the cliff and why? You raise so many questions unrelated to skiing.
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bloxy
bloxy
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| plectrum wrote: |
This is an expert:
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Is that Nik Fellows?
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bloxy
bloxy
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| snowball wrote: |
| Able to ski any snow conditions (including breakable crust) and any slope, up to 45º (and steeper for very short pitches) with style, fluently and at a good speed. I think I'd call that my definition of an expert recreational skier. |
I'd go with that.
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You know it makes sense.
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Expert: Can turn both ways.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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The original poster's definition sounds like what us Europeans (and I include Brits in that) would call an "advanced intermediate". Snowball's definition sounds closer to the mark - although we're talking about an expert all mountain skier.
I would also suggest an expert has some understanding of the skill and the environment.
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Poster: A snowHead
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An expert is somebody who skis all day and drinks all night and still gets up for the first ski bus !
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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A Ski Expert can get lost up his/her own back bottom without even thinking about it 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Spyderman wrote: |
| Expert: Can turn both ways. |
As in "Country and Western"?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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PhillipStanton, We got both types of music "Country and Western" 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Lots of possible definitions. You could say it's possible to count as an expert if you can do one thing pretty well eg expert off-piste but unable to leave clean tracks with iron-clad consistency on a blue much less a red, or 140 FIS points but can't do a switch 360, or can do a switch misty flip 900 but can't do breakable crust. Personally I'm happy to regard freestyle and slopestyle as niches, but think that a rounded piste and off-piste ability are pre-requisites.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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An expert does not need to be told how good they are or what they are meant to be able to do, they just do it!
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Since I was the cause of this thread , I think I'll add a note or three. My original comment was about "experts" on internet forums.
For me, an expert skier is one who skis the run I just found difficult, and makes it look effortless. They look like water flowing down the mountain, rather than the rock slide that I am.
I think an expert will be an expert in one very particular area, so it could be Expert downhiller, Expert GS skier, Expert Slalom skier, Expert mogul skier, Expert tree skier, Expert powder skier, Expert park skier, etc
It could be argued that an expert is someone with current relevant qualifications that back up their skills.
Then again, some people consider me an expert in my line of work, so by that concept, the definition should be: "Someone who gets paid a lot of money for knowing a bit more than others, but doing a lot less."
Could that fit for skiing?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The guy in the photo above is obviously an expert because a) his pole baskets are not sticking up in the air and b) he has a stance wider than a constipated elephant.
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You will notice I used the word "recreational" in my definition. (Perhaps I should even have said "English recreational"). Without that word I'd agree with Wear The Fox Hat. It's another can of worms.
However the chief reason to have a definition is when trying to make out if you are the right standard for a holiday group (or for a ski). In this context I have sometimes called myself an expert, but otherwise I certainly am nothing like (by a long way!).
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Someone modest enough to say they are "alright" preferably with a gallic shrug 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Not generally one for for badges or tags but for skiing, it is useful to know what one can do so the skiing can be matched.
If there is money involved for guides or Helis, then you don't need to hear
"do you think I can ski it?" because until you are doing it, you don't know how it will be. So therefrore, you should know you have the tools ....
Once you have the type of terrain covered, then the next thing is, how fast..?? that seperates groups of skiers as quickly and definitively as whether they can ski it in the 1st place.
I'll normally use 'good skier'
Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much  on Mon 11-02-08 21:39; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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| bloxy wrote: |
| the_doc wrote: |
| hmm, "the ability to pull a switch 3 off a 20ft cliff.." yeah, that about sums it up for me... |
Sorry no understand the lingo.
Why would you want to turn on three pull cord light switches whist hanging off a 20ft cliff, do you ski in the dark, do you test outdoor electrical installations? Who installed the switches on the cliff and why? You raise so many questions unrelated to skiing. |
A switch 3 is a type of a freestyle jump grandpa. Get with the times... psssh.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Timmaah, and do you know what the expression 'tongue in cheek' means? 
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Poster: A snowHead
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In view of the recent interets on safety-related devices it is possible
An expert is one who doesn't need a less experienced skier to tell him/her how to suck a helmet.
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Mon 11-02-08 15:09; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| Timmaah, and do you know what the expression 'tongue in cheek' means? |
Something to do with oral surgery?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I'm afraid we aren't allowed to put in links of that variety, Ordhan.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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an "expert" is someone who can adapt to variations in snow, terrain and equipment with ease and grace, knows they have a lot to learn and is humble about their own abilities.
An "advanced" skier looks good on most pistes but can come unstuck in ice, moguls steeps etc...
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Could the word "expert" can be interpretated in many ways.
Resorts owners like to treat their visitors as experts because many piste runs have a sign at the top saying "For experts only". That makes me thing may be the resorts owners don't really care about the details we are discussing here. If people can ski those runs repeatedly would this make them the experts to eyes of the resort owner or is it another case of "loss in translation"?
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bloxy
bloxy
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| Timmaah wrote: |
A switch 3 is a type of a freestyle jump grandpa. Get with the times... psssh. |
And what does that have to do with skiing sonny boy. Isn't Freestyle is for children who are waiting to grow into their oversized trousers so they can go and do some proper skiing? Tut.. kids today!
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> So what is an Expert?
Someone with more than 500 posts on an internet forum
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Only 'WC' and 'ex-WC' skiers are experts .. the rest of us exist in various states of (in)ability striving to attain or maintain standards set by our own personas.
Does it matter ?
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Agenterre,
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| Only 'WC' and 'ex-WC' skiers are experts |
What about the likes of Seth Morrison, Doug Combes, Patrick Vallencant, Silvain Saudan, Glen Plake? None of them were WC skiers, but they're certainly 'Experts'
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