 Poster: A snowHead
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I wasn't sure whether or not to raise this in the glossary thread but anyway...
I'm having lessons with ESF in Morzine in a couple of weeks time and I'm trying to work out which level of lesson I should join. This is one of their definitions to assess what your level is:
"I ski parallel and can side-slip down anything"
Is slide-slipping where the skis are pointing across the hill and you tilt the skis so that the bottoms are flat to the slope, edges not catching, thus slipping sideways down the slope? I remember an intructor trying to show us this once and none of us could get it and we all thought when would you want to do that anyway?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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correct
stick with it - it's a tremendously useful skill
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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That's it. It's very handy for getting down slopes on which because of steepness and/or width, or for some other reason, you don't feel comfortable turning. You can also use it for adjusting your line while skiing normally to avoid something such as a patch of mud.
There must be a knack to it, as I've always found it reasonably easy, and my skiing's never been anything to write home about. Maybe your instructor over analysed it. If you stand with your skis across the slope, as you say, and just do what comes naturally to move down the fall line without moving forwards or backwards (much), that's it.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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That's it.
As Arno says, a very usefull skill to develop.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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It's a great way to get down almost anything 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Jeraff, If you manage to blag into the ISPACSSDA you should find out...
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Thanks. Sounds like I need to join the class below that one. What I remember about it is being able to do it for a couple of inches but feeling very unbalanced and unstable.
jbob, 
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It is a great way to scrape all the powder of the narrow bits 
Seriously, it can be very useful, and it also teaches you a lot about edge control, foot movement etc.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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So in a tight difficult situation is it more efficient or just less embarrassing than removing skis and creeping down skillfully using heels'n'arris
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Jeraff, Its much safer, and more efficient, also the edge control needed for side slipping will help greatly in other aspects of your skiing.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Greatest skill ever I dont know anyone who has never used this away at some point it can advance to Brackage (Wrong Spelling) Where you go from skis across the hill to fall line and then back across the hill and so on......
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Ok,
jbob, ISPACSSDA ?
Ordhan, Brackage?
[EDIT: ah, BRAQUAGE - its in the glossary]
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| Jeraff wrote: |
Ok,
jbob, ISPACSSDA ?
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I ski parallel and can side-slip down anything
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You know it makes sense.
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I thought it was new instructor qualification. 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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jbob, 
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Ordhan wrote: |
| Greatest skill ever I dont know anyone who has never used this away at some point |
You have now! I can't do it yet and wish I could!! It's on the list of things I want to achieve this year.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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sounds like ESF classe 2
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Christopher, classe 3 requires the skill, so it'll be classe 2 to learn it I suppose.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Butterfly best of luck with it Somthing I do it at least once on the dry slope everytime I am there, great way to learn edge control aswell!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Jeraff, Brief conclusions of the ESF classes:
Debutant - First time on snow.
classe 1 - Already mastered the snowplough. Moving onto the mountain proper. By the end of the week most will be parralel turning. Mainly sticking to blue runs, by the end of the weeks some reds will have been tried.
classe 2 - can already parralel turn and is trying to improve them while learning to carve. First easy blacks will have been attempted by the end of the week.
classe 3 - Can parralel competently on most reds and can carve on easier slopes. Exploring a bit of off piste, while reds and blacks are the chosen piste difficulties.
Grand Tourisme - Virtually guiding. For very experienced skiiers who want to improve off piste and it often involves a bit of slalom.
However it varies due to ability of skiiers in the class and varies between resorts.
So going into Classe 2 you definatly need to be able to parralel turn already.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Jeraff, good one to add to the glossary...
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Bloody skiers scraping all the good snow off the piste and spoiling it for us boarders 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Said Mr Pot to Mr Kettle 
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Jeraff, I did a classe 3. Two of us were at the standard described (the other a 17 year old French lad, super friendly) and the rest, mostly middle aged women (ie far younger than me) were well below it, and not able to ski an average red run except with lots of shrieking and snowploughing. Pathetic. But I did learn quite a lot of French during the week, some of it rude....
Side slipping is great. Once you can move your weight a little forward and back you can take any trajectory you like across the slope - avoiding the nasty bits. It's rather similar to the "falling leaf" snowboarding exercise, I suppose I'm not so good at that though.....
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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It is also a handy skill to transfer to the 'hockey stop'... that sudden sideways turn to come to a halt.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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It also important as you progress to parallel skiing.
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Jeraff, if you're concerned about side slipping, potter along to a dry slope and practice. It is definitely not difficult, just a knack; as I said, if you just stand there and do what you think you should to allow the skis to slide downhill while pointing across the fall line, you'll probably find that they will. Without wishing to sound rude, you (and I) are probably side slipping on every turn and quite possibly on every traverse, but you don't notice it because you're also going forward across the mountain.
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You know it makes sense.
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As others have said it is an essential skill for all levels of skiers. You need to practice it until you can side slip directly downward, forward, or backward.
It's actually a skill that can be learnt very quickly and I suspect that the reason some people do not learn it or give up on it, is that it just seems a rather boring exercise. Persevere for half an hour and that should do it. It really is that simple and is a skill that will be very useful over the years.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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Well, I definately feel educated now. The reason I was so unsure about is that in the four times I've had lessons, it was only mentioned once. Even then we were being shown it as something to do from a standing position, certainly not while already moving, for about 5 mins and then never mentioned again.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Jeraff, sideslipping as the term is normally used is indeed something to be done from a standing start, or while moving forward (or backward) very slowly, as it's a way of losing height without moving across the slope or turning. The same technique can be employed deliberately while traversing, at high speeds if necessary, to go where you want by losing height quickly. It, or something very like it, happens accidentally when those of us who do not always carve our turns absolutely perfectly execute a turn.
Along with the snowplough and the step turn, sideslipping is likely to remain your friend for a long time. For example, steep, narrow paths are a great deal less daunting if you know that if the worst comes to the worst, you can slow down or stop with a snowplough or get along it by sideslipping without any of that tricky turning business.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
| get along it by sideslipping |
provided the path is not narrower than the length of your skis; a good time for short skis!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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richmond, what's a step turn?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Jeraff, Side slipping is definitely a useful skill. I use it when the gradient is too steep to side slip until feel comfortable to put in a turn or when it's too narrow.
You may find that you are better at side slipping one way rather than another. I'm better when I'm facing the left with my right leg being the downhill ski, rather than facing to the right of the piste. The good thing is, you can side slip facing either way, whichever you are more comfortable with.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Stewart Woodward was trying to teach me sideslipping the other week in Tignes and I must admitt that at times I found it challenging to keep going down the hill rather than across it, but did use it later in the week to good effect.
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pam w, that just adds a bit of a challenge !
As Bones and pam w have said, once you have the straight down the slope stuff sorted out, it also has the forwards and backwards diagonal variations (no...this is not another version of "Mornington Crescent"  ), which when combined form the "falling leaf" exercise. This is great for edge control and centring. The standard exercise is to slip forward a bit, then move the weight to slip diagonally backwards, so making a seried of Zs down the slope. An even better one (IMHO) is to make those changes progressive, moving from as shallow a slip as you can forwards into down and then as shallow a slip as you can backwards and so on. When you look back up the slope to check your tracks you see a seried of 'S's rather than 'Z's. Try and make the radius of the curve as constant as possible. And also try and keep the skis angled as constantly across the slope as you can. What this does is really check your edge control, and stop you making radical fore/aft balance changes. To start with you may find that the front or the back of the ski catches and twists the ski around, which means you've engaged the edge a bit too quickly and have your balance too fore or aft. Once you've got this sussed, losing or gaining height (OK losing it less fast than everyone else on the track) in a traverse is an absolute doddle - and it just feels so cool drifiting down a slope forwards and backwards with no discernable body movements.
Another cool variation is "garlands". If you're on a traversing piste (or reasonably firm off-piste), start in a traverse holding as much height as possible. The let the skis flatten gently and you'll start dropping down the slope a bit. Then increase the edge angle again and you'll start travelling again more across the slope. Repeat, so your track is a series of gentle curves, like bunting or garlands strung between lampposts.
(Admittedly it's a bit tough checking your tracks afterwards if you're practicing this on a dry slope!)
stevew, I would guess that that says you've not got your balance point in the middle of your feet, or aren't quite getting the skis right across the hill. Probably both.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| mark_s wrote: |
| richmond, what's a step turn? |
What I mean by a step turn (it's probably called something else entirely by everyone else) is sort of half a snowplough.
1. You're traversing along and wish to turn.
2. You turn (or 'step') your uphill ski to point more downhill and shift weight onto that ski.
3. You turn. Hooray!
4. As you turn, you turn (or 'step') what was the downhill ski (now rapidly becoming the uphill ski) to be parallel to what was the uphill ski (now equally rapidly becoming the downhill ski), and voila.
I use one if I wish to start from stationary with a turn or when the going gets tough. Inelegant but effective and comforting.
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FAQ
We were also taught to sidestep up the hill, move backwards and forwards sideslipping and to herring bone up as well.
