 Poster: A snowHead
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Been snowboarding maybe 5 times now in consecutive years and would classify myself as intermediate in terms of ability. However, there are two facets of snowboarding that I have complete mental blocks about. They are as follows:
(1) When I am told/become aware that I need to go absolutely flat out down any hill because the terrain in front becomes flat and to avoid grinding to a halt I need to "take speed" (as my French instructor use to call it), I start accelerating down the hill but then keep putting the anchors on rather than bombing down (convinced that I will wipe out). On the odd occasion i have managed to overcome this, I have been fine, but the mental block still remains ...
(2) While I can negotiate pretty much any terrain, whenever I have to go down one of those long narrow "roads" (for want of a better word - could anyone tell me the correct terminology?), I have a tendency to struggle to put in little turns - the technique seems to be different than that used for turns on the wider piste. The problem being that staying in the same position can become very tiring on the legs these long roads, and riding switch makes me worry that with skiers bombing down the road behind me, I'll cause a collision or get bumped off the side of the mountain.
Can anyone advise on technique or even provide some encouragement that I'll get over these????
Thanks in advance
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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for no2 how wide is your board?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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it's a wide board - I have size 11 feet so got a Burton Royale ...
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jboyd39221, I've got very similar problems. Think mine is all fear though as opposed to a mental block - this stems from breaking and dislocating my wrist in a fall while travelling on a flat road at speed so that I could get to the end without having to unstrap. 
Come on stab, spill the beans - what's the best technique???
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Stop leaning back along the board, as long as your mass passes into the hill through your lead leg you;ll be able to blast flat-out or put in those little tail slashes to govern speed. The moment your weight/mass goes into your rear leg you lose control. Practice sliding around with just one foot clipped in.
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| Dobz wrote: |
| Come on [b]stab, spill the beans - what's the best technique??? |
Use your knees to lock it straight and do very slight edge to edge turns, look dead ahead as well, not at the board. Hard for me to explain to be honest.
The reason I asked about the width is I thought it might be a wide board, this is going to slightly affect your small turns as well.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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can i just say what your going through is the normal learning curve. Practise makes perfect. soon you wont notice when you got to steam in to something.
i find letting people infront of you that your coming can help massively when you need to over take people at speed. Dont move or Bouge pas (when in france) have proved to be very usefull!. However i hate cattracks and would happily drop off the side of one rather than ride the bloody thing to the end!
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jboyd39221, agree with what snowangel. says.
Had the same thing happen to me when I first encountered a flat. All the skiers were smugly pushing themselves along with poles, while I was doing the sideways waddle, trying to puh the board h300 metres while not suffering a coronary!!
First time I break through the wall of fear, I found myself naturally checking my turns until they became fast, short 'taps' (for want of a better word) that just saw me edging along the slatness and even overtaking double-plankers. Once you do it the first time your body will remember it for the future.
Just don't worry about wiping out and if you do happen to crash, make sure you're near some fat German skier who you'll sink into because he's 99 per cent blubber and beer!! 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Fico, Ooops, perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned that
Masque, I read your "Boarding for Beginners" thread and tried to follow the "flag pole" explanation which did help but I still managed to fall a quite a few times.
stab, Keeping your knees locked sounds reasonable in theory but I don't think I'll try that as it's further to fall than when your knees are bent!
As snowangel., said, I guess it's down to practice and building my confidence again on the flat bits.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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The "roads" are called cat tracks here.
Once you get more mileage snowboarding you will learn that nothing on a mountain is actually "flat".
Eventually you will learn to change that little bit of your edges (while most of the board is flat against the slope) on every little terrain transition.
All it takes is lots of days riding.
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| Dobz wrote: |
stab, Keeping your knees locked sounds reasonable in theory but I don't think I'll try that as it's further to fall than when your knees are bent!
As snowangel., said, I guess it's down to practice and building my confidence again on the flat bits. |
no no, locked while bent, not upright. You can kind of hold the board straight, still hard for me to explain.
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You know it makes sense.
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What you are experiencing is typical for your level.
I find that always riding on a slight edge is impotant and getting really low also necessary, almost as if you can touch the sides of your boots
On the narrow tracks it is best to get as much pressure through the front foot. Driving the front knee forward. I still hate those tracks and avoid them
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Dobz, There are two 'secrets' that everyone who wants to slide a board (or slide anything) must learn Grasshopper . . . [whisper] . . . RELAX! your knees, hips and ankles & keep your head up, look out to acquire BALANCE! [/whisper].
It's not as easy done as said but if you know that's what's needed it can become a little mantra that will help take your mind away from the butt clenching fear that locks your joints and leaves your teeth on the cat-track. Balance is a little more complex as it's both a learned response and a function of environment and your ability to maintain it decreases with age and lack of use . . . trust me, unless you keep practising or have a job that makes you use your balance, it will degrade significantly . . . and if it's not that good to begin with or you're unfit . . . it's going to be hard work to rewire your brain to work in the fast moving and frequently unobserved tactile input of a hill covered with snow.
There are lots of tools to help build and/or maintain your balance reflex, I've found that the simple gel cushion (a big fake titty) I got to help with my Achilles rehab has been a great help in getting back to riding.
Without first relaxing and building base balance response, there is no trick or technique that will substitute for them and make you feel and be happy, safe and comfortable on the hill. It is a lifestyle choice to maintain yourself that will progress your riding at a good pace. Without that, riding becomes a painful chore of trying to cram a year's worth practice into a vacation week. . . that only works when you're 12 
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Poster: A snowHead
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I have over the hundred days on snow and consider myself intermediate- what your experiencing is your current level of ability versus the challange you are taking on. We all get it and its what keeps you interested. What you should do is dedicate at least one run of the day to linking as many turns per centimeter no make that millimeter travelled forward. Dont do this on a slope that is easy for you but doing it on a slope that is too difficult is pointless- you should be turning constantly and working hard at it- this is not a fun run! Its not going to help you specifically on the problems you are facing but it improves your ability and with that the challange becomes easier.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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jboyd39221, I am still aspiring to reach your level, but my son, who is quite good though not an expert, rides long flats with only his front foot in the board. He jams the second foot against the front binding, and bends down and holds the back one. It seems to work well, and his free foot is ready to start scooting when necessary. Me, I get off and walk!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Pam w - what your son is effectively doing is getting all his weight on the front of the board which stops the chance of the front of the board catching an edge or following a track in the snow. I have been practising narrow flats today and I can not emphasise enough the need for getting pressure to the front of the board and maintaining a slight edge.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Masque, I do keep myself fit, yoga, go to the gym as well as exercising at home - I have noticed though, as you say, that as you get older you need to work a bit harder at it 
I really enjoy my riding when I'm out on the piste but as jboyd39221, says, it's the mental block/fear that puts a dampner on things when I have to keep speed in order to get over a flat bit/road.
When I feel that I'm going too fast, I'll put a bit of a turn in and then find I just don't have the speed to get to the end. I'm sure my fear stems from when I broke my wrist - last day of holiday and thought I had finally sorted the flat bits, nice and relaxed and wham - still not sure what the hell happened!
Actually when I think about it, it's possible that I don't look up when I'm on the flat - again probably because of fear. Next time, I will make a conscious effort to keep looking up and not a foot in front of me!
stab, Slightly off topic, but have they got rid of that mega long drag lift in Wengen yet?
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Dobz, maybe you need to try a new board. this year i changed from an intermediate board to a advanced board and it has taken my ridin to a different level! see if you can test one.
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| Dobz wrote: |
| stab, Slightly off topic, but have they got rid of that mega long drag lift in Wengen yet? |
thankfully no, I hope they keep that until my dying day.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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snowangel., Bought my first board last year - an intermediate board. A big difference from the hired beginners boards that I've used in the past 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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this sounds very familiar, I reckon about week 4/5 I was frustrated with my mental 'brakes' coming on all the time... one day I was feeling very invincible & just thought fekk it... and pointed the nose straight down...... I crashed... no, that's a joke, yeah just sort of broke through a mental barrier... still have my intermediate Burton Air & not looking to change... maybe take some lessons this time?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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for no2 sit on your board and ride it like a sledge !
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You know it makes sense.
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Dobz, in that case just keep at it, amount of days on snow makes a huge difference.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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i disagree that is cant be done.
i'm by no means an intermeadiate boarder. the othe day having hte best pow day this season , i came back on pist and was riding along the bobbly bit inbetween two groomed piste i thought to my self, 'i must get off this before i s..........ahhhhhhhhh' i then slid 10m on my face!
sometimes things just happen and you dont really know why, lapse of concentration, wrong postitioning, thinking the wrong thing what ever it was you just gotta get up and ride out of it and try and put it behind you.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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 I can just picture it snowangel.... Look, you said
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| and was riding along the bobbly bit inbetween two groomed piste |
and I said
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| on a groomed piste, there is NO way you can catch an edge |
You can't catch the front edge on a groomed piste if you are properly going end to end in a straight line (unless, I suppose, you leaned forward so far (you'd have to be almost horizontal!) that you picked the back end of the board up and dug the top lip in!) Not possible in practical terms though...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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joe1978, I'm not trying to stay fast! I'm talking about those narrow little tracks a few feet wide when you have all manner of noodles and skiers trying to use the same bit of space. There's nowhere near enough room to do proper turns so a tail flip out, for me, works perfectly in knockin goff the necessary pace. I'm perfectly happy banging along on a flat-ish board, to be honest... a few years of boarding have blessed me with the ability to keep it in a straight line by shifting weight, so I disagree with your opening comment, but perhaps for those that struggle to retain control, what you say is right, I concur.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I'm with joe1978. Steering comes from the edges and to retain control of the board you should be on an edge, however fine. A flat board is aquaplaning and a sidewards movement could cause an edge to catch. A flat board is also slower than one on its edges (assuming that you are travelling in the line of the edge and not sliding the edge)
As for cat tracks, often the issue is to maintain momentum at a steady speed. Simply letting the board run and then scrubbing off speed by flicking the tail out is not the best option and means you are fairly limited in how you can react to the terrain or other skiers (for instance, you are always on the same edge and therefore always heading in the same direction). Even on a narrow track, the objective should be to be flicking from edge to edge with the board essentially pointing along the track (and only slightly changing direction as you flick from edge to edge). This can be done within a space of less than a metre wide and so far narrower than any track. It does not come easily for beginners but that is what you should be aiming for. If you start going too fast, the radius and cut back of your turns can increase, but when you need to keep momentum, just keep smoothly flicking, flicking, flicking... The technique is no different from properly carved wide radius turns, but you just need to be more subtle and it comes more from the feet than from movements of the upper body.
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carled, I have to disagree, riding flat on a groomed piste you can catch an edge, or perhaps we are talking about slightly different possibilities. I have found that with the board flat, the edge can follow a slight ridge in the snow and change direction and if you do align you body immediately with the line of the board it puts you off balance anthen you can fall flat on your face or @rse. As you get better you get to feel and anticipate the shifting of the board and react accordingly, and you also get to put strong flat pressure on the front foot to limit this shfting of direction, but if you are slightly leaning back or even have equal weight on each foot then you can have trouble.
I seem to remember that you are 6' 4" or something and I would bet that you have a wide stance and get your weight forward, and in that case you will probably feel that you can not fall riding flat on groomed piste. I think you are quite lucky in avoiding the perils that most of us go through on flats
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rayscoops, you may have a point... I honestly never feel like I have the slightest danger of an edge catching on fast flat bits. Whether this is due to my height (and weight!), stance or the shape of my board or whatever, I just don't know. I suppose that the point I made (badly) to some on here was that I see far too many beginner boarders travelling "sideways" to a greater or lesser degree and *that* is where the trouble lurks...
Oddly enough (and again maybe it's related) I also don't have any trouble at all with draglifts, whereas several of the boarders (even more experienced ones) in my group do.
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Tony Lane, i think you put it quite well, the narrow turns for me are more to do with rocking from edge to edge with weight transfer/leaning more than any sort of progressive carved turn, but it needs a bit of practice on a quiet flat track and takes a while to get to this stage
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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carled, yes I agree, - for me on flats I did not have the skill/ability to keep an straight narrow edge line, - I was always leaning back slightly which meant I was taking the weight away from the front of the board which effectively meant no pressure on the front of the board and that the front edges of the board would follow any track left in the snow by skiers/boarders, so I would always end up turning sideways, causing havoc, losing confidence and being more concerned about blocking people behind me rather than trying to ride. Now I really try to drive my weight through my front foot (and generally on a slight edge bias) which means I drive through any track in the snow, and if the slope increases slighly I will then rock from edge to edge.
I think due to your height, wieght, board, binding setting etc. you probably achieved a natural forward weight bias, you lucky so and so 
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I have just come back from 5 days boarding in Austria and encountered flat roads/cat tracks on several occasions. Before this trip I had 5 days snowboarding experience (last year). I was dreading those long flats because of very painful falls and a particularly vicious face plant.
By the end of this trip I was nowhere near as nervous.
My technique was the following: trying to do a lot of (carving) turns and to do that without catching an edge I was kind of "exagerating" the edge on purpose with my feet, i.e. standing a bit more on my toes or heels and as said trying to keep my weight at the front... I still fell a couple of times but on the whole it worked really well.
If I ever ended up gaining more speed than I was confortable with, I would slash the back of the board so as to be virtually perpendicular to the "road", loose the speed then start carving again..
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FAQ
joe