 Poster: A snowHead
|
I asked Elan what the edge angles were for my Wave Magics today. If anyone else is interested they posted this back:
______________________________________________________________________
All skis from regular production have 1degree on base and 2 degrees on side.
But that just go for production. Every skier than finds his own best angles
that suit his style of skiing.
______________________________________________________________________
I don't know what the rest of you think, but I read to this to include all Elan Skis regardless of model. This information may therefore be of use to others of you here as well as those of us with the Wave Magics. Their second comment is interesting and goes along with other references that I've seen on the web whilst looking for the edge angles I needed. This is that there seems to be more feelings to match edge angles to personal preferences rather than to what the skis are set at when they leave the factory.
Spyderjon you keep a list on your website don't you? If you don't have the Elan's you might like to add these in.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
Oh dear...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
| Megamum wrote: |
I don't know what the rest of you think, but I read to this to include all Elan Skis regardless of model. |
With the exception of race design skis, park and pipe skis/twintips and pure powder skis. Which is why the published materials often say 1.5 +/- .5 , 1.5 +/- .5
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
Megamum, My elan GS skis are tuned 0.5/3.... and I will probably tune my Slalom ones the same
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
I was only trying to be helpful - you know give something back.................
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
JT, Yes, likewise.
Megamum, Don't go too far down this road whilst trying to take up volume in those ski boots. Please.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
SMALLZOOKEEPER, my boots have a volume that goes up to 11. Is that any good?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Wear The Fox Hat, But why don't you just make 10 louder?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Can I raise a practical question at this point?
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
|
comprex, go for it!
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
I am NOT going to start tuning my own skis. I got an edge trick from spyderjon to whip up and down the edges if I see I've done something drastic to them to keep me going in resort until I get back to the shop at home. I thought if I found out what the edges were meant to be I could use the edge trick at the same angle as the skis were set to and thus not make things worse than before I did anything. Made sense to me at least. I thought if I posted what I had it might help someone, that's all.
When I searched the web for info about the angles before dropping Elan a line I had found references to edge angles being linked to ability - since Elan's email mentioned the same thing I thought it might be an interesting observation to post on here.
I am Not, REPEAT, I am Not, about to start servicing my own skis. I also saw no problems in trying to take up a little volume in my boots without wearing 3 pairs of socks - I am not after your jobs!!! This is me - little sweet, innocent me, who knows nothing.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
P.S. and I think you're all a bunch of wind up merchants - heaven help me in VT!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
Are we going to do "Snowhenge" tomorrow?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
|
comprex, 13"? It's supposed to be 13 feet!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
Megamum, Whilst you have so much room in your boots you will never engage edge angles correctly, that was my point. Please, gladly come and take my job, i've got a beach to visit.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Hardly original:
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
She gave me a drawing that said 13 inches. Now, whether or not she knows the difference between feet and inches is not my problem. I do what I'm told.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
Megamum, I, for one, am grateful that you have found out about those edge angles and posted it. I've failed several times to get any response from the guy we bought them from. My edge tool thing is right for the new skis - yippee.
I've been enjoying them, by the way. The first day I found them rather a handful. They are longer, stiffer and heavier than my old ones. I had to pay attention or they were tripping me up - I couldn't just cruise around without thinking about it! Now I am getting the measure of them, they're fine and just the job on this rather hardpacked snow we have at the momen. Much heavier than my old skis - have to try to get assistance to carry them, with my arthritic hands. But on the feet they're great.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
pam w, thank you. Yes, I agree when I tried mine a MK I also found them an 'education' they didn't let you get away with much - if I mis-steered they instantly went the wrong way - didn't give you a second chance to correct things. I was surprised that even with my limited skiing I noticed how stiff they were. I also ended up on my backside a couple of times in as many hours. You said 'tripping up' yes, that's exactly what it felt like. I'm glad to hear that you got the measure of them - I also think its within me after a couple of hours on a proper slope to get me skiing them rather than vice versa. I can already tell that they are more capable than anything I've skied before and not only because they are also a tad longer - I also thought I could tell that they were stiffer. All this was a bit of revelation as I didn't think I skied well enough to notice differences in skis yet, but they are definitely different to the Volkl G3's I skied last year.
I asked the chap we bought them from when I had him on the phone and even then he wouldn't be drawn on what they should be set to - his answer was that people got rather too worked up on actual settings of these things and unless you were an expert skier you wouldn't notice any difference so you may as well take whatever a shop gives you back without too much thought. Given some of threads here, you have to wonder if he had a point, esp. as it also seems (see above) that sloppy boots will also make most edge angles redundant.
I still think though that if the edge setting doesn't really matter that you could do worse than try to keep them as they were sent to you - at least you get used to something then that you can keep constant.
Oh, and chaps, I sometimes think there is a tendancy for these threads to go off the rails or be taken in the wrong way because people can sometimes try to be too 'clever'. Sometimes all a question really needs is a straight forward answer even if the responder thinks the question a little naive or laughable (or when it posted by me!)
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Megamum, I only needed to know the edge angle so I didn't mess it up. For most of us, as I understand it (courtesy of spyderjon) a low edge angle is best, not least because it lasts longer and doesn't have to be constantly fiddled around with. Like using a super sharpened pencil - you have to keep sharpening it, and it's soon gone.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
SMALLZOOKEEPER, I Know boots are important - that's why we all get told to buy these first and make sure they fit. I just didn't make the link between boots and edges and therefore understand your comment - sorry  . Friends again?
I'm afraid I've got Margo Ledbetters brain - Spinal Tap went right over my head - I looked at U tube for about 30 seconds decided I didn't understand and gave up on it. Sorry folks
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Megamum,
Didn't mean to rain on your parade as such... and if you want to give your skis an edge turn , or more pertinetly, a de-burr, then fine..swot up and try not to trash the angles etc..what ever they maybe, but if the factory has tolerances of 0.5 on users skis -as opposed to racing skis,- then there might be a reason that that tolerance isn't tighter
I think people can get too carried away with angles when they really need to master the skill set to get any sort of decent edge.
I don't mean this to mean you in particular.
|
|
|
|
|
|
brian
brian
Guest
|
I have never known about or done anything edge angley on any pair of skis I've ever owned. Maybe that's where I've been going wrong 
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
| Quote: |
| Maybe that's where I've been going wrong |
brian, I'd like to go wrong the way you go wrong!  My only concern is that as I have started waxing and sharpening my own skis (purely because I'm mean, rather than for any technical reason) I didn't want to mess up the factory angles (I knew the angles on the old skis, because spyderjon identified it for me!). I think Megamum's concern was similar. Not because we think we can tell what the hell edge angle is on the ski, but because we don't want, in our ignorance, to mess them up. Neither do I want (being mean) to have to buy another edging tool. I do low-tech ski tech work - wack on the wax, and let the snow brush it of. I know that if the snow is very cold, and/or very new, that won't work, but as that never arose last season, it wasn't an issue and I hate the mess that scraping makes, all over my nice new wooden decking!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| pam w wrote: |
| ......Neither do I want (being mean) to have to buy another edging tool..... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
|
Once you start messing around with your skis though... it's pretty easy to do the whole lot and anyhow - loads of time in the summer. Last years EOSB free lessons from Euan (just give him free Genepi) covered basic tuning, enough to keep your edges sharp and de-burred.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
Scarpa, OK, so may be easy, but is it cost effective for one set of skis a couple of times a year? Bearing in mind the cost of initial tools, wax etc. I can get a wax for £6 which everyone here agrees is good value - If I ski once it'll cost me £12 to do the skis before I go and then when I come back. Two holidays in a year would be the grand sum of £18. I reckon it would take a while to get the payback. I think so long as I learn sufficient to know when they need attention and can keep them going for the duration of a holiday that I probably don't need to worry too much more. I'm also probably not going to knacker the edges the way I ski - I suspect that basic piste snow doesn't wear the edges too quickly and for a while my little file might be enough to keep them topped enough for me to ski on them. Added to that that until I get decent boots I'm not going to do precise angles justice and my conclusion seems to be: Lob them at the experts between holidays and just have fun skiing on them I think.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
Megamum, I really don't see you filing the edges to re-establish sharpness so much as removing dings and rock burrs and hardened spots, perfectly ok on holiday, which is why I say to use the diamond stone not the file. Cost effective? Sure. If nothing else it will remove the chances of sharp splinters in your hands or gloves as you carry them.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
comprex, OK, I'll admit that confused me before and it still does now.
This little edge trick file comes and says it is complete with diamond stone - you seem to imply that it comes with two surfaces a diamond stone and a file - I had assumed that these were one and the same thing i.e. that the diamond surface was the file. I don't see two surfaces on the file or a means, maybe?, of turning the the rough surface that it comes with (which I assumes was the diamond surface) to reveal something different.
I'd appreciate clarification please.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
file - hardened metal ridged object best used to cut relatively soft metals (ones not hardened by impact) with significant material removal. Used to establish an edge angle, fast.
stone - natural stone or artificial medium with diamonds or other hard crystals set in it, can cut and remove hardened metals but can't do it fast or without wear on the medium so mostly used to remove imperfections before filing and to polish after filing, if filing is done at all.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
comprex, OK, but I've only got one tool - the edge trick that Sypderjon recommended - I'd assumed that this just had the diamond stone in it that was advertised as having. Hence I can only use a diamond stone on the skis and not a file. I suspect its my unfamiliarity with terms that folks here take for granted - when I said above:
| Quote: |
for a while my little file might be enough to keep them topped enough for me to ski on them
|
I was meaning the edge trick tool. I don't own a file if the edge trick isn't one.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Megamum, For keeping the edges sharp your tool will be great. Most of in resort ski tuning is just keeping the minor wear in check. I just run a diamond stone over mine every 2nd day and they stay fine. Skis only really need filing when they are totally blunt or in case you want to change the angles. Like you say.. any major work book them in somewhere.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
