 Poster: A snowHead
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may well have been Mark but the carpenters did do a version
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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When I go on a ski trip, I like that most of the women there like men. If I was gay, I might like to ski where there was a good chance of meeting gay men. I don't think it's about why can't they just go skiing with everybody else? Gays can and do ski among us. Gays in relationships probably just ski anywhere.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Sat on the side lines on this one so far . . .
Latchigo has the option to say what he did but it's pretty near the knuckle. I note it hasn't been moderated so it must be. I'm with marc gledhill's smiley in that I can't believe he did, in fact I burst out laughing when I first read it. Bet he doesn't do it again.
Canal Street > both the first letters regularly get 'lost'. One end of it is hardcore gay the other is pretty much straight.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| laundryman wrote: |
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| I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. |
I'm with Voltaire on this one. Besides, ridiculous or offensive views are best in the open, to be exposed for what they are. |
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I do not have a problem with homosexuals. I simply choose not to socialise with them. I would not employ one or vote for one. But, hey, that is my privilege in a free society.
Somebody wants to ban my opinions, well maybe I could claim victim status ? ( If I gave a damn)
It is hard enough trying to choose a ski resort. Will I like it ? Will there be snow ? Now I have to factor in the possibility that it will be swarming with the sorts of people I do not wish to spend a week with.
Easy enough with the Spanish costas. I don’t like the sound of Benidorm and don’t want to be with lager louts - but I always thought skiing was a fairly easy one to figure out.
As for Turing, what has he got to do with it ? OK, he was bright. So we make an exception for him ?
Turing lived in an age when people still had a sense of shame. Now we have come full circle. People engaged in what was, until the 1960s, a crime now take it upon themselves to band together and promote what they call an ‘alternative lifestyle‘. Why can’t they just slope off in private and do the dirty deed ?
Use whatever propaganda or spin you choose, I will not be changing my view.
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| Quote: |
| I do not have a problem with homosexuals. I simply choose not to socialise with them. |
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| Why can’t they just slope off in private and do the dirty deed ? |
Your comments are rife with non-sequiturs, given the premise!
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| I would not employ one or vote for one. But, hey, that is my privilege in a free society. |
In a free society that's not your privilege. The former is known as discrimination.
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Latchigo, noone has tried to ban your opinions here. Your postings (however offensive), still stand unedited on our site.
For someone who claims to choose not to socialise with homosexuals (which I fully believe), what makes you so sure of what "they" believe and promote. Where do you get these nuggets of information that you so freely use in your posts?
To justify prejudice against something on the basis that it was a crime in the sixties displays a real muddiness of thinking, as on the same basis you could justify racial discrimination, and locking up people with cerebral palsy in mental institutions.
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In my limited experience all the gay men that I have ever met have tended to be very nice, polite people not trying to promote thir sexual preferences to anyone.
The only time this seems to change is during the few "Gay" events that are organised though I guess it would also occur in "Gay Bars" but I've never been in one of those so I don't know.
In the end so long as events are publisised then people such as Latchigo, who feel uncomfortable arround such people can simply avoid them, of course there are countries where being Gay is still a serious crime, though I don't know if any of them have ski resorts, perhaps DG may know ?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I remember the very first skitrip i did to the US in 1985 . Turned up in Aspen and it just so happened to be Gay ski week. Im not Gay but it turned out to be one of the funniest ski weeks I think I have ever exeprienced.
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I've been out round Canal Street a few times, and happened to be in Whistler a few years back during Altitude, thier Gay ski week. As a straight guy I can't say I have ever had any problems with gay men (or women for that matter)
But I have to ask myself, if it's such a natural choice nowadays, why do we have to have "gay" events? We don't have "straight" weeks for people like Latchigo, do we?
-->2p, pot well and truly stirred. I may not agree with Latchigo's views, but I do think political correctness is getting out of hand
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I would not employ one or vote for one. But, hey, that is my privilege in a free society
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I'm afraid you can't say you wouldn't employ one as that is discrimination!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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why do we have to have "gay" events?
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Because every other week of the year is "straight" week.
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| Kramer wrote: |
| Because every other week of the year is "straight" week. |
No it isn't. It's an open week where all races, nationalities and orientations are welcome. Or did I miss something on the coach transfer like aveting procedure?
As has been mentioned above, you can bet your bottom dollar that there gay men and women skiing whenever you are, so why the need for special festivals? If I tried to start a "straight" week as you suggest, I'd be shot down in flames.
There's no need for special treatment for anyone. We're all human at the end of the day. Treat others as you would wish to be treated yourself?
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Latchigo wrote: |
| It is hard enough trying to choose a ski resort. Will I like it ? Will there be snow ? Now I have to factor in the possibility that it will be swarming with the sorts of people I do not wish to spend a week with. |
It is remarkably self-centred to expect the entire world to be arranged to suit your preferences. Fortunately, in a free society, there are choices available.
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| As for Turing, what has he got to do with it ? |
I wondered if you might be able to judge a person through anything other that their sexual orientation. Now I know.
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| OK, he was bright. So we make an exception for him ? |
I haven't suggested making an exception of anybody -- bright, homosexual, both or neither.
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| Turing lived in an age when people still had a sense of shame. |
Turing was open about his homosexuality; he saw nothing wrong in it. Naivety was his downfall, not shame.
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| I will not be changing my view. |
I rather thought not.
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Poster: A snowHead
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nbt, I think it was last year or possibly the previous one when Grindelwald did indeed hold a "straight week" for the first week of the season
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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No it isn't. It's an open week where all races, nationalities and orientations are welcome.
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I think that you may be generalising and applying your own admirable behaviour to the rest of the world here. It certainly has not been my experience that all races, nationalities, and orientations are welcome in most places in the world most of the time.
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There's no need for special treatment for anyone. We're all human at the end of the day. Treat others as you would wish to be treated yourself?
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I take it that you are writing this from the point of view of a minority? If everyone is so equal, when was the last time you heard about someone being kicked to death by teenage gay men solely because they were straight?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
How many of you would advocate canibalism? Why on earth not? What is wrong with chowing down on otherwise healthy people who died in a car crash?
Answer: Cultural taboos.
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Just as an aside there are very good reasons that cannibalism is taboo, mainly to do with the prevention of spread of disease.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| lbt wrote: |
| But actually you make a good point. Taboo is not a useless hinderance - it's a form of teaching. |
I suspect it's often not teaching based upon concious reasoning, but a form of natural selection. Societies that haven't had taboos against things like cannibalism and incest have tended to be at a disadvantage to those that do.
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maggi, I too have shrunk from this debate but at last I can agree with someone. What on earth has anyone's sex life got to do with anyone else??? Or skiing come to that?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I suspect that the taboo against homosexuality stems from the drive to procreate.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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From a purely mercenary perspective point of view I once taught 2 gay couples (group of 4) to ski in Lofer (Mayerhofen, Austria).
Not only we're they polite, respectful and ready to learn, they also tipped me around £250 per couple extra for the week (the list price was around £120 per head for 5 days tuition I think).
Hurrah for gays! With that money I seem to recall buying some new skis, flying a particularly attractive ex-girlfriend of mine out from Manchester for some 'fun', and getting blotto every night for two weeks!
Also, and we had endless fun laughing about this, they were so much better that straight folk to teach as they were so supple! One of them himself actually made the joke about them being better dancers and this translating into skiing ability!
Each to his own I say.
Benjj
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| benjj wrote: |
| Each to his own I say |
Normally "each to their own" ... but in this case... 
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I take it that you are writing this from the point of view of a minority? If everyone is so equal, when was the last time you heard about someone being kicked to death by teenage gay men solely because they were straight?
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People who have it in them to kick people to death are evil  and without conscience.
gay, old, black, white, aisian its irrelevent to an evil person. Men who prey on little boys are gay, but its thier evil tendences not their gay ones that forces them to cause harm.
lets not get confused here, having a prejudice don't make you a bad person i think most prejudice stems from either ignorance or as suggested earlier being brain washed by the people closest to you. All i would say to Latchigo is to talk to 10 gay people and if you don't like any of them i will hold my hands up and say you were right and everyone else are wrong. Just remember when talking to these people that who they have sex with behind closed doors is nothing to do with you just as its nothing to do with them what you get up to.
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You know it makes sense.
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We had 2 chutneys in our chalet one yr. Absolute hoot. The 2 most entertaining, fun, and genuine blokes you could wish to meet. They were genuinly camp, but waht was really endearing was the way they poked fun at themselves. Would share with them again at the drop of a hat.
What really p****s me off is modern day PC attitude, if a minority group can poke fun at themselves, then why cant we, as long as it is done in a friendly manner. Pakistanis call themselves Paki's, Blacks-niggers, Gay-queens etc.
Had a bad dream recently, ...... I had been arrested for slapping a fat, old, black, gay, muslim, travelling fox.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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My sentiments there exactly Frosty. Touche!
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Frosty the Snowman wrote: |
| as long as it is done in a friendly manner. |
that is the key - calling an overweight friend "fat" is fine if you know that they do not mind and will take it as friendly banter. Others can take deep offence from the same comment. This makes it difficult when you are talking about groups of people rather than individuals that you know well.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Tony Lane, exactly...............it also not just the case of the person finding the remark offensive, it's people around who also here the comment/remark, i can't remember the exact details (  ) but there was a case recently where one bloke shouted "oi nigger" (or something like that involving the word "nigger") to another bloke down the street. The other person didn't find it offensive as they were from the same ethnic background and understood the meaning, BUT..........2 police officers walking down the road found the comments unacceptable and inappropriate and promptly arrested or cautioned the man.
You have to be very careful of the setting and the people around when you make "non-pc" comments as well!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
What really p****s me off is modern day PC attitude, if a minority group can poke fun at themselves, then why cant we, as long as it is done in a friendly manner. Pakistanis call themselves Paki's, Blacks-niggers, Gay-queens etc.
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For exactly the same reason that one person having a laugh at themselves is good fun all round, but if everyone else joined in then it could quickly become upsetting and intimidating. The connotations of a black person using the word nigger for themselves are completely different from those of a white person using the word about black people, because of it's associations with slavery. The same with "Paki", it's never been used by white people as a term of affection, always as a term of abuse, and so because of it's history it will always be offensive when used by a white person.
When you say that it's ok as long as it's done in a friendly manner, you really are missing the point, it doesn't matter how you mean it, it's how it is taken by the person receiving it, and also by others witnessing it.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Its amazing how everyone is becoming more PC at the same time that violent crime and BNP meberships are on the up. Maybe we should go back to the days where nobody intergrated, or are we? with gay week, MOBO's and the BNP.
Lets all have a big fight to clear the air and we will shake hands afterwards.
By the way im a non violent person so i will watch.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Frosty the Snowman wrote: |
What really p****s me off is modern day PC attitude, if a minority group can poke fun at themselves, then why cant we, as long as it is done in a friendly manner. Pakistanis call themselves Paki's, Blacks-niggers, Gay-queens etc.
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In my experience people using terms like Paki and Nigger about themselves often reflects their feeling that they have to be "good sports" and "be able to laugh at themselves" to fit in with the attitudes of the white people they are with, though they are actually very uncomfortable about it. (I'm not saying this was the case with you)
As someone else said, a minority using an insulting term with each other is quite different. It captures the term and turns it around (as with the "Rats" of Tobruk (Sp?))
And incidentally, I've never heard the term PC used except by someone wanting to denigrate an attitude by calling it PC.
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Well said snowball. It's mostly just good manners.
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I do not normally wish to stray far from skiing on a skiing forum, but I wish to comment on some of the matters raised in this thread.
If 'political correctness' bothers you please don't read on, I will try and explain why I find some of the opinions expressed here troubling and offensive.
Yesterday this thread was directly next to the thread snowball posted with the disturbing pictures his father had taken at Belsen. How many people would have thought that antisemetic jokes were appropriate on that thread?
Most people will be aware that as well as Jewish people the Nazis thought to exterminate other undesirables including homosexuals. If one reads the books of amongst others Primo Levi it is obvious that many of the concentration camp staff were not intrinsically evil or even bad people. It is the prejudices that they carry though that allow evil to happen. When a group of people are depersonalised by grouping them together and attributing offensive behaviour to them it becomes easier to go 'queer bashing' or 'paki bashing' It is this that is so insidious about prejudice not the 'badness' of the person carrying the prejudice. Racially and homophobic motivated asaults and murders are still happening in our communities
Next we are exhorted to have a laugh at names like 'Paki'. Surely just a dimunitive of Pakistani? As was pointed out this term has been used as a generic term of offense agianst anyone from the Indian subcontinent.
I would suggest if you have heard the word used between the words F***ing B*****d and had at the same time been spat at, assaulted or had excrement put through your letter box you too might have a sense of humour failure. If you wish to distance yourself from such behaviour I would of thought that a starting point is to consider the language you use; if this is political correctness I for one will applaud it.
If you have read to the end thank you for your time.
T Bar
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Well said T-bar.
I've had to word my postings really carefully about some of the immensely thoughtless opinions stated on this thread, so as to try not to cause offence, but I couldn't have put it anywhere nearly as eloquently as you just have.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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T Bar, Im sure there is a message or point in your words somewhere but im struggling to find it. I for one am a little tired of seeing threads that probably have good and reasonable points ruined by writers somehow managing to camouflage the point by surronding them with words only used in books nobody ever reads.
Im not suggesting that people dumb down, but i am suggesting that they, SAY IT AS IT IS!!! And not as one would suggest or that ones point would or for that matter should be portrayed????? 
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If 'political correctness' bothers you please don't read on
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Two problems as I see it with an aggressive PC attitude: 1) It encourages positive discrimination, which only makes the situation worse (AD, Tried to du8mb down a bit  ) and 2) Totally forgot what the 2nd point was, bit early in the morning! sorry about that. Another thing that bugs me, and believe me I am NOT in any way racist, Ist that you can shout at some one and make reference to their ethnicity and get 2 years in jail, whereas you can knock 7 bells out of someone of the same ethnicity as your self and get of with a slapped wrist. Sorry but where is the sense in that.
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FAQ
but I just don't like to think of a prospective employer doing this to anyone. Thinking about what 
