 Poster: A snowHead
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| plectrum wrote: |
Bode Swiller,
Well actually Bode, the fact that no-one has protected the idea means you should be still interested as if the idea was protected then i'm stuck! By the way what exactly do you do Bode?
To explain the constituent parts of my idea are commonly available, to join each part in making my idea is novel and so far unprotected and as far as im aware currently not done/manufactured/sold. |
Its a skipass holder with built-in ice axe? Or a toaster alarm-clock?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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plectrum, so what is it?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Bode Swiller,
Well there is still hope, as this product is not available in Europe and as far as I can see not patented
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plectrum, if it's already being sold outside Europe it and it isn't patented, you're up poo-poo creek ... 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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bh1, well it doesnt seem that they have patented it, and considering I was at university pitching ideas on this subject over 4 years ago prior to when this company dates its innovation .... I may be able to quickly nab that patent!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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plectrum, best approach them in the USA and carve out Europe as a territory. Either let them supply you or do it under license. If it works you'll be happy, if it fails you've not lost much. I suspect this'll considerably cut your legal bill 
Is it a ski wax / lip salve combo?
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Combined ski wax & fondue machine?
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A racletteobeanie?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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i'm really gutted, their product looks so cool, just as I imagined it! I do like Bode's territory idea though, as wrost case if I can secure Europe and leave states for this dude, all could still be rosy.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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plectrum, patents, design registration, trademarking etc all racks up and the bills don't stop coming (especially if someone challenges). If you go to a patent attourney and say "should I patent this?" what do you think he might say? It's like being on fire and asking a fireman if he thinks it would be a good idea to put the fire out. Trust me on this, you'll be in for big bills. Sometimes it is simply better to launch unprotected (unless the idea is really unique and clever). Most often people get away with it and if they don't they are normally hiding behind limited liability. Just change the product "enough" to be distinct, make it a borderline case, then you might get away with it. My main concern though would still be the distribution - at "a few Euros" each, and paying commission to reps (if they can be arsed to sell it), you'll need big sales to make it viable.
If, as you say, it's a cool product in the US you might find that some EU retailers already buy it - a growing number of distributors and retailers go to the SIA show in Las Vegas looking specifically for products not yet in Europe. A lot of US seller go to ISPO Munich as well to sell into the European market.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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boredsurfin, 
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Is it a transceiver fondue set?
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You know it makes sense.
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I get involved in the patents my company takes out. I'd go along with BS about them being costly. If the product is already available in the US, I think your patent lawyer might well consider it in the public domain, and hence not patentable - though an initial consultation to establish that should not cost much.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Bode Swiller, 
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Poster: A snowHead
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I went to bed a squillionaire and woke up a pauper !
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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what was it then?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Yeah, what is it? Give us the link to the US one as it is in the public domain.
By the way, I know someone who is trying to sell into the ski market and this year is definately been and gone as far as the buyers are concerned. There are trade fairs which you could look into as well.
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Quick pitch in/outside the ski show this week?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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daehwons, a good guess but seems too pricey for impulse buy at the lift station. If he won't tell us I think we should start inventing our own natty products. Happy to share my unique idea... Based on last season, I reckon there is a huge maket for personal snow making machinery. You'd have a very long, flexible hose hooked up to a high pressure water supply. This would be connected to your ergonomically designed back pack wherein a compressor mixes air and water before spraying perfect champagne powder out of the nozzles attached to your forehead. A kinetically driven pump would regulate the flow in order that the ejection distance and powder quantity was exactly matched to your speed. I cannot see a single drawback to this device "The Powder-o-matic TM" and all my friends have told me it's the best idea they have ever heard. So, house on the market, I'm going into full production. Investment proposals welcomed.
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Bode
I think Q's already made one of those
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Bode Swiller, I want in... I`ll give you £2.50 and a can of coke (full fat .. not diet!!) 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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mrtoastie, OK but you only get 20% for that. We need an urgent board meeting as I think I've discovered a flaw... what if it really catches on and everyone has one? Need a hose pipe management system, perhaps suspended from massive ducts running up and down the run. I'm sure we'll get round it.
kermit, no, the forehead nozzle system is unique.
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Bode Swiller.. the Hose Pipe Management System TM would also have to incorporate a Max Expelled Pow Per Square Metre gauge and safety cut off.... we don`t want any liable cases...
Four die in "Powder-o-matic TM" Avalanche Incident.. we are gonna need to cover our bases and make sure we got adequate insurance.. or if we can`t be arsed forking out the cash... a fast car...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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mrtoastie, most likely liability issue will be when hose reaches its maximum stretch point and twangs the user back up from whence he came at terminal velocity. I'm beginning to think that the water supply should be in a highly pressurised tank towed behind on a sled.
By the way... I don't like negativity in the boardroom. That's my job.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Bode Swiller wrote: |
| mrtoastie, most likely liability issue will be when hose reaches its maximum stretch point and twangs the user back up from whence he came at terminal velocity. I'm beginning to think that the water supply should be in a highly pressurised tank towed behind on a sled. |
Not sure you aren't overcomplicating this issue with the delivery sub-system. Remember the environmental mantra "Reduce re-use recycle". Now apply that to your (admittedly already excellent) idea. A small, ski-mounted, nozzle deposits just enough snow in front of each ski, and a suction collection device (Snoover TM?) picks it up again after you have skied over it, chills it a bit in transit from the back of the ski to the front, and re-deposits it in front. A bit like frozen caterpillar tracks. Does this get me on the board?
David
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DJ, No face shot, no fun. I think what you've described is commonly known as "grass skiing". At Powder-o-matic PLC we want everyone to see our customers coming (we certainly will have) as this is great advertising. You're clearly an innovator though so perhaps a junior board position until you prove yourself.
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You know it makes sense.
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Each skier does of course already carry an on board fluid storage system. If a suitable atrachment was made to it's outflow pipe (females may need an alternatice coupling) then the recycling mantra could be followed - plus of course each fresh pass of yellow powder would be an obvious indication of the system in use.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Needs some kind of dead-man's-handle emergency cut ou.
Think of the liability issues if you stop mid run to admire the run, the Powder-o-Matic keeps going...hey presto instant "tree hole" and you are the tree.
A few refinements and then it's a race to the patent office...the winner is guaranteed to be RICH!
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Poster: A snowHead
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FenlandSkier, awesome. That's it. Eureka... p*ss.
Length of run would clearly be proportionate to intake of liquids, diurectic or other. As I plan an FIS World Cup Tour we'd have to be careful what competitors can/cannot drink. Some liquids will, of course, affect the gliding properties of the skis.
Well done, think I'll go and get bladdered now.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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To assist The Big Plan Bode Swiller I think we should go in partnership with the lift companies and fit mini-bars to all chair lifts - thus guaranteeing the yellow powder supply chain.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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FenlandSkier, name your salary
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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plectrum, It is unusual for me to agree with "WhiteGold", but he has offerred the best advice. You will find people on this site will give advice freely and genuinly, however you have not helped your request. Have your house in order legally and then come back to us. You will be protected and you will get proper impartial advice from many here. Never try to sell a "pig in a bag", be open and honest and we can evaluate your idea, colour, sizing, pricing, sourcing, marketing, etc, etc, etc.
Go away sort out your idea, or arrangments with the guys in the US and get back to us. We are a family and will help, business may not be your strongest area, there are many that can advise you on that, no big deal. It may be a product that needs to be brought to the market and we can all use.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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johnnyh, It is never too late for the right product to be introduced to the stores if it is the right product. Clothes, skis and major eqipment need to be bought ahead of time as manufactures lead time. This is also to arrange new product placing in the shops creating a continual supply of "new" lines just in store keeping everything fresh. plectrum, 's idea will be placed as an impulse buy and provided the supplier has the stock will be accepted, most buying budgets have allowances for "incidentals". So you would not in principle be to late, maybe just the buyers secretary keeping her boss away from salesmen!!!!
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Roy Hockley, No worries, Roy - thanks for the advice. in progress i have found a competitor in Europe and made contact. His view is very open and we may start workign together soon. As far as states goes if I can use the product as I see fit in Europe then I would approach US company with a merger & aquisition proposition.
When I feel comfortable about speaking openinly on the web about the product and idea, I will ... again it will be a massive anticlimax because although it is damn cool and useful, one thing it isn't is technologicaly groundbreaking!
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| plectrum wrote: |
| one thing it isn't is technologicaly groundbreaking! |
So, phew, not a copy of the Powder-o-matic TM then.
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Mm I'm having similar thoughts: my idea however is to do with an innovation for those that we ski on: i.e. the very skis; to improve their sking characteristics.
I've read a fair amount about patents; and think that I can go the patent route: I have mocked upa sample on nackered old skis and it tranforms them... so I have proof of principle
The idea is integrable into conventional skis and snow boards: so the question is:
Do the large manufacturers ever buy intellectual property; or are they all of the "not invented here" school?
And indeed; if they do; any idea how deals tend to be structured (and you guessed it valued) ?
e.g. does anyone know the financial history of the derby flex for instance? A little before my time; but I gather that it was liked by all the racers; was the "must have product" and the company and the intellectual property was bought by a major manufacturer. Was it the sort of thing that Mr Derby (I presume) retired on/ bought a yacht/ bought a small island/ bought a magazine subscription with?
I seemt to have worked out the ski market is roughly 500,000 pairs sold globally per anum; which in some senses is worryingly small if you do the "£1 extra margin per pair per year; for one manufacturer who only has a small market share" type of calcualtion... And this all suposes someone out there who can sign checks thinks my idea is the "must have" innovation for the next season...
Is innovating in the ski market something ultimatley to do for fun rather than money? How much time tdo I waste pursuing it? I have been tehre before; developed some sweet technology; but was too naive intially to realise the market in question was too small to make it all worth it.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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jonnyhifi, I remember the Derbyflex because I was writing about ski equipment at the time. My recollection is that Salomon bought the patent. It was a suspension platform for binding systems and raised the boot quite a bit above the ski top surface, but racers seemed to like it.
Certainly ski companies buy patents. You've just missed the annual ispo sports trade fair in Munich, but you might find it interesting to visit next year. They have an innovations competition each year for products which have reached the market:
www.ispo-winter.com
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I think a helmet with a clip-on back protector is potentially a goose that lays golden eggs.
Just spread the rumour to the SH that safety is not optional.
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