 Poster: A snowHead
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Europe (Continent)
Want to: Alps: La Grave, Engelberg Other: Greece, Spain and Slovakia
Wana go back to: Honestly Im quite fed up with alps atm so I dont wana visit any Ive been to.
Never again: Bad Gastein (entire valley) and 3V both these represent the worst sides to the alps.... brrr.. puke
Not tempted by: French alps Ive been to quite a few places but enough is enough. No more france in the next 10 or so years.
Europe (Scandinavia)
Want to: Röldal Norway (tons of snow and good snowkite spot).
Wana go back to: Trysil Norway best sking Ive had in scandinavia.
Never again: Sälen Sweden. Sweden showing its worst side.. family mainstreaming resort... brrrr... puke
Not tempted by: Idre, Branäs, Säfsen and all other swedish family resort where veryone is supposed to be swedishly mainstream.
North America:
Want to: Jackson Hole, Kicking Horse, Riverstoke and Alaska
Wana go back to: Alta, Utah no doubt awsome and Fernie, BC (going back this winter).
Never again: Canyons, Park City and Powder Mountain Utah. Kimberly, BC
Not tempted by: Killington, Deer Valley, Vail, Aspen
Rest of the world:
Want to: Chile, Argentina, Lebanon, Japan, Killimanjaro, New Zeeland
Not tempted by: Ex Soviet states
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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TexMurphy,
Matter of interest whats wrong with Gastein valley it's one of the areas I want to visit. Was thinking of family holiday there. I'm not really a fan of 3V either.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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TexMurphy,
You going to have to get past the anti-french thing going on if you want to visit La Grave
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Of my 'must do sometime' that I haven't: Chamonix and 'Colorado'.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@T Bar
I dont like crowded places, Bad Gastein is extreamly crowded and with tons of swedish kids acting like back bottoms. Salt to wound on the crowd is that it has horrible lift logistics.
@JT
La Grave isnt really like the rest of the french places. It isnt huuuuuuge and it isnt croooooooooooooooooooowded and it aint like sking in Disneyland.
I dont have any thing against the French I do have alot against French alps. Part is that Ive been there so much that Im boored with it but part is what they are about. Its artificial villages (most not all) with tons and tons of people. Lift lines are huuuuge, people stressing everywhere... stress in the lift line, stress in the lunch line, stress in the shops, stress in the restaurants... its worse chaos then here at work...
Seeing all the charter people eating their fondeu (Spelling) and beeing towed around by wanabees in travell company uniforms and their groupies makes me sick.
I hate stress and I hate hoard mentality. The hoard mentality is why I hate the swedish resorts where the family hoards are beeing streamlined by the swedish morale police.
Sorry Im negative but going to the Alps and especially french is like going to Ibiza.
That is what Ive got against the alps and since the french resorts are the biggest and most crowded they represent this the most. But dont get me wrong Austria is just as bad in some place.
I wana kick back, ski terrain, chat with friendly people and enjoy my sking vacation.
Tex
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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TexMurphy, do you only ski in the middle of February? I ski a lot in the Tarentaise throughout the season and simply don't recognise the picture you paint.
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@ rob@rar
If you know a place in france that has sub 10 min lift lines, people are very layed back, terrain contains alot of easily accessible offpist and you can pop into nice restaurants (that arnt totally over priced and chaotic) and have a good meal then please by all means inform me.
Id love to find a gem of a resort on this side of the pond.
Tex
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TexMurphy, L2A 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| TexMurphy wrote: |
| If you know a place in france that has sub 10 min lift lines, people are very layed back, terrain contains alot of easily accessible offpist and you can pop into nice restaurants (that arnt totally over priced and chaotic) and have a good meal then please by all means inform me. |
Last season I only queued for more than 10 minutes at two separate lifts: the first funicular of the day for autumn skiing in Tignes can be a bit of a zoo, with loads of junior racers, etc. The other occasion was the first cable car out of Zinal on an unusually busy weekend. On every other trip no queues longer than 10 minutes. That includes Les Arcs, La Plagne, Tignes, Val d'Isere, La Rosiere, and Trois Vallees. I skied during early December, Christmas, January, early Feb (but avoided half-term weeks), March, and April (including Easter). In total about 50 days, and that has been the same pattern for the last three years. The one major lift bottleneck in Les Arcs, where queues can get longer than 10 minutes in off-peak times was replaced this summer.
The people I ski with are laid back 
The resorts around the Tarentaise have quite a lot of lift served off-piste Yes, some of it gets tracked out quickly, eg Espace Killy, but there is no shortage of terrain to choose from. You could try St Foy, for example.
I've had enjoyable meals, although you might have much higher standards/expectations than me.
I'm not saying that the French mega-resorts around the Tarentaise don't have disadvantages as well as advantages. But the bleak picture you paint of "huuuuuge" lines and "crooo...ooowded" Disneyland resorts with "tons and tons" of people, is completely at odds with my experience. You are, of course, perfectly entitled to your opinion about what you like and what you dislike, but a more realistic grip on reality might be helpful?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
Seeing all the charter people eating their fondeu (Spelling) and beeing towed around by wanabees in travell company uniforms and their groupies makes me sick.
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Are these the same 'charter people' who year in year out buy lift passes and spend fortunes in the resorts, all of which goes to invest in lifts and infrastructure for us all to take advantage of ? Where would we be without the 'charter crowd'?
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| masmith wrote: |
| Quote: |
Seeing all the charter people eating their fondeu (Spelling) and beeing towed around by wanabees in travell company uniforms and their groupies makes me sick.
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Are these the same 'charter people' who year in year out buy lift passes and spend fortunes in the resorts, all of which goes to invest in lifts and infrastructure for us all to take advantage of ? Where would we be without the 'charter crowd'? |
Exactly right.
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You know it makes sense.
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| TexMurphy wrote: |
@ rob@rar
If you know a place in france that has sub 10 min lift lines, people are very layed back, terrain contains alot of easily accessible offpist and you can pop into nice restaurants (that arnt totally over priced and chaotic) and have a good meal then please by all means inform me.
Id love to find a gem of a resort on this side of the pond.
Tex |
Waaaaayyyyy to easy. I must resist, I must resist, I must resist, I must resist, I must resist, I must resist 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Frosty the Snowman, Costa Del Castleford?
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brian
brian
Guest
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| The other occasion was the first cable car out of Zinal on an unusually busy weekend. |
I got caught out by that bottleneck at easter. The bizarre thing is we got up and out at the top and there was hardly anyone there. No queues at all for the rest of the day.
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brian
brian
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Frosty the Snowman, I suspect the emphasis on terrain might render your contribution less useful
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@ rob@rar
Ive skiied most of the areas you are mentioning in either late jan early feb (pre spring breaks) or march and honestly I dont have fond memories. I mean heck sking aint bad when one has luck with snow (but what resorts need more luck then others is another discussion). But still all thats left as memories aside from a few epic runs is 10euro+ lunches, lift lines, people pushing and shoving everywhere and just stress.
I mean some people like going to Ibiza, some people dont mind hanging on a beach that has 2 persons per square meter. I dont.
But I think alot boils down to what ones reference is.
My references to uncrowded is Alta Utah and Fernie BC. On weekends both are on verge of beeing classified as crowded. On weekdays they are in the sweeet cathegory.
Layed back to me is defined by words like these in a lift from a stranger... "dude you should get to curry chutes they are about to open em up now its gonna be the ride of the season"...
Food wise yes I might be quite of a snob when it comes to food but to be fair the french kitchen is over rated and in tourist areas Id rank it slightly above the traditional british kitchen. This does not apply to just the alps but gets equaly obvious when you are in the bay of biscaya and cross the border to spain. But heck as long as one ejoys a piece of well done steak with frise then french touristic areas are heavenly.
But lets be honest not many touristic areas have good food. Italy with its great food drops in quality as well when you get to touristic areas but still... mmmmm... good dining... North America gets saved by the huge veriaty of Asian and Italian food everywhere...
All in all intersting how much noice I managed to create by dissing the alps..
Tex
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| brian wrote: |
| I got caught out by that bottleneck at easter. The bizarre thing is we got up and out at the top and there was hardly anyone there. No queues at all for the rest of the day. |
Yes, that was my experience as well, although ise said that the queue for the Zinal cablecar was very unusual.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| brian wrote: |
| Frosty the Snowman, I suspect the emphasis on terrain might render your contribution less useful |
| Quote: |
| terrain contains alot of easily accessible offpist |
It seems to be popular for this as far as I am aware
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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TexMurphy, I don't have a problem with you saying that the French Alps can be very much busier than your reference resorts in Utah or BC, or that you don't like the food that a proportion of the restaurants serve, etc, but to damn an entire region with the criticisms you made is, in my experience, just factually incorrect.
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brian
brian
Guest
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TexMurphy, think you might like the anniviers although it's French speaking Switzerland rather than France.
Oh, btw, La Grave is huuuuuuuge in all the important ways
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| TexMurphy wrote: |
| All in all intersting how much noice I managed to create by dissing the alps.. |
I don't find it surprising. Can you name me any other mountain range with anything like the amount and variety of skiing, dining and après activities? It's not much wonder that lots of people find lots to appreciate.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| laundryman wrote: |
| TexMurphy wrote: |
| All in all intersting how much noice I managed to create by dissing the alps.. |
I don't find it surprising. Can you name me any other mountain range with anything like the amount and variety of skiing, dining and après activities? It's not much wonder that lots of people find lots to appreciate. |
Yes, that's right.
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| brian wrote: |
TexMurphy, think you might like the anniviers although it's French speaking Switzerland rather than France.
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Have to say that on my only visit to VdA the skiing didn't feel markedly different to the skiing I do in the Tarentaise. There was a smaller proportion of gentle terrain, and obviously it was a smaller area, but lift queues were not that different (although the choice of music was ), the restaurants were variations on a theme, there was a good mix of on and off-piste terrain available, fellow tourists were equally friendly or surly, etc. The architecture was very different, especially bits of Grimentz which looked like they were straight out of a Tim Burton movie, but for me that aspect of skiing is not so important. Quality of the skiing and quality of the company is what counts, and last season I was fortunate to have that in large doses in France as well as my one trip to Switzerland.
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brian
brian
Guest
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| rob@rar wrote: |
Have to say that on my only visit to VdA the skiing didn't feel markedly different to the skiing I do in the Tarentaise. |
No, I wouldn't think it would be, but it does meet a few of Tex's specific requirements. Anyway, I'm not supposed to be talking about this. Anniviers omerta and all that.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| laundryman wrote: |
| TexMurphy wrote: |
| All in all intersting how much noice I managed to create by dissing the alps.. |
I don't find it surprising. Can you name me any other mountain range with anything like the amount and variety of skiing, dining and après activities? It's not much wonder that lots of people find lots to appreciate. |
Well thats actually a tricky question... Id answer it like this...
There is no place in the world where you have as big ski resorts as in the alps.
There is no place where you have as connected lift systems as you have in the alps.
The dining well you have the entire range from good (italy) to bad (france) so yes your right.
The apres activities are extencive yes.
Thing is you cant compare alps with other mountain ranges the entire concept of how resorts are built is different.
Alps is about covering 90% of the skier/boarder population and doing it bigger and better then the next resort.
Canadian and US resorts are speciallized on client segments. So you dont get the veriaty at one resort but you hopefully (if you find the right one) get more of what you want. Good thing with this is that if you are looking at more advanced resorts your gonna find less crowd simply because they arnt ment to cover the beginners, the famlies and the party more then ski crowd. Risk though with that is that you will follow a hype to a place that ends up not beeing your cup of coffee at all and then you will have a horrible vacation.
This is why La Grave is on my list and still in france. It breaks off the provide for 90% and instead focuses on the remaining 10%.
If one views this as the strenght of the alps that the entire family or entire bunch of friends can come regarless of skill level or if one views it as just too much people is up to one self. For me though I rather pick more specialized resorts. Thats why Im dissing the big french resorts.
Tex
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| brian wrote: |
| No, I wouldn't think it would be, but it does meet a few of Tex's specific requirements. |
I'm sure it does. I had a lovely time there, even though the choice of terrain was limited by very high avalanche risk.
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You know it makes sense.
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| brian wrote: |
TexMurphy, think you might like the anniviers although it's French speaking Switzerland rather than France.
Oh, btw, La Grave is huuuuuuuge in all the important ways |
The language is not part of the equation.. dont care about that at all...
Yes Im keeping an eye on switzerland as it now price wise isnt more expencive then other alp countries. Historicaly Ive been giving up switzerland due to price level and getting better bang per buck elsewhere...
Tex
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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TexMurphy, there are plenty of world class restaurants in French ski resorts, as well as plenty of places you can get cheap and cheerful food. Classing all French mountain food as "bad" is just a nonsense, in my opinion.
Do you think that resorts like Val d'Isere or Les Arcs don't cater for the 10% market segment? If you do I'd urge you to get a guide and try out some of the famous and little known off-piste opportunities. Foe example some of the lines off the Aiguille Rouge in Les Arcs will stand comparison with guided off-piste just about anywhere. See here for a little bit of an insight.
You might not want to ski within schussing distance of the hoi polloi, but that doesn't mean that the resorts you are 'dissing' don't offer the kind of skiing you value.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
| Classing all French mountain food as "bad" is just a nonsense, in my opinion. |
Mine as well.
There are some 'basic' restaurants but there are Michelin starrred restaurant's as well.
Val Thorens and Chamonix come immediately to mind.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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...and Megève.
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brian
brian
Guest
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| TexMurphy wrote: |
The dining well you have the entire range from good (italy) to bad (france) so yes your right.
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French on-mountain prices may be high but ........ tarte aux myrtilles ffs !!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| TexMurphy wrote: |
All in all intersting how much noice I managed to create by dissing the alps..
Tex |
Indeed. 'Dudist' language usually plays better on TGR. Interesting name for someone from Sweden though.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Worst mountain food I have ever had was in Whistler, closely followed by Lake Louise.
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TexMurphy, have you tried Serre Chevalier, it's reputation of huge queues is rapidly diminishing thanks to several new chairlifts.French hols is busy but great the rest of the time. Gorgeous lunches at the Bivouac de Casse, Peyra Juana, and Le Troll. Far less expensive than 3v or Val Despair. Loads of off-piste, and a short drive to La Grave.
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I know there is great, if not fantastic, offpist in Val d'Isere/Tignes, Chamonix and Avoriaz. Ive had memorable days in all of them.
Though I would not say that either resort has the offpiste crowed as its priority. What they do is that they provide a great guide service.
They dont provide inbounds offpist skiing and they dont glade trees to provide great tree sking within the inbounds area.
Tex
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| Helen Beaumont wrote: |
| Worst mountain food I have ever had was in Whistler. |
Whistler is indeed bad mountain food... resort food is ok but far from great...
Not been to lake louise so cant compare.
Fernie has avg mountain food but very cheap... food in town is great on the other hand.. I was suppriced how good food there was as I was expecting quite bad "hillbilly food"...
Tex
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| TexMurphy wrote: |
| They dont provide inbounds offpist skiing and they dont glade trees to provide great tree sking within the inbounds area. |
I thought you objected to the "Disneyfication" of the French resorts. Clearly this doesn't apply to the actual skiing! You want a proportion of trees cut down to make it easier to ski between them, and to blast the hell out of the snow so that there is almost no risk of avalanche activity anywhere near skiers, so they can wander around the terrain without thinking about mountaincraft.
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brian
brian
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| TexMurphy wrote: |
They dont provide inbounds offpist skiing and they dont glade trees to provide great tree sking within the inbounds area.
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La Grave is no different in this respect.
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FAQ
