 Poster: A snowHead
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Im 44 with bad knees, am i nuts to want to learn Telemark skiing???
It always looks so cool when i see people doing it correctly, but is it a lifetime of dedication to get to a reasonable standard?
I need to learn a second discipline and it will be tele or snowboarding
comments from all telemarkers gladly accepted.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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It'll be interesting to follow this thread. In the US approx 20% of the peeps buying Icelantic skis are putting tele bindings on them so I'm tempted to mount a pair (tele) next season.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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being new to this kiwi1, are touring/randonee bindings the same as telemark bindings?
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| being new to this kiwi1, are touring/randonee bindings the same as telemark bindings? |
No.
Tele's are FULLTIME heel's free.
AT (randonee) heels can be locked down for the downhill part. So you don't need to learn telemark turns for the downhill.
If your objective is to learn tele turns, get tele gear.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| skimottaret wrote: |
Im 44 with bad knees, am i nuts to want to learn Telemark skiing???
It always looks so cool when i see people doing it correctly, but is it a lifetime of dedication to get to a reasonable standard?
I need to learn a second discipline and it will be tele or snowboarding
comments from all telemarkers gladly accepted. |
I'm not (yet) a telemarker. So take my opinion with a grain of salt. 
For me, it's not a question of if, just a question of when (I become a full-fledge one).
I've tried a couple lessons. It didn't feel too difficult. I had a bit of nordic background, so skiing heels free is nothing new for me. In my experience, skiing heels free in general helped me to get a better "feel" on the skis. I can't rely on the high stiff boot to hold me upright. I have to conciously keep my balance on the "sweet spot" of the ski.
That said, if you're going to stay on lift serviced slopes, I'm not sure what telemark gear gives you that alpine gears don't. Telemark gears are developed, and primarily used, for backcountry touring.
I live close by such terrains so it's a no brainer for me. No crowd, no queues. In your case, I'm not so sure. More over, snowboarding might also be better on your knees too.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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skimottaret, Fix the heel, fix the problem 
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abc, thanks for the tip on tele gear. I most likely will be spending most of my time "sidecountry" skiing and getting out in the peace and quiet so randonee appeals, but telemarking just looks so cool when done right. I like the idea of backcountry skiing, but have never tried it yet would like to in the future.
I am starting training for my ISIA instructor license and MUST be competent in a second discipline. randonee isnt considered a 2nd distinct discipline hence telemark.
Glad to hear learning telemarking isnt as tough as it looks but i am guessing will take more dedication than say learning snowboarding.
It seems to make sense that snowboarding would be easier on the joints but am not sure how rough telemarking is on the body, Do you find it tough on your knees and joints??
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skimottaret, Tele-masters run courses at Xscape MK, with hire of all neccesary gear. If you fancy a go let me know, as I've always wanted to try it too.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Free the heel, free the mind!
I've been learning to tele sporadically over the past couple of years with no ACL in one knee and its no where near as bad as I anticipated though I do trigger bursitis outbreaks in that knee it seems.
Its not too hard once you've got over the Bambi on ice initial phase but grizzled old veterans will respond to you on a chair when you say you're still learning that they are too. It takes a good while of concentrated practice to override the "weight on the downhill ski" reflex that kicks in half way through a turn (at least for me) & "big toe, little toe" will become your new slightly bizarre mantra.
It doesn't necessarily give you a performance advantage over alpine skis but it feels so nice & elegant when you nail a turn right.
I'm sure there will be a tele festival one weekend at MK this summer if you want to give it a try.
Oh and you never see a scandi who isn't great at it - maybe its genetic!
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Spyderman, i stumbled across their site today and looks real interesting. I am at MK on the 30th to have a chat with Ali and will certainly check out the tele classes and let you know what i find out.
slightly off thread but do you need help for this MK day out in june?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Spyderman wrote: |
| skimottaret, Tele-masters run courses at Xscape MK, with hire of all neccesary gear. If you fancy a go let me know, as I've always wanted to try it too. |
I can recommend Richard as a teacher - snowheads MK tele meet anyone? No experience necessary.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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fatbob, great to hear that bad knees arent a barrier to entry.
I love the sound of "nice and elegant when you nail a turn"
and yes a tele day out would be very cool to give it goSpyderman, are you in as well?
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fatbob, If I'm still in the UK count me in as very interested in learning the basics too.
_________________
 booger'm
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You know it makes sense.
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| being new to this kiwi1, are touring/randonee bindings the same as telemark bindings? |
my backcountry friends tell me
Randonee = french for CAN"T TELE
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I like watching good telemarkers, and I can see the reason for touring gear, getting round the mountains. But is there any reason for telemarking other than it being difficult to do? Is there any terrain accessible for telemarkers but not for touring skis? Is telemarking the new monoboarding?
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Poster: A snowHead
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| pam w wrote: |
| But is there any reason for telemarking other than it being difficult to do? Is there any terrain accessible for telemarkers but not for touring skis? |
Yes, and no.
Tele skiers go to terrain that few AT (rondanee) geared skiers go. But it's not so much about the downhill part.
Tele gears are way lighter than AT gear. Not having to have the mechanism to lock the heel down means simpler binding. And tele boots are lighter because there's no need to "brace" the ankle.
I presume a really fit and hardcore downhill skier can get to the same terrain on either AT or tele gear. It's just a lot more hard work to get there on AT gears.
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Is telemarking the new monoboarding? |
What is monoboarding?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| pam w wrote: |
| I like watching good telemarkers, and I can see the reason for touring gear, getting round the mountains. But is there any reason for telemarking other than it being difficult to do? Is there any terrain accessible for telemarkers but not for touring skis? Is telemarking the new monoboarding? |
It's about the turn. Like the effortless snowboard turn it feels a lot different to an alpine turn. It's also not the new anything being the oldest form of skiing just in the past 10 years or so equipment has advanced radically.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Would someone like to enlighten me? - I keep hearing the term and so far understand that the toe is attached in the bindingand not the heel? - is it like cross country skiing? - I saw folks doing this years ago in Lenzerheide-Valbella
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Megamum wrote: |
| Would someone like to enlighten me? - I keep hearing the term and so far understand that the toe is attached in the bindingand not the heel? - is it like cross country skiing? - I saw folks doing this years ago in Lenzerheide-Valbella |
Not "just like" cross-country skiing. It IS cross-country skiing, albeit in steep terrain. (Try taking your cross-country skis to come down an alpine resort slope! )
At least that's how telemark originally was. Though today's telemark gear used on slopes are sometimes so heavy and stiff I had my doubts about their touring suitabilities.
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OK, I've watched the first and an buffering the second - the skiing looks exciting - these extreme skiing runs that are often posted around here always do. OK, here comes the niaive question - what advantage does it have? I've always assumed that extreme skiing can be done on high tolerance but more standard style fixed bindings or is all done on telemark kit?
Ahhh.....just watched the second.......you couldn't climb on skis like that in standard fixed bindings - the skis must have a one way surface so they don't slip backwards, the kit could be lighter? and the boots maybe more flexible so that the folks can move easier in them when they're walking and climbing? I bet you also need to be very fit.
Can't ever see me doing it, but it's great to watch it done!!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Megamum wrote: |
OK, I've watched the first and an buffering the second - the skiing looks exciting - these extreme skiing runs that are often posted around here always do. OK, here comes the niaive question - what advantage does it have?
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It's a different turn with a different feel. The inside edge on the front ski and the outside edge on the back ski make one long continuous edge.
Eventually you get to look at anything with snow on it as skiable, whether flat, climby or a downhill.
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I've always assumed that extreme skiing can be done on high tolerance but more standard style fixed bindings or is all done on telemark kit?
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Nothing to do with extreme or the lack of it. There is, however, a minimum speed below which a tele turn just does not work.
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Can't ever see me doing it,! |
Why not?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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abc, competent in BASI speak is roughly red runs under control of speed and line and some flow. I recon tele skiing is like 12 string guitar in taht it is a life time of dedication to get truly "competent" but if you want an ISIA license the former will do.....
snowboarding is the easy way out and if you want to teach two disciplines it is the sensible way to go.
I am looking at the second discipline as a fun thing to do not something to teach so tele (and randonee) appeals to me as something i can aspire to as i get older and continue to learn. I see a lot of mountain people on their randonee gear and they have sunburn teeth from grinning so much!!! i fancy some of that...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
Tele gears are way lighter than AT gear. Not having to have the mechanism to lock the heel down means simpler binding. And tele boots are lighter because there's no need to "brace" the ankle.
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thanks, abc, I see the point now! It does look great, and I'd like to do some touring, but if my efforts on "ordinary" cross country gear are any indication of how I'd get on with telemarking, I won't bother. I am finding cross country skiing far, far, harder to learn than snowboarding and despite not being bothered about falls on the snowboard (I fell a lot!) I remain really quite scared of falling on the cross country skis; somehow it seems to hurt a lot more. Cross-country is easy enough going on the level, or up a gentle slope; after two weeks of lessons I got quite good at some of the gliding steps and I love being away from the hullaballoo of the lifts and people on the downhill slopes. But I remain absolutely, resolutely, utterly, hopeless at snowploughing on the damn things. But the boots are bliss!
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skimottaret,
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competent in BASI speak is roughly red runs
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I thought that the standard for the second discipline had been pushed up from competent, to BASI Foundation course/ASSI standard, but please correct me if I'm wrong.
I'm very much up for a course of Tele lessons at MK. Never tried it, always wanted to.
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You know it makes sense.
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Spyderman, Your right on the standard but the foundation level for alpine is 16 weeks skiing and good parallel turns on red runs so not too difficult and isnt pass fail.. dont know about assi and certainly dont know how long it would take to get to a reasonable level in tele
but.... it still looks really fun, cool and elegant...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I've given up alpine skiing this year and expect to ski at least 95% telemark next year. This winter I've skied something like 75 days, and only 6 of those were alpine, the last time was in January because I went off the back of Mont Fort a few times and my tele turns weren't quite up to it.
I'm lucky because I'm a reasonable skier and I can ski everyday so my telemarking progressed pretty fast. Going back to absolute novice was very funny and extremely humbling, it took me a week before I decided I was ready for Tortin (a steepish, 30-35degs in places, mogul itinerie), and standing at the top was interesting, my mind knew how to make the turns but the legs just wouldn't listen.
My telemarking has now reached a stage where I would do anything on telemarks that I would do on alpine skis, I was due to go up Bec de Roses (pretty gnarly mountain where they host the O'Neil Extreme ) last week but I ran out of time, I've skied the Bec twice, both times it was pretty sketchy but after one season I was ready for it on my teles.
Is it hard? Yes, you have to have very good balance and be able to think while you ski in a very fluid and relaxed fashion. The better skier you are the faster you will learn. The first few weeks involved some falling over, I took Rungsp from Verbier to la Chable in my first week of telemarking at New Year, there was a foot of powder at the top and every turn was a headplant, but 400m of vertical later and I could link turns and I was converted.
Does it hurt the body? Your quads soon feel the burn and get super fit but other than that it's easier on your joints as it's more dynamic and has less impact. Yes, even on the knees. The reason I've taken up telemarking is I crushed my sacrum (displaced & prolapsed disc) hucking cliffs last year, got the usual: you won't ski this season, from the doctors. After every day I've been out alpine skiing I have a very sore lower back but telemarking leaves me pain free.
Is it good for touring? Hell yeah. Yesterday I got back from a three day tour. Modern plastic boots are much stiffer than the old traditional gear and my set up is steered to turns not tours but I was left blister and pain free after a 6 hour skin yesterday morning... Awesome. TR to come...
I only have one pair of alpine mounted skis, Prophet 130s (152-130-142, 18m, 186cm), but next winter they will become telemarks.
I posted a little video of me at the end of March skiing some nice spring snow.
Do it. Free the heal and you will free your mind...
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Poster: A snowHead
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parlor, Just seen your video. That's for Me! Tele course here I come.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I'll try to get in touch with Richard next week to see if he's interested in running an intro to tele session sometime around June at MK . Probably be a Sat or Sun morning based on past experience. Though he does have a regualr timetable he's generally pretty flexible.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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fatbob, Weekends are best for Me.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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fatbob, Spyderman, im in as well, if we can get a small group togehter to minimize costs even better. cant do weekend of 23rd or 30th of june though.
parlor, Great to hear that is it easier on the joints as that was my main concern. In addition to arthritis i broke my L5 lumbar years ago and it healed wrong so the back can play up from time to time. you sound a more accomplished skiier than me but if you progressed to skiing red runs within weeks it gives me hope that it is not too huge an undertaking.
burning quads i can deal and again the more i hear from tele skiers the more i like the descriptions. i love the sound of "skiing in a fluid and relaxed fashion" that is what i aspire to on alpine gear and when i see good tele skiers i cant take my eyes off them
I think i am sold as far as the tele vs snowboarding arguement goes. bring on some tele lessons!!!!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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parlor,
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My telemarking has now reached a stage where I would do anything on telemarks that I would do on alpine skis, I was due to go up Bec de Roses (pretty gnarly mountain where they host the O'Neil Extreme ) last week but I ran out of time, I've skied the Bec twice, both times it was pretty sketchy but after one season I was ready for it on my teles.
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I was watching a couple of folk ski down Bec de Roses last weekend, I am deeply impressed it looked very hairy territory to me. I wouldn't dream of going near it on any skis.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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comprex,
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Quote:
Can't ever see me doing it,!
Why not?
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Well, I can't see me ever getting that fit, for a start!! It also looks awfully fast, somewhat scarey and more than a tad dangerous!! 
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Megamum,
It's as gentle as you want it to be, I've seen ladies doing it very elegantly in a long skirt.
If you can do a single lunge you're well on your way to your first turn.
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ladies doing it very elegantly in a long skirt.
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That must be a bit drafty
Well at least I now know what you're all on about - I think now I would be able to identify someone doing it. Thank you
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Megamum wrote: |
| It also looks awfully fast, somewhat scarey and more than a tad dangerous!! |
You've been watching the wrong tele skiers!
That's what I thought when I first saw a few odd tele skiers on the slope, about 10 years ago. Unstable, scary, what I I thought, and wondered what's the point.
Now, there're so many of them on the slope. I can pick out the good ones. They look relaxed. That right, RELAXED. Getting down a steep mogul field as though taking a walk in the park. I'm envious. I know I won't get THAT good. It's just not in me.
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| Well, I can't see me ever getting that fit, for a start!! |
Where there's a will, there's a way.
More than a decades ago, I felt the same way you do. Now that I'm quite a bit older but my fitness is actually better than when I was younger. Go figure. (I think it has something to do with long bike rides to interesting places. A fun way to get fit)
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| pam w wrote: |
| But I remain absolutely, resolutely, utterly, hopeless at snowploughing on the damn things. But the boots are bliss! |
Well, go ahead and learn the telemark turns, you won't need the snowplough any more!
On a more serious note. Just like snowplough on alpine gear, it works better when you move your weight FORWARD (by flexing your ankle).
Nothing work too well when you're on the backseat! Snowplough, parallel, telemark, even snowboard. The front of the ski/board is where the "action" is.
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FAQ
