 Poster: A snowHead
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I know we've been here before but I've just seen a podiatrist and I don't know how to relate her comments to my ski boots and ski technique.
Here's what she said:
"You have very rotated tibias which means that your feet naturally turn out like a penguin. Attempting to correct this has caused long term damage to your knees. You also have one leg slightly longer than the other. Both feet pronate significantly but the foot of the longer leg pronates more."
She has given me a heel raise and insoles but could not offer any advice on what to do about my ski boots. Can anyone out there tell me whether it's appropriate to wear insoles or a heel raise inside ski boots. If not, what's the alternative. I don't think I can afford to buy new boots. I have my own skis and I've skied for about 6 weeks .
How can I accomodate these problems in my skiing (my skiing looks like that of Mrs Trailmonster)? I also suffer from Ankylosing Spondylitis so my joints are all stiff. I'd love to be a better skier but am I a lost cause?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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marmalade, I'm sure one of the Zookeepers will be along soon, CEM is away till Tuesday. They will answer your question far better.
I read somewhere that there is a Skiboot that is designed with that in mind, but can't think what make, but the jist of what I read was that the boots don't try and square up your stance, but allow your feet to turn outwards naturally.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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marmalade, Little Tiger is now using her regular orthotics in her ski boots I think - I'm sure she'll be along in a minute. She has the wierdest feet I've ever seen, so there's hope for you. Make sure you have private lessons with an instructor who understands your condition (or at least asks questions about it) and you will find a way to deal with the stiffness and so on.
Good luck 
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easiski,
Nah
using the ones made by the podiatrist at SIDAS... so far they win.... but before that I did use my regular orthotics in my ski boots as directed by my podiatrist(high level skier) as he felt they were a better solution for me than any footbed made by a bootfitter... (he does fit orthotics for AIS athletes and is VERY highly respected for this stuff)
The problem re fitting walking orthotic with heel lift into ski boot is the volume needed... and then you have 2 different amounts of heel lift so you have different ankle flex (but you can learn to deal with that) - so it is better to lift the whole foot than the heel I believe.... but the foot stuff was not limiting re skiing for me - so I skied with the orthotics for a bit until I got those SIDAS orthotics made...
Without either the SIDAS or the walking orthotics I have pain as soon as I weight bear... in skiing i have hip/knee pain almost all the time without them... walking I can walk maybe 10 minutes before the pain becomes bad...
Also note that my orthotics DO NOT prevent pronation ... in fact one promotes and assists it... the other still allows for it (yes they are rigid - no they are not uncomfortable I stand on them 10-13 hours a day every day and run and walk in them I have NO choice if I want knee/hip function as I age)... THis may be a factor in some supports being not so great for skiing purposes... I dunno... but everyone says they have footbeds that prevent pronation... and I know for a fact my orthotics are built to allow it and/or promote it - the podiatrist spent much time showing me how they do that... my friend has different orthotics (materials etc) made by SAME podiatrist and got SAME talk about how feet need to pronate when walking/skiing and SAME demo of how the orthotics allow this... (albeit with the different orthotic build)... she also puts her orthotics into her ski boots as cannot get a suitable footbed... Again she has very bad feet - could barely walk at all before orthotics made due to BAD footbeds and bootfit causing aggravation of foot/ankle problems... (Yes we have same podiatrist - a fluke as we did not know we both went to him until AFTER we both went... his reputation is that good... but the wait to see him is LOOOONNG... you really have to WANT to se him not his partners)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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marmalade, I use both a heel raise and fotbeds. Works a treat
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Sounds like a rebranding for the UKIP.
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Frosty the Snowman, do you have A heel raise? or heel raises I have heel lifts in both boots for another reason.... but A heel raise on 1 foot only even in walking orthotic (actually it is a grind down of the other and build up of one)
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| Quote: |
The problem re fitting walking orthotic with heel lift into ski boot is the volume needed
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Of course, this hadn't occured to me. I don't think there's any way my feet would fit in the ski boots with the orthotics in as none of my shoes fit any more. The orthotics they've given me are really thick.
Frosty the snowman - I think it would be possible to use the heel raise alone but the podiatrist told me that having footbeds made to the (bad) shape of your feet could encourage them to stay in the bad position.
So, where is a place to go for good footbeds from knowledgeable fitters?
Any tips on technique for 'pronators'?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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marmalade,
SIDAS in Grenoble have podiatrists that do footbeds and orthotics... they specialise in skiing and bike riding IIRC....
they are not far from the AIRPORT in grenoble and can easily be fitted into a trip to the alpes...
yes mine are also very chunky.... but I am just very careful to buy shoes to fit my needs (the end of strappy sandals with 5" heels but... walking is kinda neat so I'll stick with it)
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little tiger, Both feet (dodgy left achilles)
marmalade, I can only tell you what I have and what worked for me. I cant tell you how or why it works or what will be best for you....sorry 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Frosty the Snowman,
I read marmalade, as saying he has ONE heel raise (singular)... due to leg length difference (ie raise short leg heel)... that is why I was commenting on different ankle flexes.... with TWO heel lifts that is not an issue...
I have dodgy achilles/calves on both feet = poor ankle flexion which I work very hard on... it was better the summer I spent working EXTRA hard on it... ALSO have the other foot/leg issues to contend with....
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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YO HO HO!
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What/Who is SIDAS?
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, remember, you know nothing! 
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Poster: A snowHead
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marmalade,
SIDAS make the "Conformable" footbeds many bootfitters use....
they have sites in Grenoble and (IIRC) paris... you can make an appointment with their podiatrists there...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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marmalade, depending on the orthotics you have will depend on wheter or not they will fit into your ski boots, certain podiatrists will make you a 'narrow grind' pair of inserts specifically for skiing, others will not. if the ones you have do not fit... then a pair of properly made footbeds can offer enough support along with the shell of the boot to support your foot whilst skiing. there is no problem with using one heel lift in a boot, how much is the lift you have??, often times the reason for the longer leg pronating more is to compensate for the lack of length in the other 'short' leg. if the lift is too great to fit inside the boot easily without affecting fit then work can be done externally to the boot or to the binding to make up the difference [although it would need to be a large amount for this to be required] there can be issue with ankle flex as mentioned before, however this is not a major problem if it takes away the pain that you are currently in, it may also be worth looking at some of the externally rotated boot shells on the market [depending on ability and of course foot shape] as these allow the foot to be ain a slightly externally rotated position with your skis pointing dead ahead
hope that helps a little,
if you need more info just ask
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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CEM,
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it may also be worth looking at some of the externally rotated boot shells on the market [depending on ability and of course foot shape] as these allow the foot to be ain a slightly externally rotated position with your skis pointing dead ahead
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Spyderman,
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I read somewhere that there is a Skiboot that is designed with that in mind, but can't think what make, but the jist of what I read was that the boots don't try and square up your stance, but allow your feet to turn outwards naturally.
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CEM, I though that I had seen that type of boot somewhere, not me just dreaming. 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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CEM, Is this what you mean?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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maggi, Spyderman, the fischer is one, Atomic boots make their shells slightly offset, as are the Dobermann aggrssor from Nordica, remember it all depends on foot shape as well, if they do not fit the foot then there is little point in ngoing that route, first and foremost the foot must be stable in the best position possible
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Atomic, Nordica, Fischer all have boots in their range where the feet are slightly turned outwards, but not to any great extent.
edit: CEM beat me to it 
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CEM my heel raise is only quite small, 5-8mm so I think it would fit in my boots. But I really doubt that the othotics will fit due to their thickness and width so a 'narrow grind' pair might be better. I would still be concerned about sacrificing the comfort of my boots though, so I'm coming to the conclusion that footbeds would probably be better.
Does anyone know if it's possible to get conformable footbeds in the UK, or if not a podiatrist who can make 'narrow grind' orthotics?
I like the idea of boots that allow the feet to externally rotate but I just can't afford new boots at the moment. I'll bare this in mind if and when I come to replace my boots.
I'm still not really understanding how these problems might be affecting my technique and how this could be worked on or overcome. Any thoughts?
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| marmalade wrote: |
Does anyone know if it's possible to get conformable footbeds in the UK, or if not a podiatrist who can make 'narrow grind' orthotics?
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your podiatrist should be able to do the narrow grind IF they can be made for you... mine offered to make a slightly different version for me for skiing (alas not narrow grind as he cannot) if I cannot totally resolve my issues otherwise... he also made a narrow grind version for my ski instructor friend.... As he already has a cast of your feet the cost should be a little less than before...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| marmalade wrote: |
I'm still not really understanding how these problems might be affecting my technique and how this could be worked on or overcome. Any thoughts? |
You probably need to ask CEM...
IIRC my leg length discrepancy made disengagement of 1 edge tricky and engagement of the other harder also - which naturally I managed to compensate for... but that along with a bunch of other compensations was making me work a little harder than I needed... this started to become an issue as my technical skills improved... Also in my case I was damaging my hip and knee as well (well ??? both hips) by walking and skiing on an unstable pair of feet... My hips are still in recovery really...
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marmalade, your heel lift should not be a problem, infact other than the fact that it reduces the amont of pronation in your foot you could probaly ski perfectly well without it as you are never on a level surface when you ski
conformable/ sidas footbeds are the ones made in pretty much every ski shop in the UK , the trick is finding a fitter that can build you a good pair, you could try speaking to Julian at Ellis Brigham in castlefield, he is pretty goofd at them and is as close as i can think of anyone to you
with regard to technique, one follows the other, if the leg is long it will pronate more to try and compensate, this will disribute pressure in the wrong places in the boot / on the ski and the technique will be affected...... balance leg length, stabilise pronation and all should be a little easier 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Thanks, I'm hoping to go to the ski test at Castleford on 21st July so I'll try to catch Julian at Ellis Brigham then.
In the meantime I'm going to try and get used to walking in the damn things!
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