 Poster: A snowHead
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I'd be interested to hear if any of you have experience of this, I wrote the below in response to a query somewhere else.
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Jason Leonard and Trevor Woodman force a smile
Lawrence Dallaglio lies back and thinks of England
Lee Childs feels the cold pain of the ice bath
NRL Bulldogs Training, Australia
It's an emerging trend amongst rugby players at the moment, you will have seen pictures of teams and individuals getting to ice baths at the end of training etc., although AFAIK it's origins (the ice bath) is from field and track.
It originally started as a way to speed up the repair of miniscule muscular and fibrous tears of the shins (shin splints) in field and track - athletes used to stand in wheelie-bins full of iced water to reduce the inflamation.
However in recent times some athletes found that it helped with DOMS (delayed onset muscle soreness) - Paula Radcliffe is one such athlete to uses the ice bath.
In the meantime some athletes also found that it aided recovery time between training/competitions, so at the moment it's sport's new messiah. Recovery has become a bit of a buzz word over the past few years.
Some say that it's effective as it constricts all the blood vessels, squeezing all the "old" oxygen depleated blood out (incl lactic acid), and when they get out of the bath, it's replenished by "new" blood enabling healing and recovery from DOMS.
Some say that it's effective because it reduces inflamation.
Some advocate alternate ice and hot baths.
Personally speaking as a coach - I tell all my athletes to take a long, very hot bath, followed by stretching after the session - which also gets the blood flowing. It seems to work for them
If you want to buy an icebath just like the ones pictured above, you can opt for an individual model, or a team model!
Last edited by Poster: A snowHead on Wed 30-05-07 11:38; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I think I'll put up with the delayed soreness and recovery. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I like the long hot bath approach, thanks. But there is masses of evidence that getting into cold water is something your body adjusts to, quite quickly actually, if done regularly and frequently and is a very good idea for anyone like winter dinghy sailors who might find themselves immersed accidentally; the shock reaction is much less in individuals who have acclimatised themselves, eg by taking cold showers. This response is independent of age, fitness etc - ie any of us could readily enhance our ability to put up with cold water, by - er - putting up with cold water. But that shock reaction is not good for people with weak hearts etc - who are best advised to keep warm. They discovered that people in that shocked state, for example hypothermic victims being plucked from the sea by helicopter, need to be kept horizontal (ie not dangling from a chest harness, which could kill them). There was an interesting TV programme some years ago about all this, using naval diving experts and training facilities. They showed how fast top Olympic swimmers lost their coordination and strength in cold water (when it is, of course, best to stay still and curl up in a ball, not thrash around). I'm such a wimp these days I don't like getting in the sea in this country even in the summer without a wetsuit. But there are other old ladies round here who swim in the sea frequently who are fine with it and if I did it every day I'd be fine with it too. So why don't I? No idea.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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No chance of implementing this regime at the PSB or EoSB then? And if you're a male, beware of shrinkage.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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veeeight, Those photos are sooooo gay 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I remember seeing Chemmy Alcott on TV once saying that she used an ice bath to recover after racing, so it is used in skiing as well, and the pictures would probably be a bit easier on the eye than those above 
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iblair, Chemmy or not, I wouldn't be leaping in after her!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I've not tried an ice bath (and I don't intend to), but I have started to use Biofreeze on aches. It seems to work for me. (but the first time I tried it, it felt like it was really burning my skin)
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veeeight, Thank you - very nice
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Here I am trying to have a serious sports physio discussion, and it's getting dragged down.... 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Wear The Fox Hat, what's Biofreeze?
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Oooh yes, very nice pictures thank you. Any more piccies? 
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You know it makes sense.
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The tall bloke looks dodgy.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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cathy, plenty more, but I don't think they will be universally embraced :lol
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Poster: A snowHead
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Is the Cryotherapy the one they are all raving on about where you go into a room at about -60C for a couple of minutes? Seemed plausible when I listened to the doctor on the radio the other week - cures all sorts of minor knocks and niggles....
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
cures all sorts of minor knocks and niggles....
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yes death is like that
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| Wear The Fox Hat, what's Biofreeze? |
It's a gel you rub on - kinda like the complete opposite of Deep Heat. (also it doesn't smell as bad)
http://www.biofreeze.co.uk/
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Wear The Fox Hat wrote: |
| rob@rar wrote: |
| Wear The Fox Hat, what's Biofreeze? |
It's a gel you rub on - kinda like the complete opposite of Deep Heat. (also it doesn't smell as bad)
http://www.biofreeze.co.uk/ |
Thanks, not heard of that. Is it designed to reduce inflammation?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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rob@rar, it's designed for pain relief, for inflammation I take Naproxen.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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the best place for ice is in a G&T.................not in my bath, I did manage to have a G&T with ice whilst in my bath on my last skiing trip.....
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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CEM, does this mean you have a reasonable protocol to avoid the hunting effect, or are you trying to use it?
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comprex, not much to hunt round here
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
That's big boy stuff!
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...big boy stuff meaning that it is primarily administered for acute postoperative pain.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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.... meaning that taken without due care you'll be constipated like a f**ker, and therefore increase in size
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well, it works for me better than Vitamin I.
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You know it makes sense.
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Vitamin I - It's known as Instructor Candy around here
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Blade wrote: |
| Quote: |
That's big boy stuff!
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...big boy stuff meaning that it is primarily administered for acute postoperative pain. |
The trick is not to wait for it to be administered. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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| veeeight wrote: |
| .... meaning that taken without due care you'll be constipated like a f**ker |
I take mine orally, and don't have that problem.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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b]veeeight[/b], Works a treat and it doesn't HAVE to be ice water just very cold. You do have to be in the tub fairly quickly after the over exertion for best benefit. I'm not sure that it should be routinely used to disguise or mask the result of a real injury but for mild overexertion or minor impact stresses it's a real treat to avoid muscle soreness.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Wear The Fox Hat, a 7 day ski holiday sees me on a2 big fat prescribed Naproxen day and night. I worship the ground the manufacturer walks on. Oh and 1 Lanzoprazol a day to settle the guts.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Frosty the Snowman wrote: |
| Wear The Fox Hat, a 7 day ski holiday sees me on a2 big fat prescribed Naproxen day and night. I worship the ground the manufacturer walks on. Oh and 1 Lanzoprazol a day to settle the guts. |
So if you take all that what's the beer for?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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rob@rar, I have to drink beer as it helps keep the weight up. If I weighed less then I may not need these wonderful drugs.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| veeeight wrote: |
| Personally speaking as a coach - I tell all my athletes to take a long, very hot bath, followed by stretching after the session - which also gets the blood flowing. It seems to work for them |
Physiologically speaking, very poor and out of date advice I'm afraid.
Ice baths are taking it to an extreme, but best advice is probably stretching at the end of exercise (not before), and then a cool to lukewarm shower.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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veeeight, ice baths lead to shorter recovery times, both from training and soft tissue injuries. The RICE protocol is very well established these days and is not really contested at all.
Warmth, either as a bath or as a compress delays recovery time, probably by increasing inflammation because of increased blood flow. Coldness probably decreases the inflammatory response by decreasing blood flow to the affected area. A cold shower would have a similar effect.
It's far from an open and shut case (as it often is in medical matters), but at the moment, current best advice would be to avoid excessive heat after exertion. IMV of course  .
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Throught football I've been using Ice baths as couple of years, but only regularly this year.
It definately speeds up recovery times from muscle soreness etc.
This year we have been doing in in the cycle:
30-60 secs in ice bath then into hot shower until warmed up. Then into the ice bath for a further 30-60 secs and into the hot shower again.
If you go full body into the ice bath it's a serious shock to the system for the first 10 seconds, but if only put the legs in its fairly easy.
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FAQ
