 Poster: A snowHead
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| spyderjon wrote: |
| It's a real pi$$er for ASSI's loosing the 'trainee' exemption, especially at so short notice. I could have accepted May 09 as a deadline as it would have given me two seasons to get my plans/finances sorted etc if I'd wanted to progress |
Couldn't agree more.
Do I continue with plans for ASSI this year or now wait and change to BASI, knowing that it will be after May08 before being able to afford (both in terms of time and money) the next level.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Everyont I know still uses the 3-2-1 despite BASI's best efforts to go towards the words!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| easiski wrote: |
This proposed system of numbers/names is totally potty! What about all of us with certificates for "Grade 1" - we had to work very hard for a very long time and pay a lot of money to BASI to boot to get them - it will now mean a trainee, trainee!
Once upon a time there were
Grade 3 - Assistant ski instructor
Grade 2 - Ski instructor
Grade 1 - Sli teacher
A grade 4 would be simple - even if it is the other way round to everyone else.
x7, I try to avoid the use of the word "instructor" wherever possible. I do consider myself a teacher or a coach if you prefer.  |
If your cert says "Grade 1" then you'll be OK because a Trainee is "Level 1" but your confusion demonstrates perfectly what I said above and if even you are confused, we can be certain that a great many others will be.
It's interesting what you say about regarding yourself a teacher or coach rather than an instructor. I'm sure this attitude has a role to play in your healthy reputation around here but I expect that most people still think of you as a 'ski instructor' so to the wider world the difference is really just one of semantics.
For a grading system to rely on such semantic vagaries to distinguish between a trainee and fully qualified instructor/teacher is, as you say, potty.
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I could be wrong here but it could be that BASI is admitting defeat and going back to a numbering system and this a a subtle way for them to conform to the rest of the world.
if "trainee" is now a Level 1 Instructor and "Instructor" is level 2 Instructor take it a step further and perhaps their plan is to rename Ski Teacher ISIA as a "level 3" and ISTD a "level 4" ?
this would bring BASI in line with PSIA and Canada and may finally make some sense.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Spyderman wrote: |
| Within 6 months there will also be a new coaching scheme; BASC (British Association of Snowsport Coaches) with Level 1 for club coaches & Level 2 for Head coaches |
Reading the BASI newsletter they also state that there will be eventually 4 levels of Coach which will be in line with the Instructor levels.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Clear as mud for the punter! 
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| skimottaret wrote: |
| Reading the BASI newsletter they also state that there will be eventually 4 levels of Coach which will be in line with the Instructor levels. |
Actually, to align it with CSCF Levels 1 - 4  (as the CSCF will be delivering the courses)
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veeeight, sounds more likely i recon your right 
laundryman, if they do go for a 4 level instructor rating that is similar to the rest of the world that would be a good thing and clarify a very confusing picture.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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How would the BASI levels 1-4 match up to other qualification systems? Would a BASI Level 4 (old Grade 1) be similar in standard to CSIA IV for example?
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rob@rar, getting carried away here. There is no proposal (at present to introduce a BASI Level 3 or BASI Level 4.
Just Level 1, Level 2, Ski Teacher, ISTD, Trainer.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| veeeight wrote: |
rob@rar, getting carried away here. There is no proposal (at present to introduce a BASI Level 3 or BASI Level 4.
Just Level 1, Level 2, Ski Teacher, ISTD, Trainer.
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Oops, getting ahead of myself! Makes a change from falling behind my skis...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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veeeight, rob@rar, I am only speculating on the extension of the new "levels" but it does make sense of an other wise very confused picture as you rightly point out
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From BASI's exemption list, other countries systems and equivalence
Australia
Level 1 = Instructor
Level 2 = Ski Teacher ISIA
Level 3 = International Ski Teacher Diploma
Canada
CSIA I (CASI) = Trainee Instructor
CSIA II (CASI) = Instructor
CSIA III = Ski Teacher ISIA
CSIA IV = International Ski Teacher Diploma
USA
PSIA Level 1 = Trainee
PSIA Level 2 = Instructor
PSIA Level 3 = Ski Teacher ISIA
France
1st Cycle
2nd Cycle = Instructor
3rd Cylce = Ski Teacher ISIA
National = International Ski Teacher Diploma
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You know it makes sense.
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well, if they want to change it around to fit in with everyone else, they should just do it, and not faff around with "levels" and "grades" and so on.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| Should I now consider doing the new Level 1 course on plastic/indoors this summer or autumn, then going for the Level 2 assessment during the winter? |
I would say you are far better to do it in the Alps. You will get far more out of the course from a personal performance point of view which will help on the 2 week assessment.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Had a reply from SSE. At present the SSE ASSI & CI qualifications will still be valid and running as normal, until an agreement between BASI & SSE has been finalised. I would imagine that to mean some sort of equivilence course, as SSE do not use the BASI central theme.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Spyderman, Cant see how there will be an equivalence course for ASSI as BASI is stopping exemptions so quickly in May 2008. My guess is that SSE will carry on with the CI and still offer the ASSI for peeps who dont need an on snow license. I wonder if that is one of the reasons SSE voted against the snowsports modernisation programme as reported in the BASI news.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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skimottaret,
I have had it confirmed from SSE that at present the CI & ASSI will continue, but, and a very big but, they do not want to promote competition between SSE ASSI & BASI Level 1.
It is obvious from that, that there are plans afoot for some sort of equivilence and merging of the 2 qualifications.
They have said that an anouncement would be made as soon as any changes are made.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Statement From Snowsport England Regarding BASI News
All organisations within the British Snowsports community recognise the need for close co-operation and co-ordination of activities. In order to further these relationships discussions have been held between the partner organisations under the banner of modernisation.
As a result of these discussions a proposal was put to the appropriate organisations in November 2006. Though the proposal was not approved it was felt that the principles of the project, especially the aims to introduce centrally co-ordinated membership and coach award schemes between the Home Nation Governing Bodies were desirable and discussions should continue.
In February 2007 BASI approached Snowsport England (the UK's other internationally recognised awarding body) to progress closer working, and outlined their intention to develop instructing awards specific to artificial ski slopes and coaching awards. Snowsport England recognises that it is not in the interest of the sport for organisations to compete with each other in promoting awards and informal discussions have been held between SSE and BASI in this regard.
The latest issue of BASI News has been brought to our attention. As a result of the contents of this publication we believe that it is important to clarify the position regarding the discussions and negotiations between all of the UK awarding bodies.
Ø As yet have been no changes to the Snowsport England Coach Award Scheme as a result of these discussions.
Ø Snowsport England has made no agreement to cease or change our current award scheme.
Ø Snowsport England has not received any letter or indeed any indication that recognition of our ASSI as an exemption for the BASI foundation course will cease.
Ø Snowsport England has agreed to provide nominated technical personnel to assist and drive forward the process.
Ø Snowsport England has requested the proposed terms of any working agreement between themselves and BASI, these are yet to be received.
Snowsport England will continue to work with BASI and the other Home Nations to seek a resolution which is best for the membership and the sport, however until such time where negotiations have reached a point where formal proposals are available, we will continue to operate as we currently are, and continue supporting our members and slopes. Snowsport England membership will receive factual and up to date information as and when it becomes available.
If you have any queries please email info (at) snowsportengland.org.uk
Trish Chalk
Chief Executive
Posted on Snowheads by Stewart Smith - Snowsport England Chairman
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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escmatters, thanks for posting that.
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Ø Snowsport England has not received any letter or indeed any indication that recognition of our ASSI as an exemption for the BASI foundation course will cease.
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it is a bit odd that BASI would state in their members newsletter that ASSI exemptions will cease for courses taken after July 07 without notifying SSE formally of their intentions before publication. Are the two organisations collaborating effectively?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Good grief!! Why the hell can't these organisations sort out this confusing mess. It's not rocket science, surely? Sounds like people putting their own territoriality first, and common sense a very distant second.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Hemel Ski Centre in association with BASI have decided to run an initial set of 2 BASI Level 1 Instructor courses.
The first will be Wed 26th September through to Sun 30th September.
The second will be Sat 10th November through to Wed 14th November.
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Spyderman, Can I teach skiing in France if I do this course
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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boredsurfin, Noooooooo
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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boredsurfin, ouch my head still hurts trying to figure that out and it still is not clear. 
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You know it makes sense.
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boredsurfin, dont let easiski hear you say that...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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skimottaret, See the small print
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Poster: A snowHead
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Spyderman, can you PM me details of your course as and when as a guy at brentwood was talking about doing foundation or ASSI and couldnt make up his mind....
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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boredsurfin, yeah but i also noticed you edited the small print 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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jonesa, welcome to snowHeads. Thanks for the link to the SSE website.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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jonesa, Welcome to snowHeads.
I noticed today that escmatters, was viewing 'The Piste' section, but failed to make a further posting on this matter, in respect to my questions, in response to their Statement.
BASI have clearly made a decision to proceed with their own award and have already organised 2 courses at my home slope.
There is clearly either a total lack of communication, misunderstanding, incompetance or a mixture of the 3, between SSE & BASI.
As I stated earlier, this will result in the demise of the ASSI system as provided by SSE & SSS, as without an agreement with BASI, with regard to exemptions, the ASSI has no career progression.
Can you see anyone following the SSE system to a dead end, when you can have the BASI one for the same price?
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All very unsatisfactory I agree. Being a member of both organisations I would like to get to the bottom of it rather than take sides at this stage, although I have a shrewed idea where the main problem lies.
I doubt that a BASI ASSI will come at the same price as a SSE ASSI.
Bear in mind that many people do not wish to progress beyond ASSI, if they are working on a voluntary basis or for only a few hours a week to suplement a main career. The BASI route has always been the way forward for anyone seeking a career in the ski industry, without necessarily getting involved with artificial slopes. All that is needed is a smooth transitional arrangement for those who, having experienced working at an artificial centre, wish to make a career change towards skiing as a career rather than a hobby or sideline business.
BASI is about looking after the professional interests of ski and snowboard instructors; SSE is about serving the needs of individual skiers and boarders at all levels.
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jonesa, I am a member of BASI, SSS & CSIA. I was a member of SSE until 2 years ago.
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BASI is about looking after the professional interests of ski and snowboard instructors; SSE is about serving the needs of individual skiers and boarders at all levels.
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SSE has not served me very well over the last few years, conflicting information, different stories depending on who you speak to when I need information. So much so that I gave up on them.
Don't get me wrong BASI is far from perfect, the website for instance is terrible, but we're told that is being relaunched in the Autumn.
THey should all take a leaf out of the CSIA book. Over 30,000 members, everyone is well informed, no confusion, well run and totally professional.
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I doubt that a BASI ASSI will come at the same price as a SSE ASSI.
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Although not totally fixed in terms of price yet, the Hemel BASI Level 1, 5 day course, is going to be about £300. which is pretty much the same as SSS ASSI.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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david@mediacopy, APC level 2 also qualifies for the IVSI licence.
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FAQ
