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Skis - buy from shop in UK or mail order from overseas?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Re the Recon/Karma thread http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=22662 and the price difference between buying from somewhere like Sport Conrad and a UK outlet sort of got me thinking. When I was looking for my Magfire 10s I saw them listed on ebay by another German supplier at about £280 incl bindings + shipping (just over £300 all in), but they were out of stock of the 168. So I did some web arousing and found Filarinskis had them for £340 (£40 off usual price) + courier, and decided to buy from them. OK so they've cost me £50 more, BUT it's been really goor being able to speak to the guys on the phone, if I've got any problems I'm sure it'll be easy to get help from them, and I feel I've done my bit to help someone over here instead of sending my money to a warehouse in Germany. However, if the price difference had been much more then I would have bought mail order from Germany.

I did look into buying from the US due to the good exchange rate - but that would have worked out more expensive than buying here by the time freight added, and possible the dreaded import taxes.

Just wondering really what you guys do. Do you prefer to buy in UK or mail order from overseas? What sort of price difference makes you go one way or the other? Have any of you had problems buying by mail order from overseas?



.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Until my current pair of skis, I've always bought in resort. Spent a week testing skis, and then had my rental deducted from the price of the sale.

The ones I have at the moment were bought from Decathlon....nowhere else came near to them on price.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
No problem buying on the net from either Sport Conrad, Telemark Pyrenees or Ski Bilek. I can recommend all three.
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I've bought three pairs of skis from Ski Bilek. No problems at all: good service, great prices and quick delivery.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
rob@rar, a bit off topic but are your B5's still for sale as I know someone who might be interested?
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petemillis, I give up! Anyone want to buy a pair of blue ski boots in size 27? Evil or Very Mad
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
spyderjon wrote:
rob@rar, a bit off topic but are your B5's still for sale as I know someone who might be interested?

No, I sold them before Christmas.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
petemillis, I bought skis+bindings from ski-bilek/skiprofis on ebay. Including delivery, a currency conversion penalty of around 3%, a paypal usage surcharge of 4% and German vat at 19%, it still worked out at less than half the UK price. At that sort of discount, it's difficult to justify buying in the UK.
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, I'm at size 27 ...... what shade of blue?? Very Happy
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mistermouse, don't buy them i got soemthat are red ....much faster Toofy Grin
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
I buy skis from the cheapest source possible. Simple as that. But it's not always overseas. I bought my last pair from Lockwoods in the UK when they were selling off last year's stock. They were cheaper than all the on-line retailers, but I was very lucky they happened to have the ski I wanted in the right length. I also bought my wife's skis from Devon Ski Centre (through their website), again because the skis in their sale were priced competitively.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
One day soon, we'll have to stop selling skis due to internet competition, then, who are you going to ask to find out which ski to buy?
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
SMALLZOOKEEPER,

Custom fit skis ? wink Cool
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
SMALLZOOKEEPER wrote:
One day soon, we'll have to stop selling skis due to internet competition, then, who are you going to ask to find out which ski to buy?


Forums like this?
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I always feel guilty when researching stuff and picking people's brain...and their expertise, and then going to the cheapest... at least give the 'expert' a chance to quote and then let them know what they are up against.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
JT wrote:
I always feel guilty when researching stuff and picking people's brain...and their expertise, and then going to the cheapest... at least give the 'expert' a chance to quote and then let them know what they are up against.


Well I wouldn't go in the shop, spend ages chatting to the expert and then buy cheaper on-line. But I don't have a problem carrying out my own internet research and then buying on-line. Obviously I wouldn't use this approach for boots or anything else requiring a custom fit, but skis can almost be considered consumables.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Agree with above-I think it depends on the price of the discount. I relied on reviews on here on the Fischer RX8 and bought from Ski bielk for circa £220. Cheapest price int he UK was £370. didn't speak to a UK ski shop so didn't take up sales time. Local ski shop gets the ski servicing. If the online discount was only £20 I would have bought in the UK
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
dan100, yeah, that's about where I am too. Advice from a shop (about skis) isn't worth a 68% increase in price.
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Does the Zoo have an online shop?
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
cant buy performance skiboards in the uk or in resort, so its usa based websites for me.
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uktrailmonster, absolutely, do you really want to pay +40 to 60% to have some UK shop assistant tell you the xyz skis you looked at are "awesome"?

I am happy to pay more for the privledge to demo skis at say an Ellis B day or get advice on hard to find skis but for your average recreational skier skis are consumables and not custom fit items and can be researched and bought on line.

That said i bought my skis at S&R after getting very good service from the manager on other lower value items and felt i owed him my loyalty because he helped me on items that needed knowledgable input.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
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and to continue my rant go to any pro shop at any golf club in the UK, do you see racks of clubs in the shops anymore. no everyone goes to the discount centres or buys online. The pro shops sell consumables and items that need custom fitting, i am afraid there is little market for small local operators trying to sell consumable type itmes any more.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Bought 2 pairs from Germany this season.

I got my advice from here and/or mags by doing my own research.

Perfectly quick service at less than half the price of UK outlets.

I buy most things from the net, except food shopping. Certainly all large ticket items.

If people want to go into shops and buy things for twice the price I pay, good luck to them - but its not for me.
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I too have bought two pairs of skis from Germany - and have to say I was over-the-moon with the price/service.

On both occasions, not only were the skis about 30-40% cheaper than I would have paid in the UK - but they were also delivered quicker than any of the UK websites could offer.

It's a shame really - I'd much rather give my custom to independent UK shops, but when you looking at savings into the £100's, what can you do?
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I bought my Salomon Equipe SC's and bindings from Ski-Bilek in Germany, and they are great. You get a tracking number to show where in europe the package is on the internet, and it only takes a few days to get to England. The price I paid for skis, that at the time were over £700 in S&R? About 350 euros! Bargain! Laughing
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professorpool, jonflat2, iblair, Evil or Very Mad
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
SMALLZOOKEEPER, thats telling em Puzzled
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
SMALLZOOKEEPER, Now , now , you're upsetting the animals ! Let's not throw the Goldfish out with the bath water. snowHead

Let's start with ski boots.
I would argue that it is counter-intuitive for the casual leisure skier to see the value in custom-fitted ski boots. We are so accustomed to buying off-the-shelf footwear that the undoubted value of folks like yourself and CEM is just not readily appparent. It cost me about £800 to learn that lesson - and most of that was wasted on folks who purported to be as knowledgeable as you!

Skis

Why shouldn't we see them as commodities? What customising is genuinely required? Manufacturers and distributors apply their own lurid narratives - honed in inconsistency while blatantly targeting broad sections of the market. These descriptions are further confused by 'Tester Comments' from experts/panels and others which help not one jot ( eg S&R).
I accept that there is value in talking to distributors - but you have said yourself that at the end of the day you can only sell what people want, and you are faced with gaining enough trust to circumvent all the other twaddle written about skis. I'm so confused by it all I wouuld rather trust stuff written here on snowHeads !! I take the argument about testing before buying but while the manufacturers continue to enable and enforce multiple channel distributors without spelling out the value of not buying 'untested and unseen' then surely the fault lies with them not the buyers?

PS _ If you can't beat the internet why not knock down the zoo's walls and join them? Some of the most successful distributors are those who have been anti-disintermediation in the travel world ! Two-tier service Chamonix for those who appreciate personal service and the net for the great unwashed ( sorry I meant 'valued customers'!) snowHead snowHead

PPS - I need some adjustments to my nice new blue boots you sold me , can I please come and see you ? Embarassed
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Don't get me wrong, in an ideal world I would much, much prefer to make use of independent specialist retailers. I'd also much prefer to do my shopping face-to-face, rather than plugging my details into an internet site.
However, in reality, buying from abroad meant that I could afford that extra week skiing last year.

As a matter of interest, why is it that German shops can such low prices in comparison to the UK. With the Pound being so strong, I would have thought that this would have a positive effect on UK prices? Or am I being Niaive?
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
jonflat2, No body knows! The manufacturers deny selling them to the Sites cheaply! In some cases, they are selling skis and bindings, cheaper than i can buy the skis! One reason maybe that they are buying seconds or skis that they were unable to match. But again we get no replies from the manufacturers. The sad truth is, i may have to stop selling skis in the next few years. Testing skis as we do is hyper important to uncover the realities of a said ski, without this knowledge i struggle to understand how people will be able to choose the right ski. Where will you test them, if you can only buy them from a site in germany, who will steer you off the marketting track? I read lots of ski reviews on web sites and often, the understanding of the product is lost. Please, buy your skis as you feel fit, but just remember that in the future, when you buy your next pair of skis, who will be there to advise you? No one!
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
SMALLZOOKEEPER, you're probably right.

Unfortunately, from a consumer's point of view it's often a choice between getting good advice, or buying a ski that still allows you to afford that ski holiday to actually use 'em!
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
SMALLZOOKEEPER, I also don't understand how some of the German internet shops can sell the skis so cheap. The prices often look like they are lower than the dealer rates, in which case there is no hope of a ski shop being able to compete. I know in the short term that cheap prices are good for the consumer, but longer term when all the proper shops have gone bust what's going to happen then? Why are the manufacturers supplying them so cheap to the likes of Bilek and Conrad? If the issue is big enough from a financial point of view, which I'm sure it is, then perhaps the European monopolies commision or whatever should look into it.
Personally, I like the possibility that they cheap ones might be seconds that have got manufacturing faults and are taken from the skip outside the factories as that would sort of justify me spending more over here. I wonder if they are more likely to be bankrupt stock or something? I know there's the Ski Liquidator in the US who sells stuff cheap(ish) - still a lot more than Bilek and Conrad though. I was also surprised at how higher the prices in the US are. I wondered about buying from their mail order, but the US dollar price was just as expensive as the UK pound price even with the exchange rate as it is at the moment.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
petemillis, The skis are often available a year ahead of release, i know Volkl skis will be available at a certain dealer in Feb'. I have no idea where the skis come from, nor do many of the manufacturers. It's all a little odd, those manufacturers that acknowledge, supplying these out lets claim the skis are being sold cheaper than they are supplying them. Puzzled
You have highlighted all my concearns above and the only way forward that i can see, is that the Manufacturers sell their skis on the net direct, the'll double their margins! They will however need a test center in every resort, otherwise everyone willbe buying blind. It seems the only people to suffer here are us the retailers; we buy up half the stock, store it, pay for it and after that, the Manufacturers are laughing, or so i would be! I needs sorting and is something i will have to put on the agenda at ISPO. Looks like for a third year running i'll be winning, "Most Popular at the Show" award. Toofy Grin
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This issue is obviously affecting other retail sectors too. In some sectors (eg. specialist hi-fi) certain manufacturers have agreed only to supply retailers with high street outlets at their standard trade prices. Internet retailers have to pay a premium for their stock to bring retail prices back in line. In some cases, they will not even supply internet retailers at all. But this has only happened because one of the big national high street chains threatened not to stock their products unless they conformed! They had enough buying power to make it stick, but only just and not without a fight which is still raging. In the UK, only the likes of EB and S&R are perhaps big enough to make demands of this nature.

How many skis do the likes of Conrad and Bilek sell? Probably many many more than a typical shop. So they must be getting huge trade discounts, it's as simple as that. The seconds thing is just wishful thinking. Chain Reaction do the same thing in mountain biking. Their new warehouse is huuuuuge. A small independent high street specialist is screwed against these giants.

SMALLZOOKEEPER, just be thankful boots need so much personal attention. At least you'll be able to sell something in future!!
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
My ski buying procedure:-

Read a few mags
Read the manufacturers BS
Read all the internet reviews
Ask the forums opinion
Make a shortlist
Try to demo if possible (usually a waste of time at the MK snowdome)
Search for the cheapest deal from the final shortlist (there's usually one or two that are available loads cheaper to swing the decision)

Of course it would be better to demo skis properly in resort and choose the best at the end, but that's not how I like to spend my holiday.
There are so many great skis now, it's quite hard to end up with a total lemon.
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uktrailmonster, this pretty much matches my method.

Something else to consider, is whether the average recreational skier (like me) actually notices much of a difference between comparable skis from different manufacturers? And if we did, would a slightly inferior ski choice make a big difference to my enjoyment on the snow?

It's very easy to agonise too much over a ski purchase (I know I've done it) - rather than just getting out there and sliding down a few slopes!
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
SMALLZOOKEEPER wrote:
jonflat2Please, buy your skis as you feel fit, but just remember that in the future, when you buy your next pair of skis, who will be there to advise you? No one!

Same place I did this year Wink
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
uktrailmonster wrote:
My ski buying procedure:-

Read a few mags
Read the manufacturers BS
Read all the internet reviews
Ask the forums opinion
Make a shortlist
Try to demo if possible (usually a waste of time at the MK snowdome)
Search for the cheapest deal from the final shortlist (there's usually one or two that are available loads cheaper to swing the decision)

Of course it would be better to demo skis properly in resort and choose the best at the end, but that's not how I like to spend my holiday.
There are so many great skis now, it's quite hard to end up with a total lemon.


Agree with all of that 100%!
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I bought my wife a set of Rossy Passion 1's for 130 euros. 32 euros delivery.

I bought these as they were top of the list in a survey in Daily Mail Ski and Snowboard for intermediate skis. They were also rated for a, quote, timid skiier.

That's barely a oner all in. If that purchase doesnt work out well hey!

So what?

But this is the thing, as someone else rightly pointed out, cuttign down on costs by booking SC direct with the resort and cutting down on equipment purchases and saving everywhere I can - means by the end of the season, my family of 4 will have had 3x ski trips.

Lastly, the only piece of equipment i have bought recently face to face were my boots..
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professorpool wrote:

Lastly, the only piece of equipment i have bought recently face to face were my boots..


Me too and clothing
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