 Poster: A snowHead
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Think I may have mentioned this before, but am still committed to trying it out. Got down to -2 last night so am hoping for colder temps to give it a go.
Anyone tried it?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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johnboy, nice plan i may have a pop at that myself.. i commend your childish 'idea generation' 
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There is absolutely no reason why this wholly scientific idea will not work. It's physics, after all.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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is it as simple as waiting until it is cold enough and firing it in the air? Or is there more to it than that?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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It might not be quite cold enough without additives or a really big pressure drop.
Now if you could get a water butt and put some detergent in it... or something similar?
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could i spray it over my neighbours car and leave it covered in 1/2 an inch of rock hard ice?
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Good luck. I'm not 100% confident, 'though. I think that snow cannons fire compressed air and water, whereas, SFAIK, pressure washers fires only water. I doubt that the water will atomise properly or that the temp drop will be sufficient to make snow in the absence of compressed air. If you have a compressor about the place which you could hook up to the pressure washer, you'd have a better chance. Still, if it's cold enough and the washer can produce fine enough particles, it might be a runner; I seem to remember reading of snow cannons which didn't need compressed air.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Might be quicker to turn your freezer wholly over to making ice cubes, and then crushing them. Desperate times...
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johnboy, Dry run in your freezer first?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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stoatsbrother, thats not gonna be the driest of dry runs but i like your style
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I think getting the pressure washer up high so the water droplets have a long way to fall before they hit the ground may also help
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Might it be more of a snow pop-gun, than snow cannon? 
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Yes I posted about this too the other day -
http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=21615
I was chatting to guys at work yesterday about it in fact! HIGHLY tempted to give it a try
Guess it would need to be very cold in order to work, and as much time spent in the air as possible
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Poster: A snowHead
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it does work if a fine enough spray .. and cold enough ...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Got down to -2 last night. Still not cold enough. Probably need a good -6 to have a fighting chance
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| johnboy wrote: |
| Got down to -2 last night. Still not cold enough. Probably need a good -6 to have a fighting chance |
I know someone who tried this before. It was -5c. They climbed a tree and sprayed it from 15ft up. It did not work. I am not sure of the science, but uncompressed water droplets might need to fall dozens, if not hundreds, of feet to morph into snow crystals before they hit the ground.
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Perhaps it would work later in winter when the water supply is even colder.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Whitegold, slight physics problem there, water droplets don't compress.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I suspect that in the absence of a cooling effect from expansion of compressed air you need very low temps or a very, very fine mist of water, or both; naturally occuring ice fog (frozen water droplets) apparently requires about -35C to form! A very long fall would help.
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I don't give it any chance at all. Just possibly at -50 it might if you ignore the hose, but it would freeze solid in the pipe long before it got going unless the hose was phenomenally well lagged.
With droplets you would get small hail-stones not snow anyway.
(I'm prepared to bet anyone who thinks otherwise £100 it won't work)
But you could make an ice rink if it got a bit colder.
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snowball, with you all the way. Isn't small hail stones what snow cannons make anyway? Thats certainly what they felt like when I face planted into some at about 100 mph a few years ago and defoliated the left side of my face.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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snowball, not a snowball's chance in hell, eh?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I have now registered on the snowguns forum , and the FAQs and thread for newbies makes it pretty clear that without compressed air, you need a water pressure of about 500 psi (achievable with a pressure washer however and a temperature of -5F - ie about -20C).
To quote what they say about using pressure washers and no air compressor "Without saying it's impossible... It's not happening for home snowmaking at this stage of the game.
But if you feel you can do it, go for it and share what you learn. All it takes is one person to have just a slightly different idea to make it work sometimes"
The site is fascinating however and it looks as though with a cheap air compressor you could have fun. Having a water pressure high enough would stop it working for me where I live, unless I used a water pump as well, and there seem to be quite a few tales about what happens if you get your one-way valves wrong, or don't have one, and get water in your compressor or blast air into your water system.
I think my facetious "test your pressure washer in the freezer" solution might work though... any volunteers to try this 3 food shopping days before Xmas?
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Wed 20-12-06 15:52; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Tim , nice link, nice videos... I am tempted...
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You know it makes sense.
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Winterhighland, good - that sounds much more hopeful, now how do we optimise a pressure washer...? Could we use a fan/pressure washer combo?
The snowguns forum is really... weird and obsessive. some really great fan gun home builds. Does anyone do this stuff in the UK?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Not sure, possible that firing a pressure washer through a fan might further smash the water droplets? However in fan guns the aim of the fan is to create the air pressure without the need for a compressed air feed.
Air compressors and operating them are going to be the biggest costs in a high pressure snowmaking system, which is why a lot of resorts have combinations of kit. The high pressure air/water guns allow snow to made in more marginal conditions, low energy air/water guns can produce as much as 5 times the snow volume for a given unit of electricity. If water supply isn't a problem then fan guns may allow you to utilise more water than you have air for air/water guns, indeed some ski areas will have high pressure systems and low energy / fan guns, so that when conditions are more suitable for snowmaking they can switch the effort to the less costly option of the fan guns or modern low energy air/water guns.
Capital costs are also an issue - a ratnik high pressure gun costs about $2500, fan guns can cost $30,000. In terms of putting the infrastructure you still need to lay water mains, the actual cost of putting in a second pipe for air is minimal - the cost is in digging the hole in the first place, but the air compressor side of things also costs lots of £££££s.
Sorry going way off topic I know as this is about home snow making. If anyone knows all the answers to snowmaking and the various options, answers on a postcard to CML, CairnGorm Mountain, Aviemore, PH22 1RB! 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I love this thread, just wanted to post in it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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All the would-be snow cannon operators might be interested in this:
http://science.howstuffworks.com/snow-maker.htm
the main info is contained in the first 5 pages. Shows that there's a bit more to it than you might think. Very interesting tho.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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im sure in the last big freeze a few years back in scotland.. a presenter threw water in the air next to a frozen river and it had frozen before it hit the ice.. a good pressure washer can generate a really fine mist.. if we get a minus 5 down my way in definetly giving it a go.. if i can be bothered to get our of bed/the pub
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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As much as I'd love this to work I have doubts; When I was at achool I hgad a Saturday job washing cars, we used high pressure jest (~2500 psi) and even on cold days (-4ish) nothing resembling snow came out of them. OTOH the ground turned into an icy death trap.
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I assumed pressure would be the important thing (and didn't realize pressure washers could make so much). But to compress and immediately decompress would not be much use. Compressing heats the material - then it has to have time to cool again (or be cooled): and then releasing the pressure reduces the temperature the same amount.
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snowball, water pressure is only important in so far as it makes it easier (I think) to make a fine mist, SFAICS, since liquids are essentially incompressible. It's compressed air that 's important in most snow makers; the release of pressure drops the temperature, as well no doubt as encouraging misting of the water. Without compresed air, we rely on the ambient temp or some other form of cooling to cool the water. Am I missing something?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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yeah but you can set a pressure washer to lose the 'power' and create a really fine spray.. sure the quantity will be garbage but think of the quality .. 0.005 mm of prime powder over er 2 sq feet
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The Americans do seem to have a range of ready-to-use small snow machines available. I wonder if it might be a cool thing to get to do the front lawn next xmas to go with the lights outside... always looking for ways of appalling the neighbours. I wonder if there are any uk stockists....? CBA to build one myself...
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