 Poster: A snowHead
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I have an especially nervous disposition on narrow paths when its steeper than when you merely pole, but also when people wizz passed me. Its a hangover from boarding days I think when going straight and fast often ended in tipping A over T. I still feel the need to do turns rather than go straight.
Help please!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Peter Leuzzi, If the path is really narrow (like our Chemin de Demoiselles, around 2-3m I suppose), and you don't like the idea of going fast then the only choice is to plough. If you make shallow "veerings" from edge to edge you will go faster than if you go straight down. If it's just the edge that worries you and you're alarmed on wider paths, then that's another matter, and knowledge of the path helps: where is there a stopping place? How fast would you be going when you get to the stopping place if you go straight or edge roll the
skis? Best to ski such a path when no-one else does to help with the confidence. Our Chemin is lovely and quiet in the morning - but when everyone's going down for lunch or last thing - oh boy!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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easiski, thanks for that. Knew you'd pipe up! What do you mean by "veerings"?
I shudder at the thought of mass exodus time at lunch or at days end. All I can hear is this little voice over and over saying " Most accidents occur on the final descent blah blah blah..." Can you make the voice go away? Also, can you forward next weeks winning lottery numbers?
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Peter Leuzzi, I mean you don't actually turn across the hill (the Chemin is too narrow for this), but change edges and veer from side to side in a gentle arc. You see if you think of turning you will almost certainly try to turn and end up too much across the hill, and therefore in danger of going either into the bank or off the edge. therefore you have to NOT think about turning and only about "veering gently" - I find this works, but you do get up some serious speed on some paths. 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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easiski, i find going into sideslip mode where possible takes off speed
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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easiski, I think I understand. So, your skis are pointing at around 45 degrees to directly straight down, alternating from ski to ski? By edging you are actually tempering speed.
riverman, tried that and work with that method -sideslipping and then straightening up to pick up speed again and then almost hockey stopping to slow down again. Problem I find with that is I am then stuck favouring one side/leg the whole way down and get incredibly sore/tired on one leg.
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| Quote: |
Problem I find with that is I am then stuck favouring one side/leg the whole way down and get incredibly sore/tired on one leg.
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I used to find the same thing, and tried to practice on the weaker leg on nice safe wide things, just going down well within one piste basher track, till I felt comfortable either way. Makes a big difference. But I still don't like narrow paths!
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doh
Last edited by After all it is free  on Sun 12-11-06 21:20; edited 1 time in total
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The best advice I can offer is to say be solid and predictable in your movements. If you keep a rhythm of this sort then you can pretty much trust faster skiers & boarders to be able to get past you. Fear of being clipped from behind is probably the worst feeling.
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doh
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads on Sun 12-11-06 21:21; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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fatbob, you obviously feel very strong about this advice! Jokes aside, thanks for that. I try and do that as much as I can.
pam w, but then you waste the nice, wide safe things! good advide though. Going to MK next week so will give it a go. No nice, safe wide things there, thats for sure
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Pathways with drops at one side - they scare the willies out of me, guaranteed to get me ploughing again. I even end up bottling out of turning on my 'weaker' side and end up repeatedly taking all the speed off on one side only, which probably serves to make me even more of an obstacle on the path! Not sure there's anything I can do apart from being more confident.
| Peter Leuzzi wrote: |
| riverman, tried that and work with that method -sideslipping and then straightening up to pick up speed again and then almost hockey stopping to slow down again. Problem I find with that is I am then stuck favouring one side/leg the whole way down and get incredibly sore/tired on one leg. |
In fact, more or less like that!
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Jerry,
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Pathways with drops at one side - they scare the willies out of me, guaranteed to get me ploughing again. I even end up bottling out of turning on my 'weaker' side and end up repeatedly taking all the speed off on one side only, which probably serves to make me even more of an obstacle on the path! Not sure there's anything I can do apart from being more confident.
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Wait till you see the one alongside the tunnel of the Gornergrat railway in Zermatt 
I must admit, I hated paths myself until I was told to keep doing short swing turns all the way down, stops yer legs getting knackered and controls your speed.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Charlatanefc wrote: |
Jerry,
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Pathways with drops at one side - they scare the willies out of me, guaranteed to get me ploughing again. I even end up bottling out of turning on my 'weaker' side and end up repeatedly taking all the speed off on one side only, which probably serves to make me even more of an obstacle on the path! Not sure there's anything I can do apart from being more confident.
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Wait till you see the one alongside the tunnel of the Gornergrat railway in Zermatt
I must admit, I hated paths myself until I was told to keep doing short swing turns all the way down, stops yer legs getting knackered and controls your speed. |
Got to admit, that one's pretty special.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Give me a nice snowy drop off to the side anytime. Wooden fences now, that's a whole different kettle of balls 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Tuck. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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veeeight, no-one likes a showoff 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Lol! Trust me on this one, it's the safest tactic to employ!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Peter Leuzzi wrote: |
| easiski, I think I understand. So, your skis are pointing at around 45 degrees to directly straight down, alternating from ski to ski? By edging you are actually tempering speed. |
Well yes to the max 45 deg, but by edging you're actually gaining speed which was why I counselled against it. It's a really good system if you're not afraid to go fast. Do NOT sideslip if the path is narrow - you'll end up in the bank. Our banks have bl**dy great rocks in them! I honestly don't think there's anything wrong with ploughing if you're nervous. It's a good exercise, if you have to do it for a long time (obviously gliding plough, not braking plough) then if you're not on the balls of your feet you'll get very sore legs and possibly hips too. If you're nicely balanced you'll find a) more braking power without trying and b) it's a good exercise for fore/aft balance.
I know it's very hard to ignore the peeps rushing up behind you and/or screetching past you, but you have to focus on you and what you're doing and try to shut them out. If the edge bothers you then go slowly up to it and stand at the edge and look down - that's tough to do too, but you'll probably find it's a skiable slope. If so then all you'll get from going over will be a fright - not broken bones. Obviously I can only speak for here, but is there's serious risk of injury there'll be a fence to stop you going over. (Of course Yoda has a major issure with fences - different story!)
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
if you're not on the balls of your feet you'll get very sore legs and possibly hips too. If you're nicely balanced you'll find a) more braking power without trying and b) it's a good exercise for fore/aft balance.
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I learnt this to my cost, a while ago. Like lots of skiers I don't snowplough very often, but thought I was good enough at it. However I learnt otherwise when doing a week's cross country lessons. With very long, very narrow, skis with no edges 100% perfect snowplough technique is essential if you are going to control your descents successfully. I was useless, and it certainly made my legs and hips ache. The instructor spotted at once what I was doing wrong (potty crouch, I could feel it myself!) but I found it very difficult to put into practice what he was telling me, no doubt because of years of doing it wrong, or hardly doing it at all. I have tried since to practice snowploughs consciously, on my downhill skis, and now understand what was going wrong and am working to correct it. It is worth noting that although many skiers who fancy themselves rather good hardly ever snowplough you quite often see ESF and other instructors at it, for example easing themselves downhill into a lift queue (with the punters doing flashy hockey stops and showering the rest of us with snow).
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nothing wrong with the good old snow plough, I've used it many times, and will continue to do so on very narrow paths, where you cannot do anything apart from snow plough or tuck!!
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I have learnt, the hard way, that it is sometimes dangerous to make turns right up to the edge. Leave space for the fast traffic, then you don't have to worry if they can stop. Many of them are out of control.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Mmm, Julian (my hubby) hates them. Quite a while ago now, Julian bought his first pair of skis. It was our first ever trip to Monetier-les-Bains, and we were at the top of the Balme chair, about to ski on the road that leads down to the Cucumelle chair. Jules went in front, kids in the middle, me at the back. All I saw was the bottom of a pair of Rossignol Bandit XX disappearing over the edge, between the Cucumell and Crie de Loup pistes. He was so busy making sure the kids were crossing safely that he forgot to look where he was going. Once the kids and I had stopped laughin, we did check he was OK. Never got over to monetier that day though, as we had to ski down the Cucumell to meet him at the bottom.
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I agree with Pete, "shallow veerings do the trick. Though, I use to have a similar hang up, especially when it was crowded, my concern was more to do with ending up out of control and hitting someone. I think my veerings were more a case of panic very short and sharp turns with plenty of edge. But they did the trick. I feel a bit more comfortable when dealing with narrow passages.
I started by on the big wide slopes and practiced making very short half turns, with each run I narrowed my corridor. Because I was on a wide slope if I lost it, there was no problem. Give it a try, it worked for me.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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veeeight,
Glanced over my shoulder at my terminal, read this, thought I was in your way and fell off my chair
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Keep your weight forward and commit to your line, carving very shallow turns. You'll be faster than everyone else, but you'll be in control, and well able to avoid any trouble.
easiski taught me that last season. I shan't say what the rather rude and derogatory name we made up for it in the hotel was, but it does make cat tracks a lot more interesting and fun.
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You know it makes sense.
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Kramer, this is fine provided you are confident to make an emergency stop (preferably without veering from your course). Being able to do a powerful snowplough would be the most useful skill to get. Fortunately this i much easier on skis than on a board 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Yorci, Re-read my post with an explanation of the "veerings" - nothing to do with short, sharp (horror) turns at all.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I'm sitting here thinking "Yikes, don't tell me that there are ski pistes with edges and drops off to one side - please!!" I don't mind taking a tobogan down this sort of thing and keeping on the side nearest the mountain, but to do it on ski's.........**!!^&^*** That's what I mean with ski lift's - it's one thing to go up, but when you do it the first time how on earth do you know whether you are capable of coming down!!?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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[quote="pam w"]
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| It is worth noting that although many skiers who fancy themselves rather good hardly ever snowplough you quite often see ESF and other instructors at it |
Ever seen them clearing a World Cup race piste after the race ? (You sometimes catch it over the closing credits if you haven't actually been) Ploughing down a black with a big bundle of gates, a roll of netting or an inflatable barrier dragging them along, or sometimes over one shoulder! Now that must ache after a while!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Helen Beaumont wrote: |
| Mmm, Julian (my hubby) hates them. Quite a while ago now, Julian bought his first pair of skis. It was our first ever trip to Monetier-les-Bains, and we were at the top of the Balme chair, about to ski on the road that leads down to the Cucumelle chair. Jules went in front, kids in the middle, me at the back. All I saw was the bottom of a pair of Rossignol Bandit XX disappearing over the edge, between the Cucumell and Crie de Loup pistes. He was so busy making sure the kids were crossing safely that he forgot to look where he was going. Once the kids and I had stopped laughin, we did check he was OK. Never got over to monetier that day though, as we had to ski down the Cucumell to meet him at the bottom. |
I used to hate that road down to the Cucumelle chair. Regularly has death cookies, often rutted from piste bashers. Ugh!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Megamum wrote: |
| I'm sitting here thinking "Yikes, don't tell me that there are ski pistes with edges and drops off to one side - please!!" I don't mind taking a tobogan down this sort of thing and keeping on the side nearest the mountain, but to do it on ski's.........**!!^&^*** That's what I mean with ski lift's - it's one thing to go up, but when you do it the first time how on earth do you know whether you are capable of coming down!!? |
Don't worry, tracks are graded like other pistes. If there's a nasty drop off, there'll be fences.
Roads/ tracks are a pain for beginners who snowplough down them and, unless they have easiski's technique, end up with blazing quads. They can also be busy, especially ones down the mountain at going home time.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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richmond, anyone who is taught to snowplough properly (or even taught properly) should not have a problem.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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easiski, I'm sure you're right, but I have memories of skiing down what seemed endless roads (Jakobshorn in Davos comes to mind) with flames shooting out of my thighs. I had had very few lessons at that stage of my career. Whether my snowplough technique has improved, I don't know; I still use it sometimes, especially in confined spaces (like a busy road), and I'm very grateful for it. It's the only way I know of slowing down without turning at all.
The tracks I find most tricky are narrow U shaped ones, maybe 1-1.5 m wide, where any ski position other than straight down the track or snowplough seems impossible. I assume that's where your gentle veering comes in, but I think I'd end up going too fast for my comfort. Are the veers carved or skidded? Skidded, presumably, if one wants to keep the speed down.
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richmond, if the path is that narrow it would be very hard to skid - you'd end up over the edge. they would have to be carved and you would be doing warp factor 10!
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So it's snowplough or straight down, then.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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richmond, yes, unless you know there's a handy space for stopping, or you're very confident.
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or you're very confident.
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and can see round bends....
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FAQ
